Obama Administration to Ban Re-Importation of 300,000 M1911's

Here's a quote from an email I just received from NAGR:

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I just found out that Obama, Clinton and the ATF are banning historic 1911 Colt .45 pistols!

You see, my staff and I have been fighting against Obama’s ban on re-importing nearly ONE MILLION M1 Garand and M1 Carbine rifles.

And NAGR members like you have made your voice heard!

But my staff has just uncovered evidence Obama is blocking over 300,000 1911 Colts, too!

That’s well over one million firearms they are gleefully keeping out of American hands.

These guns were made here. They are part of America’s proud heritage and they belong to U.S. taxpayers.

If these firearms came back home, HUGE numbers of law-abiding, freedom-loving gun owners will be able to own one.

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Comments?? Pax...

What is NAGR, and is there a link to verify these potential pistol importations?

MAC702 said:

What is NAGR, and is there a link to verify these potential pistol importations?

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Sorry, Mac, I assumed everybody was familiar with the National Association for Gun Rights. And this would not really be an "importation", as these are American-made - taxpayer bought - firearms being recovered from WWII and Korea. As for a link, there are quite a few (most of which are based upon this same email), but none yet that are independent of the gun rights movement. I'm sure you heard, just a couple of months ago through the lamestream media, that this administration already went thumbs down on the return of approximately 1,000,000 M1 Garands, from Korea and the Philippines. No? No surprise there. These are the kinds of things that take nothing more than a presidential "No" at a cabinet meeting, and they just don't happen. It doesn't require Congressional approval, or even a review. There's nobody in the cabinet that wasn't hand picked by the sitting president, so they will never take an opposing position for fear of losing their political plum job, or suffering presidential wrath. It doesn't get press coverage because the left doesn't want it to get into the media. (Any discussion is sub rosa, and any actions taken are kept 'under the radar'. There is no "Sunshine Law" in Washington, D.C.) Pax...

Back in my Navy days, mid 80's, Uncle Sam was paying $75 for a new in the paper wrapper 1911 from Springfield Armory. If we can get these back into this country and they are made available to us regular folks, I ain't paying no $1000 for a surplus 1911. $200 or so is fine. Even a match 1911 (barrel, link, sights, ect.) was no more than $250 total if I had to build one. They can stay where they currently are if they jack up the price.

A better question is, where is the millions of rounds of .45 ball that Uncle Sam had to feed his 1911's?

This is stupid.... However - If we had not been involved in Korea they never would have been there in the first place!

vermonter said:

This is stupid.... However - If we had not been involved in Korea they never would have been there in the first place!

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And you talk about "stupid"? Reality (and, I know that's a difficult concept for some folks to get their head around) is, that we were involved in Korea, and many of those 300,000 M1911s are there. There are more scattered around the world as remnants of WWII, which we were also involved in. What's "stupid" is Obama's refusal to allow their re-introduction into the USA... their country of origin! Pax...

If they were brought to the U.S., how would they be distributed/sold?

beebobby said:

If they were brought to the U.S., how would they be distributed/sold?

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Most likely offered for sale to the public through the DCM. It would be one small step towrd reducing the "national/public debt". It's also possible (but doubtful) that they would be distributed reserve units for initial training. (More likely is that the present administration would direct that they be destroyed. ) Pax...

Gil223 said:

Most likely offered for sale to the public through the DCM. ...

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The CMP (nee DCM) does not sell imported guns, which these are. Same with the Korean Garands and Carbines. They will be sold to American distributors like (just guessing here) JG Sales, AIM Surplus, Southern Ohio Guns, etc, maybe even Big 5 Sporting Goods and Cabelas.

Yes, there is a difference between non-imported American guns and imported American guns.

...More likely is that the present administration would direct that they be destroyed.

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The good news is that if the importation is allowed, the government cannot do so for the purpose of destroying them. They will be imported directly to the distributors for sale, just like any other foreign good sold at Wal-Mart.

I wonder what 300K guns would do to the gun market. As in supply-and-demand. As in the market becomes flooded with 300K guns. What happens to existing producers?

Watch for Taurus, Smith & Wesson, Ruger, etc., to support such a ban.

