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Thread: need help

  1. #1
    Regular Member doughboi's Avatar
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    need help

    So i have questions about having no cpl in Washington. Do i unload before I get in the car or when I'm I
    the car? And do i load in or out the car? When in the car can I have it in my holster.

  2. #2
    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doughboi View Post
    So i have questions about having no cpl in Washington. Do i unload before I get in the car or when I'm I
    the car? And do i load in or out the car? When in the car can I have it in my holster.
    I would say it would be best to best to unload/load in the car. That way people don't see you and freak out.

  3. #3
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    well,,,

    best not to give Opinions instead of correct law..

    9.41.050 tells us that a loaded gun can not be in a car unless you have a CPL...
    the empty gun can stay in the holster, but you can not load untill you get out of the car,
    and you must unload before you get in the car.
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  4. #4
    Regular Member tombrewster421's Avatar
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    It's a good idea to not have a round chambered if you have to do this, since most holsters will allow you to drop the mag without having to remove the firearm. Much less likely to "warrant alarm" that way.
    Guns don't kill people, bullets do!

  5. #5
    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    I understand that. But what's better? Taking a few seconds to load and step out or stepping out un holstering and loading in in front of people. Then you get the cops called for brandishing. Same goes for unloading. Open the door get in and immediately unload. Don't see the big deal there.
    Last edited by SigGuy23; 02-22-2012 at 07:35 PM.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Vitaeus's Avatar
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    RCW 9.41.050
    Carrying firearms.

    (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol

    Do not have a loaded pistol in a vehicle without a valid CPL.

    there is no crime defined as "brandishing" in the WA RCW's

    closest you will get is http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.270 which is the one that gets discussed/argued a bit around here.

    Link to the WA RCW's in general

    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx

    Link to most firearm related RCW's

    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41

    tl,dr version

    Get out and load unload and get in unless you have a valid WA CPL

    No settled case law on a .270 violation, but there was a Yakima? incident which was dismissed as citizen was following the RCW's as above. BigDave or anyone else, do you remember the incident? Fellow outside a bank loading after getting out of his truck?

  7. #7
    Regular Member Freedom First's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SigGuy23 View Post
    I understand that. But what's better? Taking a few seconds to load and step out or stepping out un holstering and loading in in front of people. Then you get the cops called for brandishing. Same goes for unloading. Open the door get in and immediately unload. Don't see the big deal there.
    Your call SigGuy23, but all it takes is one jerkalope with a badge seeing you and then you get to see the inside view from his backseat... I'll pass. Prior to my CPL, I carried with a loaded mag but no round in the chamber and an empty mag carrier for the driving. Lock and load if your gonna be somewhere iffy, otherwise, condition 3. Just my $0.02...
    Freedom can never be lost, only given away by ignorance, by choice, or at the point of a gun. Here in America we can still choose.

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  8. #8
    Regular Member p85-GSXwheelman's Avatar
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    OR.......drop $55.25 and 15 minutes of your time to get a cpl....then mr. Pistola can stay in his home no matter where you go! )

  9. #9
    Regular Member psbart's Avatar
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    if I didn't have a CPL, I would load/unload OUTSIDE of the car. given the research hubby (Vitaeus) has shown me. As it stands, he and I both shelled out the dough to get the CPL's so that we DON'T have to mess with loading/unloading, is it partly concealed, avoiding school, all of that hassles. We both generally OC, but this gives us the option to CC if we wish, and helps to minimize the risk of negligent discharge that can occur with excessive holstering/unholstering of a loaded firearm.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vitaeus View Post
    RCW 9.41.050
    Carrying firearms.

    (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol

    Do not have a loaded pistol in a vehicle without a valid CPL.

    there is no crime defined as "brandishing" in the WA RCW's

    closest you will get is http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.270 which is the one that gets discussed/argued a bit around here.

