Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 32

Thread: CPL class question

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    livonia, MI (home), marquette (school)
    Posts
    14

    CPL class question

    hi i was wondering if there is anything to stop me from takeing a CPL class this summer when im only 19 years old so that when i turn 21 in september 2013 i could apply for my cpl right when i turn 21

  2. #2
    Regular Member GlockIt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Warren, Michigan
    Posts
    45
    This place will let you.

    http://www.ccwnow.com/faq/

    I think most ranges that hold cpl classes will rent guns if you dont have one.

    Most of them however, will not rent any to people under 21.

    If you have one, good. If not, maybe somone you know who does
    would let you use theirs. They would also have to be present for you
    to do so.

    Best bets to call and ask.
    Last edited by GlockIt; 03-05-2012 at 04:56 PM.
    Id rather look at my ugly Glock than shoot your fancy S&W.

  3. #3
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portage, MI
    Posts
    1,490
    Legally you can do that. I plan on doing the same thing on May 23rd of 2013.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    I thought you had to take the class within a year.

    My CPL instructor had guns for use if you didn't have one of your own.

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    livonia, MI (home), marquette (school)
    Posts
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I thought you had to take the class within a year.

    My CPL instructor had guns for use if you didn't have one of your own.
    this is what i have heard too, i was hopeing someone would have a little more info on if it is true there is a timelimit after you take the class to when you apply to get the cpl.

    i have guns availible to me to use for carry and compleating the range time for the class

  6. #6
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    Quote Originally Posted by pacman552SD View Post

    i have guns availible to me to use for carry and compleating the range time for the class

    No you don't.

    They have to be registered to you for you to posess them legally.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    livonia, MI (home), marquette (school)
    Posts
    14
    right now i have a .22 revolver and a ruger p345 registared in my name

  8. #8
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portage, MI
    Posts
    1,490
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I thought you had to take the class within a year.

    My CPL instructor had guns for use if you didn't have one of your own.
    Cite please? I see nowhere that says it must be within one year.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Livingston Co., Michigan, , USA
    Posts
    275
    About to finally get my wife to submit her application.
    Her certificate is dated 2001.

  10. #10
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    Cite please? I see nowhere that says it must be within one year.
    I was hoping someone could prove me right or wrong.

  11. #11
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portage, MI
    Posts
    1,490
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I was hoping someone could prove me right or wrong.
    Finding the law stating how long the certification is good for is like finding a law stating that open carry is legal with a CPL.
    28.425b
    (j) A certificate stating that the applicant has completed the training course prescribed by this act.

    28.425j Pistol training or safety program
    You can read through 28.425j which talks about the training and nothing in it says the certificate is only good for so long. Also 28.425b says nothing about it either.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  12. #12
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    Thanks.

  13. #13
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Lansing area, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    6,445
    Quote Originally Posted by Leader View Post
    About to finally get my wife to submit her application.
    Her certificate is dated 2001.
    She may have to explain some things to the clerk regarding the language on the certificate. From MCRGOs


    Q: My county clerk won’t accept my NRA Personal Protection in the Home Course certificate because it was issued more than 1 year ago. Is she correct?
    A: No, NRA certificates do not expire or go “stale.” The NRA alone decides how long their certificates are valid, not county gun boards. According to the law, it is NOT the responsibility of the county gun board to review or approve pistol safety training programs. The statute only states that the applicant must present a certificate signed by a certified firearms instructor with a statement that the course complies with the requirements of the law and that the individual successfully completed the course. If the validity of a certificate comes into question, the board may wish to confirm the firearm instructor’s certification with the organization that provided certification. In most cases, that is the NRA. It is a 4-year felony to issue a bogus certificate. That is intended to keep instructors honest.

    There is similar situation where I have seen clerks attempt to reject certificates because they do not contain the language set forth in MCL §28.425j. Pursuant to 2004 PA 254, after October 1, 2004, the pistol safety training certificate must read “This course complies with section 5j of 1927 PA 372.” Of course, if your certificate was issued before that date, it probably contains something similar but not exact. The ones I issued before October 1, 2004 state, “This course meets the requirements of 1927 PA 372 as amended by 2000 PA 381 5j and 2002 PA 719.” If you are in this situation you have two choices, 1) you can point out to the clerk that the new “magic” language of MCL §28.425j only applies to pistol safety training certificates issued after October 1, 2004, or 2) you can have the instructor that issued the certificate either add the “magic” language for you or give you permission to add it yourself.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  14. #14
    Regular Member WilDChilD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Dewitt, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    288
    Just checked my cert. and it didnt have an experation date so I dont know how it would expire. #smarta$$

  15. #15
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Maybee, Michigan
    Posts
    679
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    No you don't.

