Democrat "patriotism"

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/vets-angry-over-american-flag-featuring-obama/nLR5Q/#comments

When I refer too obama supporters as "zealots" and "acolytes", perhaps I'm not too far off.

Well, it seems you can't deny that they have a religious outlook now... seeing as they Do worship a "sort of a God"

Fallschirmjäger said:

Well, it seems you can't deny that they have a religious outlook now... seeing as they Do worship a "sort of a God"

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Be careful, you could be accused of religious bigotry. Obamaphobia...

:lol:

I just saw this on Fox News, and while I'm sure the Monster I'm drinking isn't helping, it really got my heart rate going with how angry I am over this. The fact that the Democrats thought this was OK and then tried to spin it as "well they're only upset because they can't accept Obama as POTUS" is just absolutely infuriating to the point that I'm at a loss for words for how to properly describe how I feel over this.

Fallschirmjäger said:

Well, it seems you can't deny that they have a religious outlook now... seeing as they Do worship a "sort of a God"

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Evil when a minority of Democrats do it, and so horrid that someone would some regular man's face on the flag. But, would you say the same for the many hundreds, if not thousands, of U.S. Flag's I have seen in the south and bible belt, who do the exact same thing? Few of them bearing yet another man's face, others just a plain crux.

What a shame

that the veterans don't respect the free speech rights of others - the very rights they fought to preserve.

DrakeZ07 said:

Evil when a minority of Democrats do it, and so horrid that someone would some regular man's face on the flag. But, would you say the same for the many hundreds, if not thousands, of U.S. Flag's I have seen in the south and bible belt, who do the exact same thing? Few of them bearing yet another man's face, others just a plain crux.

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I've never seen anyone place anyone else's face on a US flag, and I would just as easily find it contemptible if someone put any other symbols on it. Unfortunately the only people I see consistently desecrate the flag are leftists. Wether it was the pictures of hippie scum in the 60's with flags sewn on their asses while waving the NVA flag, or the crap below that I've seen in DC protests.







It's all equally disrespectful, and equally as contemptable.

DCR said:

that the veterans don't respect the free speech rights of others - the very rights they fought to preserve.

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Voicing outrage is just as valid a form of speech. No one was looking for laws prohibiting anything. Of course when it comes to bed wetters, only their speech should be free.

DrakeZ07 said:

Evil when a minority of Democrats do it, and so horrid that someone would some regular man's face on the flag. But, would you say the same for the many hundreds, if not thousands, of U.S. Flag's I have seen in the south and bible belt, who do the exact same thing? Few of them bearing yet another man's face, others just a plain crux.

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Got any links to photos of those hundreds, if not thousands?

Not saying you are not truthful, just that I am from AND in the south and I don't see any US flags with a face in place of the stars....until now.

Oh, I do get around the south, on hunting trips and fishing trips. Been around the south quite a bit when I drove a truck for a living.

Obviously not to every little hamlet or villiage, but I've been around the south for over the past 30 years or so.

DrakeZ07 said:

Evil when a minority of Democrats do it, and so horrid that someone would some regular man's face on the flag. But, would you say the same for the many hundreds, if not thousands, of U.S. Flag's I have seen in the south and bible belt, who do the exact same thing? Few of them bearing yet another man's face, others just a plain crux.

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Ah, but I do wonder, would your vaunted respect for free speech have been as pronounced had this happened in 2004 with Dubya placed on the flag by some evangelical group? Also curious, how is expressing disdain for this or anything else denying anybody their rights?

They have every right to do this, I don't have a partisan dog in this fight. That said, it's been my experience that "both" pretend sides of the statist coin are just happy as corn fuzz to scream for their freedoms when they are doing something others look down on, but change masks the moment their pretend opposition does something they disapprove of. People, sheesh.

I'd be kinda interested in seeing a few myself.
There must at least be a few online, if there are that many.

And just as unacceptable IMO as the court allowing this tribe to kill two of our national birds. Their resaon is BS. Is this more BS social justice?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/14/wyoming-native-american-tribe-gets-rare-permit-to-kill-bald-eagles/,

GhostOfJefferson said:

Ah, but I do wonder, would your vaunted respect for free speech have been as pronounced had this happened in 2004 with Dubya placed on the flag by some evangelical group? Also curious, how is expressing disdain for this or anything else denying anybody their rights?

