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Thread: Man who brought gun to school used extremely poor judgement

  1. #1
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Man who brought gun to school used extremely poor judgement

    The Kent County Prosecutor's Office issued a statement Friday saying that a man who brought a gun to an elementary school was within his legal rights, but exercised “extremely poor judgment" in doing so.
    http://www.fox17online.com/news/fox1...,6928116.story
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  2. #2
    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    well at least he is sticking to the facts and not sharing his personal opinons

    /end sarcasm

    eta- i had to sign up and comment on that one. i wanted to call this guy out for using this as a platform to push his personal beliefs and opinions.
    Last edited by detroit_fan; 03-02-2012 at 06:24 PM.
    If guns cause crime, all mine are defective- Ted Nugent

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Kudos to him for exercising his rights. I assume that there was no screaming mothers or children. I wish I could carry when voting here in VA (my precinct is an elementary school.)
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Ridiculous.

  5. #5
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post
    Kudos to him for exercising his rights. I assume that there was no screaming mothers or children. I wish I could carry when voting here in VA (my precinct is an elementary school.)
    Not only was there no one running around screaming, when he was about to exit the school a teacher stopped him and asked him to come to the office.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  6. #6
    Regular Member Vmaxx's Avatar
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    What law did this teacher use to detain this person by escorting them to this office? Why did he submit to there request to follow non law enforcement to this office?

  7. #7
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Angry What dirt bags Kent Co. are!

    Well now - the Kent Co. Prosecutor's office seems to suffer from rectal cranial inversion [head up butt] syndrome, now don't they. This is like them issuing a statement that says all people who drive red cars are stupid It {OC} was this mans only legal choice of self defense! If he had been the bad guy they are trying to make him out to be, instead of going peacefully to the office with the UNARMED security staff, he would have pulled his weapon and rained lead all over them and there would not have been a damned thing they could do accept to serve as bullet traps! Complete hogwash & gibberish coming out of that office!
    Last edited by Glock9mmOldStyle; 03-03-2012 at 12:25 AM. Reason: red cars
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

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    And they prosecute people? Whats scary, is to think about how many innocent peoples lives are forever changed by these people.

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    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    Slander?

  10. #10
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougwg View Post
    Slander?
    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(ffb...e=mcl-600-2911
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  11. #11
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    "the advice of responding Grand Rapids Police Officers, who told Looman "just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean you should do it." ..
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    To be honest, Im surprised he (prosecutor) voluntarily informed the public that its legal to carry in a school. Thanks Mr. Prosecutor....You helped our cause!!

  13. #13
    Regular Member Glock214's Avatar
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    Wow, it’s amazing how many people want to have this guy charged, even though they know what he did is perfectly legal. I just read the story and read the comments, lots of anti's out there. I hate that people think we are mad people with confidence problems, or something. Horrible, even people on there who claim to be CC'ers saying only people who should OC should be military and Police. Makes me angry to think some fellow CPL holders feel that way, trying to take away our rights. Anyway though, I am glad the prosecutor did say what the OC'er did was indeed legal since he did have a valid CPL. I always conduct myself in a personable, professional manner and make sure to be courteous to all I interact with, not because I am carrying, but because it is who I am, and I'm sure it is how many...if not all of us do as well. I am proud to be among the OC community and will continue to exercise my right, and show people we OC'ers are responsible gun owners, and probably the nicest people they will encounter.

    Glock214

  14. #14
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock214 View Post
    Wow, it’s amazing how many people want to have this guy charged, even though they know what he did is perfectly legal. I just read the story and read the comments, lots of anti's out there. I hate that people think we are mad people with confidence problems, or something. Horrible, even people on there who claim to be CC'ers saying only people who should OC should be military and Police. Makes me angry to think some fellow CPL holders feel that way, trying to take away our rights. Anyway though, I am glad the prosecutor did say what the OC'er did was indeed legal since he did have a valid CPL. I always conduct myself in a personable, professional manner and make sure to be courteous to all I interact with, not because I am carrying, but because it is who I am, and I'm sure it is how many...if not all of us do as well. I am proud to be among the OC community and will continue to exercise my right, and show people we OC'ers are responsible gun owners, and probably the nicest people they will encounter.

    Glock214
    Sadly there are a lot of CCers out there who are very much against OC. They believe we do it for the attention and that everyone should just CC.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  15. #15
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    I think people shouldn't CC.

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    Regular Member Glock214's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    Sadly there are a lot of CCers out there who are very much against OC. They believe we do it for the attention and that everyone should just CC.
    It's very sad. You would think CPL holders would be all pro gun, I guess not. so sad.
    All we can do is continue to push the movement and show the people we are regular people like anybody else except we decide to carry to protect not only our loved ones, but also our rights.

    Carry On!

