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Thread: Are you obligated to give a LEO ID/ Permit?

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    Are you obligated to give a LEO ID/ Permit?

    Are you obligated to give a LEO ID/ Permit?

    When out and OCing, and a LEO stops you, you are doing nothing wrong, are you obligated to give him ID and wpn permit? Is it not your right to OC if the state you reside in allows you to OC. I reside in GA. Although GA is not typically an OC state your are authorized to OC if you have a carry permit. Any help or link where I can find it in the law would be great. Thanks for the help in advance.
    V/R
    Chris

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    Quote Originally Posted by cmr287 View Post
    Are you obligated to give a LEO ID/ Permit?

    When out and OCing, and a LEO stops you, you are doing nothing wrong, are you obligated to give him ID and wpn permit? Is it not your right to OC if the state you reside in allows you to OC. I reside in GA. Although GA is not typically an OC state your are authorized to OC if you have a carry permit. Any help or link where I can find it in the law would be great. Thanks for the help in advance.
    V/R
    Chris
    There is no statutory obligation for you to show ID/GWL to a police officer. More details are found at GeorgiaPacking.org where case law and the law in plain English is explained and discussed.

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    I always laugh at these type of questions. Don't you see how you have only 3 options in response to his ID/permit request?

    1. obey

    2. decline and not resist

    3. decline and resist with any means necessary


    I'm thinking you're just trying to find out what will happen if you pick option nr. 2 so your question isn't really if you have to obey, but what will happen to you once you refuse but don't resist, right?
    Last edited by hazek; 02-25-2012 at 07:16 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hazek View Post
    I always laugh at these type of questions. Don't you see how you have only 3 options in response to his ID/permit request?

    1. obey

    2. decline and not resist

    3. decline and resist with any means necessary


    I'm thinking you're just trying to find out what will happen if you pick option nr. 2 so your question isn't really if you have to obey, but what will happen to you once you refuse but don't resist, right?
    What's wrong with that? That's the awesome way to do it! But really... it's not worth #2 if you're aware of the fact that the officer is in the right.

    So far as I know, if you're not operating a motor vehicle, you don't ever have to show your driver's license, though I'd imagine he'd be in the right to, at most, see that you have a license to know that you are carrying legally. Since the only cause he'd have to have to see it, is that you might not be carrying legally. Once you flash the license, that should be it.

    Happened to me at IHOP. Cop asked if I was "fully loaded"... not sure if carrying one chambered is illegal... but I said no but that I had a license to carry and as soon as I said that he said "Oh, ok then. Thanks!" And off he went. Nice fellow.

  5. #5
    Regular Member sawah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tolderian View Post
    What's wrong with that? That's the awesome way to do it! But really... it's not worth #2 if you're aware of the fact that the officer is in the right.

    So far as I know, if you're not operating a motor vehicle, you don't ever have to show your driver's license, though I'd imagine he'd be in the right to, at most, see that you have a license to know that you are carrying legally. Since the only cause he'd have to have to see it, is that you might not be carrying legally. Once you flash the license, that should be it.

    Happened to me at IHOP. Cop asked if I was "fully loaded"... not sure if carrying one chambered is illegal... but I said no but that I had a license to carry and as soon as I said that he said "Oh, ok then. Thanks!" And off he went. Nice fellow.
    This is a dumb assessment, IMO. You should at least say something before dropping your trousers and bending over.

    1. Is the guy an on duty officer and not a fake cop?
    2. Is the reason he's asking not legal? (no RAS)
    3. Is he going to do something based on seeing your ID
    4. Are you carrying a recorder and is it a 1 party state and is the recorder on?
    5. Do you have a witness who can testify on your side (other than a spouse or child)?
    6. What if you don't have an ID - some people walking OC-ing go 'sterile' no ID
    7. Can you calmly ask the 'question' (Why am I being detained, am I required to talk to you (say you're sitting on a park bench calmly playing cards, or walking your dog in a peaceful area of town?))
    8. Do you have a copy of the carry rules for your state on you? Can you read them to the LEO? Cite statute numbers in a friendly manner?

    Just 'being nice' is a ploy LEOs use.
    Last edited by sawah; 02-27-2012 at 04:56 AM.
    A firearm is a tool of convenience, not effectiveness - Clint Smith, Thunder Ranch

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    Quote Originally Posted by sawah View Post
    This is a dumb assessment, IMO. You should at least say something before dropping your trousers and bending over.

