Shouting 'USA!USA!' is racist..

fire suppressor said:

First off really? I can't even take pride in my country anymore without being racist!? I do not think that is what the founding fathers had in mind when they where dying to give us our rights. I could understand someone arguing the chant to maybe be derogatory or maybe intimidating... maybe but racist? I am not so sure. America was founded by Englishmen yes but then it was largely populated by people from all over the world. We are made up of such a diverse varying amounts of cultures to to form this country to say that only one race is yelling at another simply makes me laugh.

On a 2nd thought we are all so worried about offending each other now in this politically correct world we no long know how deal with our emotions. Part of growing up is hearing your parents tell you no and hearing people express views that are different than yours. We are not doing ours kids any favors by teaching them to be so intolerant or disobedient to one and other.

To get back on track I am not sure this was a case of racism as much as you could have called it intimidation but I think that is even a stretch. People need to find them selfs a hobby because all this politically correct lets makes the rules up as we go along stuff is getting way out of control

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Don't go blowing things out of proportion, you can take pride in being American. The context is what's at issue here, and the context was not one that you would typically here "USA" chanting; why not chant their school name, or their mascott? Because there were other motives to their chanting "USA."

Let's get something straight here: Spain sent some individuals out to sea, and they landed ashore on the North American continent where there were Native Americans. So, Caucasian people came ashore, slaughtered the Native Americans, and brought a bunch of other Caucasian people, and some African slaves over to occupy this Land.

DocWalker said:

+1

My point exactly, by calling everything racist people become numb to real racism.

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Racism is a matter of degrees. There is subjective Racism such as: me using the term Negro instead of African-American (I believe it ought to be the other way around but whatever), then there is some Aryan running around with a sheet over their head burning a cross and lynching a Negro American, then there is something in-between.

Beretta92FSLady said:

Racism is a matter of degrees.

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This.

However...

It CAN be harmless. Especially in the context of humor or immaturity. I think this is just that.

I don't think these kids should be sanctioned. That's like punishing kids for sexual harassment. Kids are dumb. I did so much bad, stupid **** and was given second chances quite a few times.

To be honest, my first reaction WAS that it is racism. But, does it rise to the level of being some horrendous racial act?

Point in case, growing up I threw f*g and dy*e around more than any 2 people combined. I'm not homophobic by any means. I knew I was being mean but I really didn't understand HOW mean. I sure as hell don't use them now. It was childhood immaturity. That's when we learn. Talk to them at MOST and then let it go. It doesn't mean anything more than the 5 seconds it holds a teenager's attention.

It's like mothers forever keeping their kids clean. It's not healthy. We need to develop a certain level of immunity.


On a side note, if you called me negro I would probably laugh.

Stanley said:

This.

However...

It CAN be harmless. Especially in the context of humor or immaturity. I think this is just that.

[snip].

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I agree, it can be harmless. This context was an immature expression. Was it Racist, yes. Ought the kids be taken out to the wood-shed, NO. The context ought to be established though, and the kids ought to be told that that form of expression is derogatory, IMO, if that was the context which they were chanting "USA..USA."

Hmm, Michelle Obama is Negro, The cashier at the local store that I talk to frequently is African-American (they immigrated from Africa, and they are not American).

I am a dyke. I understand context when someone uses the term Dyke. Hell, they may be refering to an actual Dyke.

Stanley said:

Point in case, growing up I threw f*g and dy*e around more than any 2 people combined. I'm not homophobic by any means. I knew I was being mean but I really didn't understand HOW mean. I sure as hell don't use them now.

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Why? What does it matter? *** and dyke are usually derogatory against gays, but if they really are gay what does it matter? If I was gay I wouldn't take offense to someone calling me gay by any name. If someone thinks of derogatory terms against being straight then you can throw them at me all day, because I am not ashamed of what I am. No one else should be, because we all should be equal.

Beretta92FSLady said:

I agree, it can be harmless. This context was an immature expression. Was it Racist, yes. Ought the kids be taken out to the wood-shed, NO. The context ought to be established though, and the kids ought to be told that that form of expression is derogatory, IMO, if that was the context which they were chanting "USA..USA."

Hmm, Michelle Obama is Negro, The cashier at the local store that I talk to frequently is African-American (they immigrated from Africa, and they are not American).

I am a dyke. I understand context when someone uses the term Dyke. Hell, they may be refering to an actual Dyke.

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Does that mean you are Caucasoid?

