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We need more LEOs like THIS one to join our forum...

skidmark

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
10,444
Location
Valhalla
A little late, but "Welcome, Officer Smith." Like you I can get behind in my reading.

It seems you have already been fisked and raked over the coals for some of the stuff you wrote. I hope you expected that, and tok notice of te fact that in spite of that nobody is calling for your head on a pike.

A comment or two -

Everybody who OCs (or CCs for that matter) has an agenda. Some are more blatant about it than others. As for the Cali folks - just a thought but most folks put in their position (UOC only, needing an act of God or political connections to get a CC permit, etc.) would want to fight back against both the overt and implied statements the law makes against them.

While I can understand LEOs checking to see that LACs are (were) complying with the law, what was up with running serial numbers? How did that help assure folks complied with the UOC requirement?

You have pointed out that UOC is really just carrying around a paperweight. Being a cop, you know the response tmes after 9-1-1 has received the call and passed the information on to dispatch. Add in the time it takes to get basic info from a (possibly) hysterical person in the middle of being a crime victim and tell me that relying on the cops for anything more than to come out and look for evidence is anywhere near a good idea. Do you dare?

Discounting folks who go stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things, how many times have you investigated a situation where someone with good situational awareness and a decent attempt at avoidance still found themself a victim? Then tell me how many people on the street you see with even mediocre situational awareness.

Suppose that FOPA did not exist and you had to live like the rest of the hoi poloi when out of uniform. How would you feel? And suppose that your local sheriff would not sign off on a CC permit unless you had actually been attacked by someone who communicated a verifiable threat against you - but decided anyhow that if that person ended up being jailed you did not need the permit?

What it seems to boil down to is what we call the "Only Ones" syndrome. Everywhere else where OC is allowed (and even where CC was newly allowed) the warnings of blood in the streets has never materialized. So what exactly is it that you want to stop from happening by not allowing folks to OC?

stay safe.
 

SouthernBoy

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,837
Location
Western Prince William County, Virginia, USA
Last September, about eight of us met up for a lunch at Virginia BBQ in eastern Manassas and one of the OCDO members was a transplant from California where he had been a LEO I believe in the LA area. He said the difference between Virginia and California was like night and day regarding attitudes about citizens carrying firearms from both the general public and the police. It was a real pleasure talking to this man and hearing all he had to say. Folks who live in states like California, Illinois, Massachusetts, New York, and New Jersey and are native to those states fail to see, understand, and even believe that people in states like Virginia who carry rarely have problems with the police or public. They are of the mindset that when an officer sees an OC'er, that citizen is probably going to windup being cuffed and perhaps thrown to the ground with a knee in his back (yes, people have said this to me on other websites). They make the mistake of viewing these things through tainted glasses without thinking for a moment that there is a different world out there when they leave their state and experience normalcy.
 
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Dreamer

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2009
Messages
5,360
Location
Grennsboro NC
Folks who live in states like California, Illinois, Massachusetts, New York, and New Jersey and are native to those states fail to see, understand, and even believe that people in states like Virginia who carry rarely have problems with the police or public. They are of the mindset that when an officer sees an OC'er, that citizen is probably going to windup being cuffed and perhaps thrown to the groun


Don't forget your neighbors to the north, across the moat, in the People's Republic of Maryland...
 

BurgerBoy

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2012
Messages
25
Location
Murray, Kentucky
I've never had any trouble, or scared people, when I OC in Kentucky either. I OC a full size Ruger P95PR15 with an extra 15 round magazine with me.
 

SouthernBoy

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,837
Location
Western Prince William County, Virginia, USA
Don't forget your neighbors to the north, across the moat, in the People's Republic of Maryland...

You're right, I did forget to mention Maryland. The only wide-eyed stares I have gotten when fueling one of my vehicles have been from people with New Jersey or Maryland plates on their cars. At least, those are the only ones I've noticed.
 

skidmark

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
10,444
Location
Valhalla
OK, he told us he does not check his email every hour on the quarter-hour like some of you slackers do. I am guessing he does not check OCDO any more frequently.