    1. Is the guy an on duty officer and not a fake cop?
    2. Is the reason he's asking not legal? (no RAS)
    3. Is he going to do something based on seeing your ID
    4. Are you carrying a recorder and is it a 1 party state and is the recorder on?
    5. Do you have a witness who can testify on your side (other than a spouse or child)?
    6. What if you don't have an ID - some people walking OC-ing go 'sterile' no ID
    7. Can you calmly ask the 'question' (Why am I being detained, am I required to talk to you (say you're sitting on a park bench calmly playing cards, or walking your dog in a peaceful area of town?))
    8. Do you have a copy of the carry rules for your state on you? Can you read them to the LEO? Cite statute numbers in a friendly manner?

    Just 'being nice' is a ploy LEOs use.
    He's right. I am a moron. Don't listen to me. All cops are bad.

    Sarcasm aside, he's still right. Know your rights first. After that, it's up to you regarding how muh BS you're willing to go through. Personally, I had important **** to do and couldn't afford to be arrested under false pretenses, hire a lawyer, etc., and his inquiries, to me, were reasonable. Wasn't worth any trouble and he really wasn't causing any. So, I didn't see a need to make his job any harder since he wasn't making my life any more difficult.

    I've never had a bad run in, yet, with CPD. Just one rent-a-Marshall. I made a post about that somewhere. Aside from that, I choose my battles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tolderian View Post
    He's right. I am a moron. Don't listen to me. All cops are bad.

    Sarcasm aside, he's still right. Know your rights first. After that, it's up to you regarding how muh BS you're willing to go through. Personally, I had important **** to do and couldn't afford to be arrested under false pretenses, hire a lawyer, etc., and his inquiries, to me, were reasonable. Wasn't worth any trouble and he really wasn't causing any. So, I didn't see a need to make his job any harder since he wasn't making my life any more difficult.

    I've never had a bad run in, yet, with CPD. Just one rent-a-Marshall. I made a post about that somewhere. Aside from that, I choose my battles.
    Congratulations on your slippery slope mentality.

    First they came for the communists,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

    Then they came for the trade unionists,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

    Then they came for me
    and there was no one left to speak out for me.

    But as long as you weren't inconvenienced, right?

    EDIT: Please watch this:

    Last edited by hazek; 02-27-2012 at 06:28 PM.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    My driving license stays in the car where I need to have a license to drive. I don't take it out of the car unless I know I'm buying an airline ticket, purchasing alcohol or making a withdrawal from the bank.
    The Georgia Code has statutory requirements as to when it must be carried and when it must be presented.


    My weapons license stays in my wallet where I need it when I'm carrying a weapon.
    The Georgia Code has statutory requirements as to when it must be carried...... and none as to when it must be presented.

    The short answer to your question is "No, you do not have to present ID at Any time. And you only have to present a license when you are performing a licensed activity that requires you to present your license for that activity."
    Last edited by Fallschirmjäger; 02-27-2012 at 07:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hazek View Post
    Congratulations on your slippery slope mentality.




    But as long as you weren't inconvenienced, right?

    EDIT: Please watch this:

    Aw thanks! You know... If only people could always be condescending. We'd just get so much farther. Maybe I should start doing that. He has more posts than me, so... I think that means he's usually more right.

    Vid IS awesome though. Favorited. Wish he was my instructor.

    However, I guess the moral of the story is. Go ahead, piss off the cop... Hazek will post your bail. Oh wait! Just because they shouldn't arrest you doesn't mean they won't. MY point was if it's worth it to you to deal with. DO IT. Last time I checked, the tree of liberty is being watered every day with the blood of patriots. Let me know when you find new juice for the garden before antagonizing people.

    Fight for your rights. But be civil until civility is no longer an option. Last I checked, there's still good cops out there.

    But what do I know. Don't trust people with them-thur "slippery slope mentalities". Though I have no idea how it's a slippery slope mentality. Given the circumstances, I don't quite think A will inevitably lead to B. It might... But it depends on the circumstances.

    Technically... I think you have that. Since you assume that cooperation inevitably leads to nazis. Which become zombies. And we all know what nazi zombies lead to.

    Or maybe I have it backwards... In any case. Same team!

    In any case... Fallschirmjäger gave the best answer with the most logical explanation as to why.
    Last edited by Tolderian; 02-28-2012 at 09:09 AM.

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