• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

HB 5050 and 5051

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
HB 5050 and 5051
THE APPARENT PROBLEM:
Federal law makes it a crime to intentionally lie to an FBI agent. But if a person deliberately lies to a state or local police officer in the course of a criminal investigation,there are no penalties. According to law enforcement officers and county prosecutors,some people purposely fabricate lies to throw investigators off the track. Whether to protect themselves or others, such lies waste valuable time and resources in apprehending criminals. While law enforcement follows up on worthless leads, a perpetrator is free to commit other crimes.

A few states have enacted laws that make it a crime to knowingly and intentionally lie topolice when questioned in a criminal investigation. Many in law enforcement in thisstate believe enacting a similar law would give them an important tool to fight a rising
tide of crime.


http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/2011-2012/billanalysis/Senate/pdf/2011-SFA-5050-S.pdf

CONTENT
House Bill 5050 (H-4) would amend the Michigan Penal Code to prohibit and prescribe criminal penalties for concealing a material fact from a peace officer, or misleading a peace officer regarding a material fact, in a criminal investigation of a felony or a misdemeanor described in the bill.

House Bill 5051 (H-1) would amend the Code of Criminal Procedure to include in the sentencing guidelines an offense proposed by House Bill 5050 (H-4).
The bills would take effect 90 days after their enactment. House Bill 5051 (H-1) is tiebarred to House Bill 5050.
House Bill 5050 (H-4)

Under the bill, if a peace officer informed a person that he or she was conducting a criminal investigation, the person could not knowingly and willfully do any of the following:

-- Conceal from the peace officer, by any trick, scheme, or device, any material fact relating to the criminal investigation.
-- Make any statement to the peace officer that the person knew was false or misleading regarding a material fact in the criminal investigation.
-- Issue or otherwise provide any writing or document to the peace officer that the person knew was false or misleading regarding a material fact in the criminal investigation.
 
Last edited:

PDinDetroit

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2009
Messages
2,328
Location
SE, Michigan, USA
The Bill does not Define nor reference any Statutory Definition of "material fact". Does this mean that it would be subjective based upon the case being investigated?

I really do not like that the "punishment does not fit the crime" for trying to tie a person lying to another possible crime, which may or may not change in severity based upon multiple factors that may not be able to determined at the time the "lie" occurred.

Reminds me of this:

[video=youtube;j4XT-l-_3y0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4XT-l-_3y0[/video]
 

griffin

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
871
Location
Okemos, MI
Logical question: If police are allowed to lie to us, why shouldn't we be allowed to lie to them?
 

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
The Bill does not Define nor reference any Statutory Definition of "material fact". Does this mean that it would be subjective based upon the case being investigated?

I really do not like that the "punishment does not fit the crime" for trying to tie a person lying to another possible crime, which may or may not change in severity based upon multiple factors that may not be able to determined at the time the "lie" occurred.

Reminds me of this:

[video=youtube;j4XT-l-_3y0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4XT-l-_3y0[/video]


I agree, kind of wide open. Better to remain silent.
 

stainless1911

Banned
Joined
Dec 19, 2009
Messages
8,855
Location
Davisburg, Michigan, United States
logical question: If police are allowed to lie to us, why shouldn't we be allowed to lie to them?


QFT.jpg
 
Last edited:

Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
HB 5050 and 5051
THE APPARENT PROBLEM:
Federal law makes it a crime to intentionally lie to an FBI agent. But if a person deliberately lies to a state or local police officer in the course of a criminal investigation,there are no penalties. According to law enforcement officers and county prosecutors,some people purposely fabricate lies to throw investigators off the track. Whether to protect themselves or others, such lies waste valuable time and resources in apprehending criminals. While law enforcement follows up on worthless leads, a perpetrator is free to commit other crimes.

A few states have enacted laws that make it a crime to knowingly and intentionally lie topolice when questioned in a criminal investigation. Many in law enforcement in thisstate believe enacting a similar law would give them an important tool to fight a rising
tide of crime.


http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/2011-2012/billanalysis/Senate/pdf/2011-SFA-5050-S.pdf

CONTENT
House Bill 5050 (H-4) would amend the Michigan Penal Code to prohibit and prescribe criminal penalties for concealing a material fact from a peace officer, or misleading a peace officer regarding a material fact, in a criminal investigation of a felony or a misdemeanor described in the bill.

House Bill 5051 (H-1) would amend the Code of Criminal Procedure to include in the sentencing guidelines an offense proposed by House Bill 5050 (H-4).
The bills would take effect 90 days after their enactment. House Bill 5051 (H-1) is tiebarred to House Bill 5050.
House Bill 5050 (H-4)

Under the bill, if a peace officer informed a person that he or she was conducting a criminal investigation, the person could not knowingly and willfully do any of the following:

-- Conceal from the peace officer, by any trick, scheme, or device, any material fact relating to the criminal investigation.
-- Make any statement to the peace officer that the person knew was false or misleading regarding a material fact in the criminal investigation.
-- Issue or otherwise provide any writing or document to the peace officer that the person knew was false or misleading regarding a material fact in the criminal investigation.

Not immediately confessing your misdeeds in exquisite detail wastes' valuable time & resources', too. They should outlaw the 5th Amendment, while they're at it. Then we can start on the 8th. What a waste of time & energy, bothering judges & such, getting warrants when you just KNOW the evidence is 'in there'.....

 
Top