MAC702 said:

The CMP (nee DCM) does not sell imported guns, which these are. Same with the Korean Garands and Carbines. They will be sold to American distributors like (just guessing here) JG Sales, AIM Surplus, Southern Ohio Guns, etc, maybe even Big 5 Sporting Goods and Cabelas.

Yes, there is a difference between non-imported American guns and imported American guns.

The good news is that if the importation is allowed, the government cannot do so for the purpose of destroying them. They will be imported directly to the distributors for sale, just like any other foreign good sold at Wal-Mart.

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Inasmuch as they are being "brought from a foreign source", I suppose that a strict dictionary definition of the word "imported" would place these guns into that category:
Adj. 1. imported - used of especially merchandise brought from a foreign source; "imported wines"
It just makes no logical sense (to me, anyway) that these American-made guns should be designated as "imports" since, to satisfy Customs, the accompanying Certificate of (Country of) Origin would have to reflect "United States of America".

In my mind, it would also depend upon the conditions under which these firearms found their way to a foreign country - such as loaned, lend-lease or outright sale. I would think a "loan" should be returned without the involvement of any bureaucratic BS, and a "lend-lease" should only require (at the most) a document certifying the fulfillment of the lend-lease agreement. However, a "sale" would make those weapons the property of the foreign government, and if our government desired them back, it would have to purchase them from said foreign government. Then I would consider them to be "imported", even though they were "Born In The USA" (thank you, Bruce Springsteen). But, that's just the distorted way in which I see things. I'm sure there are those who would disagree with my logic - especially since I haven't provided a Venn Diagram to support my point. Pax...

Citizen said:

I wonder what 300K guns would do to the gun market. As in supply-and-demand. As in the market becomes flooded with 300K guns. What happens to existing producers?

Watch for Taurus, Smith & Wesson, Ruger, etc., to support such a ban.

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Okay... time for another of my world-famous SWAGs (Scientific Wild-Ass Guess, not to be confused with the standard WAG) . The supply would be abundant, no question at all about that. I would imagine that the demand would also be very high, assuming (yes, I know) that these M1911's were made available for less than $125, since there are those of us who revere the 1911 and would just love to add one with some history behind it to our collection, and there are those first time buyers whose budgets - especially at this point in time - do not permit them to spend 3X that amount for a new, relatively inexpensive 1911 Norinco or RIA clone ("inexpensive" as compared to Colt, Kimber, Springfield, etc). The current producers would probably feel the impact some, but not enough to drive them out of business. That SWAG is based upon another assumption - that the firearms wholesalers and distributors don't buy them all in lots of 1,000-10,000 or more, prior to their arrival at the POE. Again, the preceding is all unsupported conjecture, and not stated as fact of any kind - simply my answer to a question. Pax...

There is nothing new in this issue. American-made surplus military arms have been imported many times in the past. One of my personal M1 Carbines was imported by Blue Sky Arsenal, a common importer at the time. As such, it has less market value than Inland carbines that were not imported but instead brought back by America at the end of the war.

Gil223 said:

...those weapons the property of the foreign government, and if our government desired them back, it would have to purchase them from said foreign government. ...

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They are currently foreign property, yes.

Our government is NOT contemplating buying them. It may have a say in whether or not to allow the importation to the private companies that are looking to distribute them, however.

FYI, if these guns are imported, they will bear the stamp of the importer.

If I were to purchase one and ship it to my house under my FFL, my bound book would not have it labeled as a "Colt" but rather as a "Century Arms Int'l" or whomever the importer is. Domestic arms are listed by manufacturer; foreign arms are listed by importer.

They will never have the value of a non-imported pistol. That said, they will still command some premium prices because of WHAT they are.

Citizen said:

I wonder what 300K guns would do to the gun market. As in supply-and-demand. As in the market becomes flooded with 300K guns. What happens to existing producers?

Watch for Taurus, Smith & Wesson, Ruger, etc., to support such a ban.

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Honestly, I was thinking that didn't seem like very many. I still have no verification from another source that these guns are even a possibility, but if they are, I'm actually wondering if that's enough of them to bring the prices down enough to make them worth buying.

I don't think modern guns, incl 1911 designs, have much to worry about. There are hundreds of thousands of guns on the surplus market right now.

Taurus and S&W are two of the largest importers of firearms. I would imagine they are smart enough not to start digging a slippery slope.