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Thread: HR 347 act

  1. #1
    Regular Member quarter horseman's Avatar
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    HR 347 act

    juat heard about this this is not good for OC or CC
    http://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/...2hr347-SUS.pdf

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    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    no, not good at all, because then your charge becomes "armed protest too close to a politician"

    if you don't like it there is a veto request petition at whitehouse.gov

    https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petition...dment/5N6gzG57

    everyone needs to sign this
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  3. #3
    Regular Member quarter horseman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    no, not good at all, because then your charge becomes "armed protest too close to a politician"

    if you don't like it there is a veto request petition at whitehouse.gov

    https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petition...dment/5N6gzG57

    everyone needs to sign this
    Thanks for the info!

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    signed

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    Regular Member FerretMI's Avatar
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    The news on this is being pretty sensationalized. Read the following quote from the r/politics discussion of this:

    This is ignorant nonsense. Federal law already covers nearly everything in this bill: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1752
    The current federal law applies everywhere except DC, where local law applies. This bill just adds specific mentions of the White House and the VP's Residence to the already existing bill. People seem to be reading the language that's already enacted into federal law and freaking out, thinking it's some new fascism.
    For example, the linked article freaking out about:

    "Even more sinister is the provision regarding events of 'national significance.' What circumstances constitute events of 'national significance” is left to the unbridled discretion of the Department of Homeland Security."
    Dude, that language isn't being added by this bill--it's already part of the law. All of the article's fearmongering is shown to be sensationalist [garbage] by the fact that none of the consequences they predict have come about despite the fact that the stuff they're scared of is already codified in federal law. The language of the current law:

    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person or group of persons—
    (1) willfully and knowingly to enter or remain in any posted, cordoned off, or otherwise restricted area of a building or grounds where the President or other person protected by the Secret Service is or will be temporarily visiting;
    (2) willfully and knowingly to enter or remain in any posted, cordoned off, or otherwise restricted area of a building or grounds so restricted in conjunction with an event designated as a special event of national significance;
    (3) willfully, knowingly, and with intent to impede or disrupt the orderly conduct of Government business or official functions, to engage in disorderly or disruptive conduct in, or within such proximity to, any building or grounds described in paragraph (1) or (2) when, or so that, such conduct, in fact, impedes or disrupts the orderly conduct of Government business or official functions;
    (4) willfully and knowingly to obstruct or impede ingress or egress to or from any building, grounds, or area described in paragraph (1) or (2); or
    (5) willfully and knowingly to engage in any act of physical violence against any person or property in any building, grounds, or area described in paragraph (1) or (2).
    This bill changes the federal law to include DC (the residences of the POTUS and VPOTUS).

    http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-actio...ence-intruders
    The House on Monday is expected to approve legislation that would formally make it illegal to intrude on White House grounds or the grounds of the vice president's residence.
    Current law sets out fines against anyone who knowingly intrudes in a building where the president or vice president are staying temporarily, but does not set out fines for those who trespass in their permanent residences. To impose fines in the latter case, the Secret Service uses a provision of D.C. code dealing with misdemeanor infractions.

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    Regular Member Scooter's Avatar
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    signed

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    ‘‘(2) knowingly, and with intent to impede or
    disrupt the orderly conduct of Government business or
    official functions, engages in disorderly or disruptive
    conduct in, or within such proximity to, any restricted
    building or grounds when, or so that, such
    conduct, in fact, impedes or disrupts the orderly conduct
    of Government business or official functions"

    ‘‘(A) the person, during and in relation to
    the offense, uses or carries a deadly or dangerous
    weapon or firearm



    I know how this bill could go for someone, however from the plain reading of this is seems to only deal with someone whose actions disrupt government business or official functions. This doesnt seem to have to deal with simply carrying a firearm.

    From how it appears to me, if you were somewhere in a peaceful manner, while carrying your firearm for SD you would not be found guilty of anything in this because you were not knowingly being disruptive to government business...such as causing a scene or acting obnoxiously
    The worst weapon is the human mind, its created and done things far worse than a gun can, has, or ever will. Its the human mind that tells the gun what to do and animates the inanimate object.

    With all these gun control laws in place I have yet to find a single one that has saved someones life, but I can find hundreds of stories where a gun has.

  8. #8
    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FerretMI View Post
    The news on this is being pretty sensationalized. Read the following quote from the r/politics discussion of this:
    This bill changes the federal law to include DC (the residences of the POTUS and VPOTUS).

    http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-actio...ence-intruders
    The House on Monday is expected to approve legislation that would formally make it illegal to intrude on White House grounds or the grounds of the vice president's residence.
    Current law sets out fines against anyone who knowingly intrudes in a building where the president or vice president are staying temporarily, but does not set out fines for those who trespass in their permanent residences. To impose fines in the latter case, the Secret Service uses a provision of D.C. code dealing with misdemeanor infractions.

    Lets hope that the abomination is only staying in DC 'temporarily'. Was he thinking of making the Whitehouse his 'permanent' residence?
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

  9. #9
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by Yance View Post
    ‘‘(2) knowingly, and with intent to impede or
    disrupt the orderly conduct of Government business or
    official functions, engages in disorderly or disruptive
    conduct in, or within such proximity to, any restricted
    building or grounds when, or so that, such
    conduct, in fact, impedes or disrupts the orderly conduct
    of Government business or official functions
    "

    ‘‘(A) the person, during and in relation to
    the offense, uses or carries a deadly or dangerous
    weapon or firearm



    I know how this bill could go for someone, however from the plain reading of this is seems to only deal with someone whose actions disrupt government business or official functions. This doesnt seem to have to deal with simply carrying a firearm.

    From how it appears to me, if you were somewhere in a peaceful manner, while carrying your firearm for SD you would not be found guilty of anything in this because you were not knowingly being disruptive to government business...such as causing a scene or acting obnoxiously
    The problem is Yance just is I and others in MOC & others who attend gov. meetings that even at the city level just by exercising our right to self defense we have been labeled: disruptive to the peace, meetings, and said to be intimidating, and sending a chilling message to officials.

    We know this is bunk but it is hard to fight false charges from a city/village with the amount of resources they can throw at us, now imagine that times a BILLION
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

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    So, they are asking for a one way street then....

  11. #11
    Regular Member quarter horseman's Avatar
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    Glock9mmoldstyle :

    The problem is Yance just is I and others in MOC & others who attend gov. meetings that even at the city level just by exercising our right to self defense we have been labeled: disruptive to the peace, meetings, and said to be intimidating, and sending a chilling message to officials.

    We know this is bunk but it is hard to fight false charges from a city/village with the amount of resources they can throw at us, now imagine that times a BILLION

    perfectly said,

  12. #12
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    So, they are asking for a one way street then....
    you know that darn cat is scary!
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
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    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

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    he ate the spider, dont let his looks fool you

  14. #14
    Regular Member michaelm_ski's Avatar
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    All we can do is call our reps and tell how we feel and see if they side with us or the antis , if they side with us re-elect them and if not vote for someone new

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    We have been sliding down that slippery slope for decades.

    As a result, we cant carry most places people go without permission, the laws that govern this can confuse lawyers, and the gun owner has more to fear from the .gov than any criminal.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 03-06-2012 at 08:12 PM.

  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by quarter horseman View Post
    Glock9mmoldstyle :

    The problem is Yance, just as I and others in MOC, along with other citizens who attend gov. meetings - that even at the city level, just by exercising our right to self defense we have been labeled: disruptive to the peace, meetings, and said to be intimidating, and sending a chilling message to officials.

    We know this is bunk but it is hard to fight false charges from a city/village with the amount of resources they can throw at us, now imagine that times a BILLION

    perfectly said,
    Well not quite....I was passionately typing and made a few mistakes but it should read better now
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  17. #17
    Regular Member quarter horseman's Avatar
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    From Justin Amash from the 3rd district was the only one to vote nay on this and has an explanation of why, he is the only one who gets it.

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/03/congress-..._orig=politics

  18. #18
    Regular Member quarter horseman's Avatar
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    I contacted my rep Monday and had no responce yet. I wonder if he will get back to me or not as to why he voted yes on this.

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Resign.

    here is another petition some of you may be interested in (for laughs, mostly):

    https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petition...paign=shorturl
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

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