They have every right to do this, I don't have a partisan dog in this fight. That said, it's been my experience that "both" pretend sides of the statist coin are just happy as corn fuzz to scream for their freedoms when they are doing something others look down on, but change masks the moment their pretend opposition does something they disapprove of. People, sheesh.

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+1

GhostOfJefferson said:

*SNIP*Ah, but I do wonder, would your vaunted respect for free speech have been as pronounced had this happened in 2004 with Dubya placed on the flag by some evangelical group? Also curious, how is expressing disdain for this or anything else denying anybody their rights? /SNIP

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Probably not, President Obama, isn't as bad as Dubya to the scale as a whole, he's yet to drag us into a war lasting longer than Vietnam, and yet to invade a sovereign nation for no other reason than revenge, oil, and corrupt capitalists. I.E.; Pres. Obama has not invaded North Korea, Iran, or Libya, and set in stage for us to stay there for more than a decade. Pres. Obama has not made up BS False accusations, wasted Government money on false, Photoshopped satellite pictures, and launched us into another war with a different middle-eastern, Islamic country. But for the sake of being "fair and equal", he's about to get four more years to do just that, since he's already went on par with Fmr. President Bush JR's policies, economic socialism, and fascist mis-use of the constitution to impoverish, and deny rights to American Citizens

OC for ME said:

Got any links to photos of those hundreds, if not thousands?
Not saying you are not truthful, just that I am from AND in the south and I don't see any US flags with a face in place of the stars....until now.
Oh, I do get around the south, on hunting trips and fishing trips. Been around the south quite a bit when I drove a truck for a living.
Obviously not to every little hamlet or villiage, but I've been around the south for over the past 30 years or so.

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Sorry for shortening your paragraph there, went too far below the page on my iPhone.

Anyone can use the major search engines for "Jesus face on U.S. Flags" or "US Flag with Jesus"; On google images, within the first two pages, last I looked two hours ago, there's seven with his face in place of the stars.

Now, I've may not have been around as long as you, nor have I been to every state in the south, my experiance and what I've seen, has been primarily along the KY/VA border, and along US31 (I think it was 31, or 31A) that I took while heading down to Huntsville, AL for a FurCon; Many different incarnations of the U.S. Flag with Jesus either within the stripes, or in the place of the stars. In both areas.

jbone said:

And just as unacceptable IMO as the court allowing this tribe to kill two of our national birds. Their resaon is BS. Is this more BS social justice?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/14/wyoming-native-american-tribe-gets-rare-permit-to-kill-bald-eagles/,

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Ooh, there might be some good precedent in there, though:

William Downes, then a federal judge in Wyoming, dismissed the charge against Friday in 2006 saying it would have been pointless for him to apply for a permit. Downes said the federal government generally refuses to grant permits to tribal members to kill eagles even though federal regulations say such permits should be available.

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Yeah a dismissed charge probably isn't a legal precedent, but it's the principle of the ruling that I like.

PrayingForWar said:

It's all equally disrespectful, and equally as contemptable.

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We shouldn't place so much weight in symbols. They are open to interpretation and their meaning may differ from the sender to the recipient.

Whether burning a flag is disrespectful or the proper means of disposal depends on the intent of the person burning it, doesn't it? Therefore, if you care about such things (I confess I don't), you must accept that the intent of the person doing whatever with the flag is important to your own reaction thereto.

Keep in mind, most of these flags aren't intended to piss you off. It's a way of saying, "Hey, I'm gay, and gay rights are important to me, but I'm also a patriotic American, and to me the two go hand in hand", or "Hey, I'm a neo-nazi, and I love being an American!"

You don't have to like those messages, but it's just as silly to twist it into something tantamount to an intentional act of disrespect because it offends your sensibilities, as it is to have some silly variation on the American flag in the first place.

Symbols should have merit, or not, based on the merit of the ideas they represent, or are intended to represent.

Giving a symbol inherent value and meaning (which none can possibly have), is no more enlightened a form of patriotism than is equating love of country with love of government, or worse government's "leader".

Just my opinion, folks.

jbone said:

And just as unacceptable IMO as the court allowing this tribe to kill two of our national birds. Their resaon is BS. Is this more BS social justice?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/14/wyoming-native-american-tribe-gets-rare-permit-to-kill-bald-eagles/,

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See, once again, they aren't doing it to piss you off, they're doing it to get some spiritual eagle feather or some nonsense.

Who gives a crap?