    Glock214
    "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms. . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." -- Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774-1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764

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    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I think people shouldn't CC.
    I think people should carry however they choose. I really hate the attention argument too it's just not correct. It's like saying the reason you carry concealed is so you will have an opportunity to shoot a criminal.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  18. #18
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock214 View Post
    It's very sad. You would think CPL holders would be all pro gun, I guess not. so sad.
    All we can do is continue to push the movement and show the people we are regular people like anybody else except we decide to carry to protect not only our loved ones, but also our rights.

    Carry On!

    Glock214
    Many either, A) take an elitist attitude and think they are somehow "special" because, as everyone knows, not just ANY law-abiding adult should be able to carry, and they see OC as "people without the permission card" despite the fact most of us here have a cpl or 2), they get a cpl but see no need to carry most of the time.
    I have met many from both camps, and I can tell you the dichotomy is NOT mutually exclusive. In fact, I know many people with a cpl who cc less than a few hours every month. I'm sure, too, there are many other reasons such as they believe that they know everything about gun laws, even when they don't. More often than not the biggest opposition to OC comes from other gun owners.
    Last edited by DrTodd; 03-06-2012 at 07:30 PM.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  19. #19
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Many either, A) take an elitist attitude and think they are somehow "special" because, as everyone knows, not just ANY law-abiding adult should be able to carry, and they see OC as "people without the permission card" despite the fact most of us here have a cpl or 2), they get a cpl but see no need to carry most of the time.
    I have met many from both camps, and I can tell you the dichotomy is NOT mutually exclusive. In fact, I know many people with a cpl who cc less than a few hours every month. I'm sure, too, there are many other reasons such as they believe that they know everything about gun laws, even when they don't. More often than not the biggest opposition to OC comes from other gun owners.
    I hate it when I talk to people either looking to get a CPL or that have a CPL that say they will/do only carry when it's at night in not good parts of town or in bad areas. They just don't get it.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  20. #20
    Regular Member sawah's Avatar
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    The previous week Mr Looman showed up with a tiny policemen strapped to each leg, but neither one wanted to do anything but demand overtime and the occasional donut. (I keed, I keed).
    A firearm is a tool of convenience, not effectiveness - Clint Smith, Thunder Ranch

  21. #21
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    You would think that schools, churches, police stations, and the average living room were nice areas, but shootings happen in those places regularly

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    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock214 View Post
    Wow, it’s amazing how many people want to have this guy charged, even though they know what he did is perfectly legal. I just read the story and read the comments, lots of anti's out there. I hate that people think we are mad people with confidence problems, or something. Horrible, even people on there who claim to be CC'ers saying only people who should OC should be military and Police. Makes me angry to think some fellow CPL holders feel that way, trying to take away our rights. Anyway though, I am glad the prosecutor did say what the OC'er did was indeed legal since he did have a valid CPL. I always conduct myself in a personable, professional manner and make sure to be courteous to all I interact with, not because I am carrying, but because it is who I am, and I'm sure it is how many...if not all of us do as well. I am proud to be among the OC community and will continue to exercise my right, and show people we OC'ers are responsible gun owners, and probably the nicest people they will encounter.

    Glock214
    Well said Glock!
    If guns cause crime, all mine are defective- Ted Nugent

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Unhappy

    Quote Originally Posted by detroit_fan View Post
    Well said Glock!
    Yep Glock214 nailed it. Sadly, these are the same folks who get all twisted up when we go to public meetings and fight for not only our rights, but their's also. Many of them suffer from what I call check-valve syndrome, as everything with them is always a one way (their's) and screw everybody else mentality.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  24. #24
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    Sadly there are a lot of CCers out there who are very much against OC. They believe we do it for the attention and that everyone should just CC.
    Sadly there are a lot of CC'ers out there who actually believe a carry "permit" IS the right to bear arms.

    I don't know how many times I've heard someone say:

    "Sure I have the right to carry a gun. All I have to do is go get a permit."

    But....... and I warn y'all the following is a rant...

    Even more sad is all the gun owners/carriers, regardless of if they are CC'ers.. hunters.. OC'ers.. trap/skeet shooters... target shooters... IDPA shooters... etc. .. who think that everyone else should only own the guns they think are...

    "reasonable", "appropriate", "acceptable", and only carry guns in ways they think are "responsible".

    It's as if those folks think they are so important they are endowed with the divine power to require other people to adhere to the standards they dictate.... never understanding that another word for dictated standards is........... "infringed".

    But the saddest thing of all is those gun owners/carriers who want to tell everyone else how to exercise the right to keep and bear arms use the very same insults and the very same ridicule against their own brethren as the anti gunners use against guns in general.

    Ok... rant over...
    Last edited by Bikenut; 03-06-2012 at 09:11 PM.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  25. #25
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    When are you going to run for office? You got my vote.

    The only way we are going to get our rights back is to get our people in the offices who make those changes. If you want it done right, you do it yourself.


    Something that MOC would be in a position to do, would be to organise a connty by county election capaign, to get someone elected in every district.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 03-06-2012 at 09:18 PM.

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