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Thread: Cudos to Adams County Sheriff web page

  1. #1
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    Cudos to Adams County Sheriff web page

    I found this quote on the Adams County Web page under the FAQ section for obtaining a CHP.

    Do I need a concealed handgun permit?
    By law, you are not required to have a concealed handgun permit to possess a handgun concealed inside your vehicle, your home or your place of business. You may also carry a handgun visibly on your person without a permit in most public places in Colorado. There are exceptions, such as posted areas and government/school buildings, and/or cities with ordinances forbidding that practice.

    This is the first time I have come across open carry being mentioned quite so plainly on a law enforcement web page here in Colorado.

    John

  2. #2
    Regular Member Beau's Avatar
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    It is nice to see. The best part is that after giving the legality they don't give the opinion of what they want you to do by same something like. "OC is not recommended as you could scare people and bad guys will take your gun and shoot you with it.".
    Colorado Gun Owners - COGO
    http://www.ColoradoGunOwners.com

    A discussion forum for Colorado Gun Owners.

    Colorado Firearm law.
    http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/colorado/
    Lexis Nexis: Colorado law pertaining to firearms.
    Title 18, Article 12

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    Regular Member alang's Avatar
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    I'm impressed! I would never have imagined that they would say anything about the legality of open carry without specifically being asked about it.

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    I still do not like the Adams County Sheriff office and Ill tell you why:

    1. They refused to take my online CCW class certification
    2. They made me wait 80 days for my permit when I know they had it done in a couple weeks, but sure enough they waited until they only had a few days left by law to give it to me
    3. Its nice of them to say you can open carry but they could have been more specific and said Denver is the only city that can override state preemption regarding open carry.
    4. They have horrible hours for CCW applications.

  5. #5
    Regular Member M-Taliesin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deserteagle8338 View Post
    I still do not like the Adams County Sheriff office and Ill tell you why:

    1. They refused to take my online CCW class certification
    2. They made me wait 80 days for my permit when I know they had it done in a couple weeks, but sure enough they waited until they only had a few days left by law to give it to me
    3. Its nice of them to say you can open carry but they could have been more specific and said Denver is the only city that can override state preemption regarding open carry.
    4. They have horrible hours for CCW applications.
    Howdy Pard!
    I'm going to play devils advocate here, if you permit.

    1. The Adams County Sheriff dislikes online CCW certification, and I don't think I fault him for his opinion. When it is done online, there is no real way to verify that you actually took it yourself for openers. Then there is the whole quality issue. There are tons of online courses. Some are excellent, others very poor. Some actually give you solid instruction, while others just cash your check and could care less whether you ultimately end up being a responsible and knowledgable firearms carrier. Finally, I personally don't believe that any CCW training (online, classroom, etc) that does not also include range shooting, is worthwhile. I freely admit this is my opinion but it boils down to getting a driver's license without ever demonstrating you know how to drive a car. It doesn't make sense. I know what is required by law, and my opinion is that a responsible carrier will not only know how to handle a firearm safely, not only have a familiarty with the laws in question, but also know how to fire the weapon safely and appropriately. The Adams County Sheriff has always felt that a proficiency with the firearm should include live fire exercises, and I'm in agreement with him on that one. But like I said, that's my opinion, but one I think reasonable.

    2. My wife and I got our CCW permits within 2 or 3 weeks. My pardner (who lived with us at the time) waited something like 80 days. Consider...
    The Sheriff runs a background check through CBI and the FBI. Depending on the number of applications received statewide, it may be been slowed by CBI. Considering the number of applications coming from all over the USA, and it may have been delayed by the FBI. CCW permits ain't their primary role as law enforcement agencies, so they have limited number of people working on background checks, and limited resources for getting them done. In my pardner's case, we learned later on that his was held up because his local law enforcement agenices back in Texas took their sweet time responding to ACSO request for background information. It wasn't Adams County dragging their feet, it was some sheriff in Texas!

    3. The passage on the ACSO website merely says that open carry is lawful. It did not go into every possible exception or prohibition for an obvious reason..... that's part of what your CCW course ought to teach. The ACSO website cannot give legal advice. They are prohibited by law from doing so. Specific legal questions, as any law enforcement agency will attest, must be referred to your own legal counsel.

    4. You'll find that their hours are fairly consistent with other law enforcement agencies throughout the states, in more populous areas. Go to a rural county, they are apt to be more flexible. Adams County is highly urban, and due to budgetary limitations, they need their people working on daily business of handling crime. They simply haven't the resources of manpower or budget to support a more robust CCW application process. Trust me when I say (knowing as I do) they have more fish on their plate than they can clean! Next time you visit the Adams County Sheriff's webpage, check out a link there: "Warrants". Look at the huge number of wanted fugitives they are trying to apprehend. And warrants only covers a small part of their responsibility. They have new crimes happneing every day. A never ending stream of new warrants every single day. A plethora of new fugitives who go into hiding rather than face a judge in court. The whole time they hope to find those fugitives, they are innundated by new ones coming down the pike, 24/7, 365! Throw in everything else, and it becomes mind blowing what all they must cope with. Terrorism (yes the local sheriff must be looking out for evidence of terrorists in our midst), street gangs (which are much more numerous than I ever imagined), traffic, emergency response, search and rescue operations, detectives, drug interdiction team, and about a thousand other tasks coming their way... while at the same time, they are badly understaffed and underfunded!