    Link to the WA RCW's in general

    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx

    Link to most firearm related RCW's

    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41

    tl,dr version

    Get out and load unload and get in unless you have a valid WA CPL

    No settled case law on a .270 violation, but there was a Yakima? incident which was dismissed as citizen was following the RCW's as above. BigDave or anyone else, do you remember the incident? Fellow outside a bank loading after getting out of his truck?
    i can tell you from a common sense law enforcement officer perspective, if you were seen unloading a firearm in a vehicle, and i was called to the scene, and you gave me that explanation (not having a cPL so were carrying openly and then unloading once you got in the car), i would "buy" that explanation and whether or not it was a "technical" violation, it certainly appears you are trying to comply with the SPIRIT of the law and also not trying to create a scene, so i would not have a problem with it AT ALL

    i think reasonable officers would agree.

    what BETTER option is there? unload outside the car ? how you would do this without creating a visual "distraction" that could rise to a level of 9.41.270 is the issue. ESPECIALLY on an urban street. personally, i don't think people should load or unload unless they have a loading barrel or a safe backstop. granted, i am an instructor and i'm pretty strict on safety.

    this kind of thing is the perfect reason why it's a good idea to have a CPL even if you only plan on OCing.

    if i had to unload in the car, i would keep my hands in the trunk AND have my hands hidden from view underneath a towel or something as i unloaded the gun. if you can't unload by feel, you probably shouldn't be handling the thing in the first place.

    the towel trick is one i use on longterm surveillances when i gotta pee. mainly because i don't want some ******* kid with a cell phone camera getting me on video in an unmarked, peeing into a cup.

  11. #11
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Serpa allows most semi-autos to be loaded and unloaded while still holstered.
    Evangelical lessons are provided upon request. Anyone wishing to meet Jesus can just kick in my door.

  12. #12
    Regular Member DCKilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechnoWeenie View Post
    Serpa allows most semi-autos to be loaded and unloaded while still holstered.
    +1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom First View Post
    Your call SigGuy23, but all it takes is one jerkalope with a badge seeing you and then you get to see the inside view from his backseat... I'll pass. Prior to my CPL, I carried with a loaded mag but no round in the chamber and an empty mag carrier for the driving. Lock and load if your gonna be somewhere iffy, otherwise, condition 3. Just my $0.02...
    first of all, in the vast majority of cases, it's citizens calling these things in, not "jackalope " cops viewing them. it's a matter of #'s.

    and people should not be racking slides, etc. with their guns out of their holsters to load/unload in an urban area. it would CERTAINLY get me at least a reprimand if not a suspension if i did it.

    and again, as an instructor, **** like that makes my teeth itch
    Last edited by PALO; 02-23-2012 at 05:46 AM.

  14. #14
    Regular Member FMJ 911's Avatar
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    What about a revolver?
    "May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." — George Patton

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    Quote Originally Posted by FMJ 911 View Post
    What about a revolver?
    if you can rack a slide on a revolver, you are a bad-ass. nuff said.

    but again, with firearms, it's clearly more of an issue to be racking slides and stuff than merely opening the cylinder of a revolver. i realize it's user error, but a fair # of unintentional discharges with semi-autos happen during loading/unloading/slide manipulation. and largely from teevee, etc. but people associate the racking of a slide with an offensive act. we've all seen it in movies and teevee.

    it's hard to discretely outside the car, and doing it discretely could even make it look more suspicious, like something a criminal would do before entering a store to rob it or something

    i just think it's bad form and not a good idea.

  16. #16
    Regular Member FMJ 911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALO View Post
    if you can rack a slide on a revolver, you are a bad-ass. nuff said.

    but again, with firearms, it's clearly more of an issue to be racking slides and stuff than merely opening the cylinder of a revolver. i realize it's user error, but a fair # of unintentional discharges with semi-autos happen during loading/unloading/slide manipulation. and largely from teevee, etc. but people associate the racking of a slide with an offensive act. we've all seen it in movies and teevee.

    it's hard to discretely outside the car, and doing it discretely could even make it look more suspicious, like something a criminal would do before entering a store to rob it or something

    i just think it's bad form and not a good idea.
    That's why I'm heading into Sultan tomorrow morning to get my CPL, so I don't ever have to fiddle with my carry gun while out in public.
    "May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." — George Patton

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by FMJ 911 View Post
    That's why I'm heading into Sultan tomorrow morning to get my CPL, so I don't ever have to fiddle with my carry gun while out in public.
    i think that's a good idea. and it will mean you have even more options.

    if i'm going to fiddle with it in public, it must be because i'm thinking of kate beckinsdale!

    granted, i don't have room to talk. i don't have a CPL
    Last edited by PALO; 02-23-2012 at 06:55 AM.

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Before the state allowed me to enter my vehicle safely (pre CPL) I interpreted the RCW to force me to load/unload outside the vehicle. Is this setting someone up for failure (ND)? I think so. That said, you must deal with the law as it is. You can be discreet when U/R your weapon. No need to upset people.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  19. #19
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    I also have a holster cut so I can depress the mag release without handling the pistol. I guess, in keeping with my personal restriction (on myself) never to clear the holster unless you intend to pull the trigger (or clean it at home), I would have to carry it without one in the pipe.