09jisaac said:

Why? What does it matter? *** and dyke are usually derogatory against gays, but if they really are gay what does it matter? If I was gay I wouldn't take offense to someone calling me gay by any name. If someone thinks of derogatory terms against being straight then you can throw them at me all day, because I am not ashamed of what I am. No one else should be, because we all should be equal.

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I don't because it's rude and I choose not to. Now if they are a good friend then that's different.

Shrug.

Have we come to this point

this is just my thought on the post.
It saddens me to have lived long enough to see my beloved Country i have fought for degenerate to a point where chanting
USA for any reason was considered wrong. It does not matter what the Kids intent was.


sometimes you can only wish for a Zombie Appocolipse. But with the over population of whoosies in this Country it would most likely give a Zombie food poisoning.

09jisaac said:

If the losing team took it that way then they should go back to where they came from. If it is still in the United States then what is their problem? That is like some people calling blacks "African-American" like they are LESS american than the rest. I am never called "English-American" or "German-American" because I am 100% American. Most people in this country is.

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"It's not us, it's you!"

DocWalker said:

The school from the USA played another school from the USA, if nobody is breaking the law by attending either school illegally then what is the problem.

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This is blatantly ignoring the root issue. No one is claiming that shouting USA is generally racist. They are questioning the context of the chant, the purpose and what it was trying to say.

Stanley said:

Kids do a lot of stuff that can be thoughtless or hurtful but I find it highly dubious that every single one of these kids hates Latinos and in a moment of "white solidarity" decided to ridicule the other team in a racist manner.

Is it just me or are there either 2 Latino kids or a Latino kid and a black kid shouting along with the white kids? EDIT: There's another "brown" kid in there (top left) as well that I missed. So 3 brown kids. At least one, the lower right is Latino. The other 2 are maybes...

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I don't really care if there were black people chanting or not, nor does it matter if there were latinos chanting with them. Again, you are ignoring the root issue here.

This is not a whites vs colored matter. This is an illegal immigration issue.

Media feeds this crap. Can you say divide and conquer?

Jack House said:

I don't really care if there were black people chanting or not, nor does it matter if there were latinos chanting with them. Again, you are ignoring the root issue here.

This is not a whites vs colored matter. This is an illegal immigration issue.

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I didn't miss this at all.

I am saying that it really isn't that big off a deal. Seriously, who here thought of illegal immigration as a teenager?

The fact that there are LATINOS chanting this shows that the incident isn't racist. At least not wholly...

I'm not saying the illegal immigration issue is minor or irrelevant.

I'm saying it's not racially motivated, at least not 100%. The rest is irrelevant to me. I don't see immigration as a right. I also don't see immigration status as a protected status.

And I'm a flaming liberal so... Shrug.

And who is colored? LOLOLOLOL...

When I'm healthy I am black. When I am sick I am black. When I am cold I am black. When I am sunburned (yes I burn) I am black.
When you are healthy you are peach. When you are sick you are grey. When you are cold you are blue. When you are sunburned you are red.
Who you calling colored. I jest... :lol:

Stanley said:

I didn't miss this at all.

I am saying that it really isn't that big off a deal. Seriously, who here thought of illegal immigration as a teenager?

The fact that there are LATINOS chanting this shows that the incident isn't racist. At least not wholly...

I'm not saying the illegal immigration issue is minor or irrelevant.

I'm saying it's not racially motivated, at least not 100%. The rest is irrelevant to me. I don't see immigration as a right. I also don't see immigration status as a protected status.

And I'm a flaming liberal so... Shrug.

And who is colored? LOLOLOLOL...

When I'm healthy I am black. When I am sick I am black. When I am cold I am black. When I am sunburned (yes I burn) I am black.
When you are healthy you are peach. When you are sick you are grey. When you are cold you are blue. When you are sunburned you are red.
Who you calling colored. I jest... :lol:

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lol

All I will say is this, people are being too sensitive now a days. I honestly feel the race card is pulled too much and too easily. Go to a hockey game and hear people chanting USA for the team, go to other sports where the chant USA is used. Does not seem to be an issue for them, so why is it an issue now? Heck in the Olympics people chant and display USA signs, I don't see how in the world that would be considered raciest. If you pick apart any situation it can be turned raciest by some factor. People who look further into a simple statement to look for raciest meaning are the ones who are being sore losers.