    All in all, I think they do the best they can while wearing handcuffs slapped on them by the Adams County Commissioners!

    And one reason we have as many violent offenders on our streets today is because the County Commissioners won't support law enforcement with appropriate funding. After all, they need all that money for more important things... like building that massive new county admin office south of Brighton to serve as their own Taj Mahal! Millions for their own ego, a pittance for public safety!

    Blessings,
    M-Taliesin

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by M-Taliesin View Post
    Howdy Pard!
    I'm going to play devils advocate here, if you permit.

    1. The Adams County Sheriff dislikes online CCW certification, and I don't think I fault him for his opinion. When it is done online, there is no real way to verify that you actually took it yourself for openers. Then there is the whole quality issue. There are tons of online courses. Some are excellent, others very poor. Some actually give you solid instruction, while others just cash your check and could care less whether you ultimately end up being a responsible and knowledgable firearms carrier. Finally, I personally don't believe that any CCW training (online, classroom, etc) that does not also include range shooting, is worthwhile. I freely admit this is my opinion but it boils down to getting a driver's license without ever demonstrating you know how to drive a car. It doesn't make sense. I know what is required by law, and my opinion is that a responsible carrier will not only know how to handle a firearm safely, not only have a familiarty with the laws in question, but also know how to fire the weapon safely and appropriately. The Adams County Sheriff has always felt that a proficiency with the firearm should include live fire exercises, and I'm in agreement with him on that one. But like I said, that's my opinion, but one I think reasonable.

    2. My wife and I got our CCW permits within 2 or 3 weeks. My pardner (who lived with us at the time) waited something like 80 days. Consider...
    The Sheriff runs a background check through CBI and the FBI. Depending on the number of applications received statewide, it may be been slowed by CBI. Considering the number of applications coming from all over the USA, and it may have been delayed by the FBI. CCW permits ain't their primary role as law enforcement agencies, so they have limited number of people working on background checks, and limited resources for getting them done. In my pardner's case, we learned later on that his was held up because his local law enforcement agenices back in Texas took their sweet time responding to ACSO request for background information. It wasn't Adams County dragging their feet, it was some sheriff in Texas!

    3. The passage on the ACSO website merely says that open carry is lawful. It did not go into every possible exception or prohibition for an obvious reason..... that's part of what your CCW course ought to teach. The ACSO website cannot give legal advice. They are prohibited by law from doing so. Specific legal questions, as any law enforcement agency will attest, must be referred to your own legal counsel.

    4. You'll find that their hours are fairly consistent with other law enforcement agencies throughout the states, in more populous areas. Go to a rural county, they are apt to be more flexible. Adams County is highly urban, and due to budgetary limitations, they need their people working on daily business of handling crime. They simply haven't the resources of manpower or budget to support a more robust CCW application process. Trust me when I say (knowing as I do) they have more fish on their plate than they can clean! Next time you visit the Adams County Sheriff's webpage, check out a link there: "Warrants". Look at the huge number of wanted fugitives they are trying to apprehend. And warrants only covers a small part of their responsibility. They have new crimes happneing every day. A never ending stream of new warrants every single day. A plethora of new fugitives who go into hiding rather than face a judge in court. The whole time they hope to find those fugitives, they are innundated by new ones coming down the pike, 24/7, 365! Throw in everything else, and it becomes mind blowing what all they must cope with. Terrorism (yes the local sheriff must be looking out for evidence of terrorists in our midst), street gangs (which are much more numerous than I ever imagined), traffic, emergency response, search and rescue operations, detectives, drug interdiction team, and about a thousand other tasks coming their way... while at the same time, they are badly understaffed and underfunded!

    All in all, I think they do the best they can while wearing handcuffs slapped on them by the Adams County Commissioners!

    And one reason we have as many violent offenders on our streets today is because the County Commissioners won't support law enforcement with appropriate funding. After all, they need all that money for more important things... like building that massive new county admin office south of Brighton to serve as their own Taj Mahal! Millions for their own ego, a pittance for public safety!

    Blessings,
    M-Taliesin
    Points taken but I still disagree about them not taking an online class. Nowhere in Colorado law does it say the class has to be quality, or in person. Paraphrasing the law, it says it is up to us to decide what training class we take, and then here comes the sheriff adding his own requirements to the law... Sure it is responsible to take more training, but if the law makers felt it was a big deal, they would have wrote more specific requirements into the law. I took what I felt was reasonable, and was in accordance with the law.

    I also disagree about dismissing the time the application took. If I can get a background check to buy a gun in 10 minutes, why would I need to wait 80 days for a background check to carry one? The only reason could be if they are doing a "super duper" background check that includes interviewing relatives and visiting past teachers and who knows what else, but they dont. They do the background check and then make us wait until the deadline is almost near just so one less person can be carrying a gun for that time. For the money we have to pay them, they should be able to hire somebody to do the check if they are that understaffed. Not to mention the fact that part of their job is to serve. So serving should be just as much a priority as "protecting".

    Heck they could even hire somebody and pay them 8 dollars an hour to do the background checks and still come out with a giant profit off of the $150 fine or whatever it was.
    Last edited by Deserteagle8338; 02-28-2012 at 10:42 PM.

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