    I have my CPL so I don't have to worry about it, but I read the law to say you cannot enter the vehicle with it loaded. Your CPL is so easy to obtain here, there is no reason not to get one, and teh load/unload hassel goes away, as does the wait for a new pistol when you want to purchase one.

    Just like when you are hunting, you have to clear the rifle (or shotgun) before placing it is the car., you have to do the same with a pistol if you don't have a CPL.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALO View Post
    if you can rack a slide on a revolver, you are a bad-ass. nuff said.
    Badass or British, one or the other.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Webley-...matic_Revolver

  21. #21
    Regular Member FMJ 911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hermannr View Post
    I guess, in keeping with my personal restriction (on myself) never to clear the holster unless you intend to pull the trigger (or clean it at home)
    Not to go too far off track here, but I was wondering about this.

    I'm out shooting with some friends, and I decide to get in some extra practice with my carry gun, is it improper to carry that same gun in a holster and draw the gun from it(At the place of shooting e.g a "Shooting pit")? Or what if I'm at a Pistol range?

    Still new to OC, I know about it, but I'm still learning!
    "May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." — George Patton

  22. #22
    Regular Member J1MB0B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tombrewster421 View Post
    It's a good idea to not have a round chambered .....
    "Hold on a sec Mr. Badguy, I have to load my weapon before I can defend myself."

    Some people will tell you to carry without a round chambered and only rack one when you are going to an "iffy" place. How do you know where the "iffy" places are? Crime happens in the "good" places too. Why would you intentionally go to the "iffy" places anyway? Whats the point in carrying if you have load your weapon before you can use it?
    I hear all the time that a BG can close the distance of 21 feet in 1.5 seconds. Can you get your gun out of its holster, rack it, and accurately put lead into a target in less than 1.5 seconds? I'm prolly gonna get dogged on for saying this but, i'm willing to bet that most people that do carry can't do that even if they carry with one in the pipe, and i'll bet money that most of them haven't even tried.

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doughboi View Post
    So i have questions about having no cpl in Washington. Do i unload before I get in the car or when I'm I
    the car? And do i load in or out the car?
    When in the car can I have it in my holster.
    Quote Originally Posted by tombrewster421 View Post
    It's a good idea to not have a round chambered if you have to do this, since most holsters will allow you to drop the mag without having to remove the firearm. Much less likely to "warrant alarm" that way.
    Originally Posted by tombrewster421
    It's a good idea to not have a round chambered .....
    Quote Originally Posted by JIMMBOB View Post
    "Hold on a sec Mr. Badguy, I have to load my weapon before I can defend myself."

    Some people will tell you to carry without a round chambered and only rack one when you are going to an "iffy" place. How do you know where the "iffy" places are? Crime happens in the "good" places too. Why would you intentionally go to the "iffy" places anyway? Whats the point in carrying if you have load your weapon before you can use it?
    I hear all the time that a BG can close the distance of 21 feet in 1.5 seconds. Can you get your gun out of its holster, rack it, and accurately put lead into a target in less than 1.5 seconds? I'm prolly gonna get dogged on for saying this but, i'm willing to bet that most people that do carry can't do that even if they carry with one in the pipe, and i'll bet money that most of them haven't even tried.
    JIMMBOB~

    Did you even read the thread? Since you clipped Tom's quote and thus rendered it bad......Tom is specifically referring to the OP's question of car carry in Washington. Where the OP (w/o a CPL) would need to carry unloaded (including the chamber) and be able to drop the magazine while the firearm is still in the holster, thus NOT handling the firearm in view of the public. The advice also follows 1245A Defender's attribution of 9.41.270 and thus avoiding running afoul of the law. Jim, your advice is fine with someone who holds a CPL and does not have to deal with this issue.
    Live Free or Die!

  24. #24
    Regular Member J1MB0B's Avatar
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    Unloaded is unloaded with or with out a CPL.

  25. #25
    Regular Member J1MB0B's Avatar
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    Maybe I should have said:
    In my opinion, any advice to carry condition 3 for any reason, is bad advice. Even if it is for the reason of the OP, in this case not wanting to unload outside of the car. There are ways to unload without attracting unwanted attention mentioned in other responses to the OP's question. Most of which would be infinitely better than carrying an unloaded weapon with the possibility of using it for self defense, in my opinion.
    Last edited by J1MB0B; 02-26-2012 at 06:55 PM.

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