We all, including me, the guy who invited him over here, have had our turn responding to what he posted here and explaining our position and reasons for the sorts of responses we have made.

I ask that everyone give Officer Smith enough time to come back and respond or, by his prolonged absence (more than 60 days? maybe 90?) indicate that he has dropped OCDO from his list of places to post.

stay safe.
 

nobama

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2009
Messages
756
Location
, ,
Thanks to skidmark for sending me an email telling me about this forum, and the reference to my blog.

It has been almost a month since I received that email, and I just got around to reading it today. I guess I should check that email more often eh?

Anyway, I am all for people being able to defend themselves when it is necessary. I DO NOT advocate shooting folks just for the sake of shooting them, but if your life or someone else's is in genuine danger, by all means you should be able to protect yourself.

The interesting thing about me joining this forum, is I have developed rather a negative opinion about open carry here in California. Now that I've said that, don't just brush me aside without reading on and discovering why I have developed the opinions I have.

Here we go...

In California, we are one of the few states remaining where it is nearly impossible to obtain a concealed carry permit. Because of this, we have had a number of issues with folks who have taken to open carry, by carrying an unloaded pistol on one hip with loaded magazines on their other side. This used to comply with the law (until the laws were changed BECAUSE of the behavior of the open carry "activists").

There are many reasons this form of open carry did not sit well with me.

#1) If you are carrying an unloaded weapon, you are a target. Anyone who is illegally carrying a CONCEALED weapon can be on you before you have time to load, and they can take your gun from you without you being able to do anything. Gunfights take place in seconds. Seconds you will not have available to load your weapon. An unloaded pistol is nothing more than an expensive paperweight.

#2) When a pistol is openly carried in a populated area in California, people freak out. While it is an every day sight to see someone walking around with a gun on their hip in Texas, it is not such a common sight in California, and the sheep here tend to get a little uptight when they see one and there is not a badge to go with it. It doesn't bother most cops, because we know what's up and how to deal with it. But the unfortunate fact is that the vast majority of folks here in the Nanny State believe guns are evil. You can blame that on many factors I don't have NEARLY enough room to delve into here. You would not BELIEVE how many people in my town I have suggested purchasing a gun to, who replied with "A GUN!? NOOOOOOOOO. Guns are dangerous. Etc."

#3) The majority of the open carry folks in California seem to have an agenda. Every single one I have contacted was less interested in exercising their second amendment right, and more interested in trying to catch the police in a mistake so they could sue for a civil rights violation. Every last one has had a video recorder of some sort, has insisted upon recording our contact (which bothers me not at all), and insisted they knew the law and their rights (which most actually didn't). Most of the folks I spoke with were hesitant to let me inspect their weapon (as I HAVE A RIGHT TO DO). Some would refuse to even tell me their name. All were incredibly discourteous. When you give the outward impression that you are up to something, instead of preserving your rights you'll just get them legislated away, just like has happened here in California.

So, the bottom line. Am I for the responsible carrying of some sort of defensive weapon by all folks who are not otherwise forbidden from possessing such (i.e. felons, parolees, mentally unstable, etc.)? Absolutely. Am I for open carry? Not the way I've seen it done around here. Am I dead set against it? Absolutely not. It just needs to be approached from a different direction and handled much more responsibly. The all around BEST way, in my opinion, is to make California a SHALL ISSUE state and eliminate the need for open carry altogether. But with the legislators we currently have in office, I doubt that's going to happen any time soon.

We've all heard the saying that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Well in this case, it would appear the squeaky wheel just got removed from the wagon completely.

On that note, thanks again for inviting me in.

Welcome, I didnt read all the posts,so if this is a repeat Im sorry. In Texas you NEVER see anyone walking down the street with a gun on their hip because OC is NOT legal in Texas. You might see someone with a long gun in the rack of a truck in small towns. There is a lot better chance to see someone OC in Wisconsin than Texas, so please try not to stereo type a state or OCiers for that matter, thats what the liberal bed wetters do.
 
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