    They have to be registered to you for you to posess them legally.
    WRONG
    750.234f Possession of firearm by person less than 18 years of age; exceptions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 234f.

    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), an individual less than 18 years of age shall not possess a firearm in public except under the direct supervision of an individual 18 years of age or older.

    (2) Subsection (1) does not apply to an individual less than 18 years of age who possesses a firearm in accordance with part 401 (wildlife conservation) of the natural resources and environmental protection act, Act No. 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections 324.40101 to 324.40119 of the Michigan Compiled Laws, or part 435 (hunting and fishing licensing) of Act No. 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections 324.43501 to 324.43561 of the Michigan Compiled Laws. However, an individual less than 18 years of age may possess a firearm without a hunting license while at, or going to or from, a recognized target range or trap or skeet shooting ground if, while going to or from the range or ground, the firearm is enclosed and securely fastened in a case or locked in the trunk of a motor vehicle.

    (3) An individual who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.


    History: Add. 1990, Act 321, Eff. Mar. 28, 1991 ;-- Am. 1992, Act 218, Imd. Eff. Oct. 13, 1992 ;-- Am. 1996, Act 80, Imd. Eff. Feb. 27, 1996

    he can borrows someones and use it at the range.........the person who owns the gun would have to take it to the range, but once there, he can BORROW IT
    Last edited by Onnie; 03-06-2012 at 04:17 PM.
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
    American Tactical Imports C45 45 AP
    S&W sigma 40 Cal
    Bersa 380 Thunder Plus
    Hi point C9 9mm
    Chiappa 1911-22 Semi-Auto .22 LR

    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

  16. #16
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    Then why do we tell people they have to be the registered owner to OC?

  17. #17
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Maybee, Michigan
    Posts
    679
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Then why do we tell people they have to be the registered owner to OC?

    I shall research some more, i am strictly referring to shooting at as gun range target practice, i can let anyone that is a non cpl holder, shoot my gun regardless of age. I will see if i can find something "handgun" related. I recall seeing something that restricted HANDGUNS to ranges.
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
    American Tactical Imports C45 45 AP
    S&W sigma 40 Cal
    Bersa 380 Thunder Plus
    Hi point C9 9mm
    Chiappa 1911-22 Semi-Auto .22 LR

    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

  18. #18
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    thanks. its been a long time since I thought about this one.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Maybee, Michigan
    Posts
    679
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    thanks. its been a long time since I thought about this one.
    324.43513 Carrying, transporting, or possessing firearm, slingshot, bow and arrow, or crossbow; hunting license not required; carrying or possessing unloaded weapon.
    Sec. 43513. (1) A person may carry, transport, or possess a firearm without a hunting license if the firearm is unloaded in both barrel and magazine and either enclosed in a case or carried in a vehicle in a location that is not readily accessible to any occupant of the vehicle. A person may carry, transport, or possess a slingshot, bow and arrow, or crossbow without a hunting license if the slingshot, bow, or crossbow is unstrung, enclosed in a case, or carried in a vehicle in a location that is not readily accessible to any occupant of the vehicle.
    (2) Regardless of whether the person has a license or it is open season for the taking of game, a person may carry, transport, possess or discharge a firearm, a bow and arrow, or a crossbow if all of the following apply:
    (a) The person is not taking or attempting to take game but is engaged in 1 or more of the following activities:
    (i) Target practice using an identifiable, artificially constructed target or targets.
    (ii) Practice with silhouettes, plinking, skeet, or trap.
    (iii) Sighting-in the firearm, bow and arrow, or crossbow.
    (b) The person is, or is accompanied by or has the permission of, either of the following: (i) The owner of the property on which the activity under subdivision (a) is taking place. (ii) The lessee of that property for a term of not less than 1 year.
    (c) The owner or lessee of the property does not receive remuneration for the activity under subdivision (a).
    (3) A person may carry or possess an unloaded weapon at any time if the person is traveling to or from or participating in a historical reenactment.

    still looking.............
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
    American Tactical Imports C45 45 AP
    S&W sigma 40 Cal
    Bersa 380 Thunder Plus
    Hi point C9 9mm
    Chiappa 1911-22 Semi-Auto .22 LR

    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

  20. #20
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Maybee, Michigan
    Posts
    679
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    thanks. its been a long time since I thought about this one.
    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure;
    forging application; implementation during business hours.