And consider what you're doing. You're taking an act which, in intent, has nothing to do with expression, you're equating it with expression (why else would it matter that the Eagle is a national symbol, unless you're equating the act with desecration thereof), and then declaring it "unacceptable".

There is no such thing as "unacceptable" expression, There is only expression which you don't like. And nobody gives a damn whether you like their expression. Nor should they.

PrayingForWar said:

Voicing outrage is just as valid a form of speech. No one was looking for laws prohibiting anything.

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Then what is the point? Who cares about your outrage, or theirs, if they are just voicing it to make themselves feel better? Don't we all have better things to discuss, other than things people do which annoy us?

Next up: I'm going to create a thread with all kinds of strongly worded language and insinuation on the topic of my hatred for rap, hip-hop, and all things "urban" in music. I'll find some Veterans who share my displeasure, just to make my opinion seem somehow relevant to anything at all of any merit. I'm not going to call for its ban, I'm just going to argue vociferously that its mere existence is an insult to me, my country, and everything I love (which it is, seriously). I'm assuming you'll all join me, and care?

marshaul said:

We shouldn't place so much weight in symbols. They are open to interpretation and their meaning may differ from the sender to the recipient.

Whether burning a flag is disrespectful or the proper means of disposal depends on the intent of the person burning it, doesn't it? Therefore, if you care about such things (I confess I don't), you must accept that the intent of the person doing whatever with the flag is important to your own reaction thereto.

Keep in mind, most of these flags aren't intended to piss you off. It's a way of saying, "Hey, I'm gay, and gay rights are important to me, but I'm also a patriotic American, and to me the two go hand in hand", or "Hey, I'm a neo-nazi, and I love being an American!"

You don't have to like those messages, but it's just as silly to twist it into something tantamount to an intentional slight because it offends your sensibilities, as it is to have some silly variation on the American flag in the first place.

Symbols should have merit, or not, baed on the merit of the ideas they represent, or are intended to represent.

Giving a symbol inherent value and meaning (which none can possibly have), is no more enlightened a form of patriotism than is equating love of country with love of government, or worse government's "leader".

Just my opinion, folks.

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You raise a valid point, perhaps I'm hypersensitive to what I consider defacing the flag. I just wouldn't approve of anyone's symbols on it, regardless of their intent. I view it as a lack of respect, though I wouldn't push for laws against it.


People use the Statue of Liberty holding a variety of things to either promote an agenda, or sell things. I don't care for the commercial use of the symbol, but it isn't that big of a deal either. I will say the "cult of personality" surrounding the moonbat messiah is the most disturbing aspect of this issue.

marshaul said:

Snip... I'm going to create a thread with all kinds of strongly worded language and insinuation on the topic of my hatred for rap, hip-hop, and all things "urban" in music.

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You'll be called a racist, not that you'd care either.

PrayingForWar said:

You'll be called a racist, not that you'd care either.

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LOL! Right on both counts, I suspect.

By the way, one of the veterans said:

"If you've been a veteran and fought -- and some died for this flag -- you don't want to see it desecrated. That's how simple it is," Van Beck said.

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Frankly, I'm not sure what to think about someone who fights and dies for a flag rather than, say, freedom. Which includes, you know, the freedom of doing tacky and tasteless things with flags.

Sounds to me like such a person is fighting for a government (for which the flag is ultimately a symbol), rather than the ideas which our society cherishes (or used to cherish).

I might say that I find that a little disrespectful. Certainly no less disrespectful than some ridiculous Obama Messiah flag, which I find too hilariously stupid to really even think of as disrespectful.

It's kind of like, a retarded kid might give me the finger, but you know what? I'm not going to let that bother me. It probably doesn't mean to him what it does to me. He is, after all, a retard.

PrayingForWar said:

I will say the "cult of personality" surrounding the moonbat messiah is the most disturbing aspect of this issue.

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Ah! Now you've got me on board (now that we're talking about what the symbol is intended to represent).

And I agree completely. Citizen made an excellent post recently regarding the difference in perception of the office of President from the time of its inception to today.

People should be more concerned with electing representatives who actually consider the concerns of their constituency, rather than electing some figurehead who pretends to represent their "side" in the fictitious left-vs-right "debate". (The best part is the cute way in which everyone and all their friends are conveniently on the same "side". Politics isn't about thought anymore, it's about pretending you're smart and cool for your friends. Disgusting.)