Shouting, "USA! USA!", in the context of what happened at the basketball game was most certainly racist. Of course, shouting "USA! USA!", isn't always a racist thing. It can also be shouted in the context of:

1. Egomania
2. Xenophobia
3. Nationalistic Hysteria
4. Empire worship
5. Delusions of Grandeur

ed2276 said:

Shouting, "USA! USA!", in the context of what happened at the basketball game was most certainly racist. Of course, shouting "USA! USA!", isn't always a racist thing. It can also be shouted in the context of:

/snip

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No one has asked this yet and I usually hate when people ask it because it's pedantic but I'll do it just to play devils advocate and taste the other side and for a bit of fun.

Since when is Hispanic a race? At best it's an ethnicity on a good day really it's just a catchall for a variety of races. I'm mixed but mixed isn't a race anymore than Hispanic is. Its a catchall that isnt protected.

So, how is this even remotely racist?

I'm more worried about educators that can't use proper terminology than unruly students.

Honestly at this point I have no idea how to react to this incident. It is best for me to NOT put my full statement down as it might be considered a raciest comment which it wouldn't be in the first place. People need to grow some balls and stop acting like little babies. Chanting USA USA is not in by no means being raciest, go to soccer games or other sports where you see this all the time. Not raciest there? Oh my lord could it be true!

I would be interested to know the immigration status of the person who filed the complaint that started this whole bruuhaha.

Just sayin'...

GhostOfJefferson said:

No, it's true!

For example, I'm not just an American, nor solely a North American, nor strictly just united States citizen, I'm a USA-American!

My race is USA-ian, you see. I surely expect to see "Race: USA-American" on the next census form.

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PC thugs have been pushing "racial" issues so hard that any act of being merely "jingoistic" automatically seems to makes people racist white trash. The only time I've ever seen someone be overtly pro-USA and not reviled in mainstream media was when Kat Williams got into the face of a mexican heckler. The libtards naturally had idiotic things to say, but as usual no one cared.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/29/katt-williams-anti-mexican-rant_n_941125.html

When I was in AIT the EEO NCO had his initial briefing for our class. We had too sit there and listen too PC drivel about how everyone is equal and no one should have too be offended by anyone's jokes, which were no different than overt acts of racial supremecy that excluded people from opportunities they deserved on merit.

When ambiguous acts in everyday life are considered racist, we clearly have a problem.

During our briefing the NCO went around the world and wanted to know what sort of hyphenated-American we were. Everyone else answered in PC terms. I balked, I said I was a "redneck-American". He asked me too elaborate, so I said I guess I'm a "native". He asked "What tribe?" I replied I didn't know, since all the polaks, krauts, slavs and limies I decended from never claimed one. This drew his ire and in no uncertain terms I was told to explain myself. I said I have no loyalty to any nation or people than the US, and since I was born here I was "native'. He informed me that being "native" meant you were from a list of tribes.

After I said that was stupid because all those tribes merely emigrated several thousand years before my kinfolk, who didn't get here until after the "natives" were on reservations, so at what point in a person's geneology do they get to claim "native status"? I was told it was in my best interest to keep my radical ideas too myself, and if I pushed the issue we might have to take it up with the Battalion Commander.

The briefing ended shortly thereafter, and the rest of the class's ethnicity wasn't questioned.

Stanley said:

I didn't miss this at all.

I am saying that it really isn't that big off a deal. Seriously, who here thought of illegal immigration as a teenager?

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You're black, so you must be inhuman. Still not a big deal? It's not exactly the same as "you're Hispanic, so you must not be a legal American," but that's the extent of the differences. The core of it is still the same, xenophobic bigotry.

Stanley said:

The fact that there are LATINOS chanting this shows that the incident isn't racist. At least not wholly...

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That doesn't mean anything. They can be just as racist towards 'their own people' as a white man can be towards a black man. And even if they're just chanting because it's the thing to do, doesn't mean everyone else was.

So again, you have missed the core issue. This isn't a white vs Hispanic issue. It's an illegal immigration issue.

Stanley said:

I'm not saying the illegal immigration issue is minor or irrelevant.

I'm saying it's not racially motivated, at least not 100%. The rest is irrelevant to me. I don't see immigration as a right. I also don't see immigration status as a protected status.

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I'm not saying it is racially motivated. I'm saying that, if it is indeed a case of racism, then it is motivated by illegal immigration. The illegal immigration issue is out of control on both sides. In this case, it's a matter of so much passion, fear and hyperbole poured into the illegal immigration issue that a lot of people are starting to just automatically assume that if you're of Hispanic descent, you must be an illegal. That is racism. Racism is very rarely motivated by simple skin color. It starts out as something different. Take the Japanese during WWII for example. The issue wasn't their skin color, it was the fact the Japanese were attacking our nation and they could be spies.

Stanley said:

And I'm a flaming liberal so... Shrug.

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So what? I'm a flaming conservative. I don't see the significance.

Stanley said:

And who is colored? LOLOLOLOL...

When I'm healthy I am black. When I am sick I am black. When I am cold I am black. When I am sunburned (yes I burn) I am black.
When you are healthy you are peach. When you are sick you are grey. When you are cold you are blue. When you are sunburned you are red.
Who you calling colored. I jest... :lol:

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Who says I'm white?

Stanley said:

No one has asked this yet and I usually hate when people ask it because it's pedantic but I'll do it just to play devils advocate and taste the other side and for a bit of fun.

Since when is Hispanic a race? At best it's an ethnicity on a good day really it's just a catchall for a variety of races. I'm mixed but mixed isn't a race anymore than Hispanic is. Its a catchall that isnt protected.

So, how is this even remotely racist?

I'm more worried about educators that can't use proper terminology than unruly students.

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So basically it's bigotry against those of Hispanic descent is all gravy because they're not a part of your definition of a protected class? This smacks of "only us" sentimentality. And it's most certainly racist. If there are going to be antidiscrimination laws, then they can not stop at only protecting those deemed a 'minority,' it must protect all people regardless of what label or group society or even themselves assign to them. Anything less is flat-out discrimination.

Jack House said:

You're black, so you must be inhuman. Still not a big deal? It's not exactly the same as "you're Hispanic, so you must not be a legal American," but that's the extent of the differences. The core of it is still the same, xenophobic bigotry.

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We were talking racism, not xenophobia. And no, you are merely assuming they were being bigoted. Presence of Latinos precludes an overall racist intent.

That doesn't mean anything. They can be just as racist towards 'their own people' as a white man can be towards a black man. And even if they're just chanting because it's the thing to do, doesn't mean everyone else was.

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A. Still not "racism"
B. That was my point. You don't know how many truly were being racist. Period. Odds are few if any.
C. Still irrelevant. These are children.

So again, you have missed the core issue. This isn't a white vs Hispanic issue. It's an illegal immigration issue.

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You are missing the issue. The issue is a claim of racism. There is no racism. None that you can prove in any case.
Immigration is not germane to the discussion.

I'm not saying it is racially motivated. I'm saying that, if it is indeed a case of racism, then it is motivated by illegal immigration. The illegal immigration issue is out of control on both sides. In this case, it's a matter of so much passion, fear and hyperbole poured into the illegal immigration issue that a lot of people are starting to just automatically assume that if you're of Hispanic descent, you must be an illegal. That is racism. Racism is very rarely motivated by simple skin color. It starts out as something different. Take the Japanese during WWII for example. The issue wasn't their skin color, it was the fact the Japanese were attacking our nation and they could be spies.

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One problem. Hispanic is NOT a race...

Therefore it CAN'T be racism. Hate to get all technical on you. If you claim it is then you either don't know the definition of racism or Hispanic.

So what? I'm a flaming conservative. I don't see the significance.

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Sigh...

Who says I'm white?

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Holy hell... What's wrong with you?

So basically it's bigotry against those of Hispanic descent is all gravy because they're not a part of your definition of a protected class? This smacks of "only us" sentimentality. And it's most certainly racist. If there are going to be antidiscrimination laws, then they can not stop at only protecting those deemed a 'minority,' it must protect all people regardless of what label or group society or even themselves assign to them. Anything less is flat-out discrimination.

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A. NOT racism. Clearly they belong to multiple races. Hispanic is not one of them. Pedantic but accurate.
B. Don't lecture me on racism. If you can't distinguish between racism, xenophobia, nationalism or plain discrimination you need to study up.
C. Your entire argument is based in assumptions you can't back up. You are merely assuming things which may or may not be true.
D. PROVE the intent of those kids and then start talking discrimination.

Until then you are blowing smoke. I'm pretty quick to see racism. I've experienced racism. Verbal, physical, subtle and in your face violent. I've called out people here in this forum.

I grew up in Texas. El Paso, then Bryan. I'm well versed in immigration issues.

It's not racism. Simple as that. It's kids being stupid. Calm down... No one broke out water hoses.

If you don't agree... whatever.

Seriously, how did I end up on this side of the argument? Wow, ok, I think I get what some people were saying before about the irrationality...