    (12) This section does not apply to a person who possesses a pistol if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The person is not otherwise prohibited from possessing a pistol.
    (b) The person is at a recognized target range or shooting facility.
    (c) The person possesses the pistol for the purpose of target practice or instruction in the safe use of a
    pistol.

    (d) The owner of the pistol is physically present and supervising the use of the pistol.
    (13) The licensing authority shall provide a basic pistol safety brochure to each applicant for a license
    under this section before the applicant answers the basic pistol safety review questionnaire. A basic pistol safety brochure shall contain, but is not limited to providing, information on all of the following subjects:
    (a) Rules for safe handling and use of pistols.
    (b) Safe storage of pistols.
    (c) Nomenclature and description of various types of pistols.
    (d) The responsibilities of owning a pistol.
    (14) The basic pistol safety brochure shall be supplied in addition to the safety pamphlet required by

    imo and I played a Klingon once but never a lawyer on TV, he can carry it at a target range, not on the street
    I am sure the other cite was for LONG GUNS
    Last edited by Onnie; 03-06-2012 at 05:40 PM.
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
    American Tactical Imports C45 45 AP
    S&W sigma 40 Cal
    Bersa 380 Thunder Plus
    Hi point C9 9mm
    Chiappa 1911-22 Semi-Auto .22 LR

    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

  21. #21
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Hudsonville , Michigan, USA
    Posts
    3,337
    Quote Originally Posted by Onnie View Post
    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure;
    forging application; implementation during business hours.


    (12) This section does not apply to a person who possesses a pistol if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The person is not otherwise prohibited from possessing a pistol.
    (b) The person is at a recognized target range or shooting facility.
    (c) The person possesses the pistol for the purpose of target practice or instruction in the safe use of a
    pistol.

    (d) The owner of the pistol is physically present and supervising the use of the pistol.
    (13) The licensing authority shall provide a basic pistol safety brochure to each applicant for a license
    under this section before the applicant answers the basic pistol safety review questionnaire. A basic pistol safety brochure shall contain, but is not limited to providing, information on all of the following subjects:
    (a) Rules for safe handling and use of pistols.
    (b) Safe storage of pistols.
    (c) Nomenclature and description of various types of pistols.
    (d) The responsibilities of owning a pistol.
    (14) The basic pistol safety brochure shall be supplied in addition to the safety pamphlet required by

    imo and I played a Klingon once but never a lawyer on TV, he can carry it at a target range, not on the street
    I am sure the other city was for LONG GUNS
    Notice the law only allows such borrowing "if all of the following conditions apply:", the most important one being that "(d) The owner of the pistol is physically present and supervising the use of the pistol."
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  22. #22
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Davisburg, Michigan, United States
    Posts
    8,948
    Nice job Onnie.

  23. #23
    Regular Member Onnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Maybee, Michigan
    Posts
    679
    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Notice the law only allows such borrowing "if all of the following conditions apply:", the most important one being that "(d) The owner of the pistol is physically present and supervising the use of the pistol."
    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Nice job Onnie.
    yep, thats why its bolded and tnx
    When Guns are OUTLAWED, Ill be an OUTLAW
    American Tactical Imports C45 45 AP
    S&W sigma 40 Cal
    Bersa 380 Thunder Plus
    Hi point C9 9mm
    Chiappa 1911-22 Semi-Auto .22 LR

    Im not a lawyer, but I did play a Klingon once at Universal Studios

  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Eastpointe Michigan
    Posts
    415
    Quote Originally Posted by pacman552SD View Post
    hi i was wondering if there is anything to stop me from takeing a CPL class this summer when im only 19 years old so that when i turn 21 in september 2013 i could apply for my cpl right when i turn 21
    As far as the NRA Course (That's what most classes are) goes, you can take it at 18, and the law provides no expiration date on the certificate so you can take it now, and wait if you want to, and your certificate will still be good, no need to retake it.

    I will be holding a class in the not to distant future (I'm an instructor) if you want to sign up, I have no issues teaching you. As far as gun rental goes if you need one the range, may, or may not do it, but I will, just bring a note from your parents saying you can (just to cover all my bases the law).
    Last edited by Small_Arms_Collector; 03-08-2012 at 07:55 PM.

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Eastpointe Michigan
    Posts
    415
    Quote Originally Posted by pacman552SD View Post
    this is what i have heard too, i was hopeing someone would have a little more info on if it is true there is a timelimit after you take the class to when you apply to get the cpl.

    i have guns availible to me to use for carry and compleating the range time for the class
    No time limit.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •