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Thread: North Carolina Flyer

  1. #1
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    North Carolina Flyer

    Flyer has been updated - latest revision is May 24, 2017. The link to the old revision will not work anymore.


    Download it here:

    NC Open Carry Flyer - May 24, 2017 Revision

    Revisions to the May 24, 2017 Flyer:
    1. In the section titled "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited", the GS site for item 5, State Parks, isn't complete. It should read "15A NCAC 12B.0901(a)."
    2. Same section, modified item 4 to describe the location of the demonstrations where carry is prohibited.
    3. Same section, modified item 6 to be more specific about federal buildings and the statute reference.
    4. Same section, replaced item 7 and put in NC 14-269.4 restrictions.
    5. Same section, removed item 8
    6. The footnote for the Durham City Ordinance is outdated. Sec 46-23 was repealed. It was replaced with a reference to Sec 46-22 which still is a prohibition on OC - but instead of in any "public place" it is on city owned property - which includes streets and sidewalks.
    7. Edition date changed from 6/19/2014 to 5/24/2017





    Revisions to the June 19, 2014 Flyer:
    1. Modified the answer to the question "Do I have to Register My Handgun?" by removing the reference to the repealed Durham firearm registration.
    2. Included the new bs ordinance from Durham about restricting the display of firearms at any public place or public assembly for the question 'So I can just "Carry it" Openly?'
    3. Edition date changed from 10/6/2013 to 6/19/2014


    I don't agree with the Durham ordinance because the NC Supreme Court has already ruled on the matter, but I figured it should be included because you can get charged.




    Revisions to the October 6, 2013 Flyer:
    1. Added "How old do I need to be to Open Carry?" question
    2. Added "Do I need to be 21 to purchase a handgun?" question
    3. Changed "weapon" to "firearm" under "Won't the police hassle me..." question
    4. Changed "firearm" to "handgun" and "weapon" to "handgun" under "what about while driving?" question
    5. Some formatting changes
    6. Edition date changed from 10/1/2012 to 10/6/2013





    Revisions to the October 1, 2013 Flyer:
    1. Added verbiage referencing State V. Kerner under the "So I can just 'Carry it' openly?" question.
    2. Removed ALL references to Concealed Carry and the CHP. This is, after all, a flyer concerning Open Carry. It would turn into a novel if I were to include all the CC caveats.
    3. Removed Footnote #2
    4. Changed "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited" to list places where only Open Carry is prohibited
    5. Changed Bullet #5 in above from "Areas of Riot" to "State Parks"
    6. Removed Bullet #9 in above regarding CC prohibitions
    7. Removed sentence under above section regarding CC
    8. Edition date changed from 8/17/2012 to 10/1/2013





    From last uprev...
    1. Under 3rd bullet item in the "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited" section, added a closing parentheses to 'Home Schools exempted'
    2. Modified verbiage from "There is no law in North Carolina that prohibits.." to "There is no North Carolina law that prohibits..." under the question "Where can I find the statute that states that I can openly carry my handgun?" in the "Questions Regarding Open Carry" section.
    3. Modified bullet item 9 under "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited:" to read "Carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited on any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice. (14-415.11(c))". It is a bit redundant, but that law is specific to CC.
    4. Removed Footnote detailing restrictions on open carry in Cary, NC. Cary has changed section 22-51.
    5. Removed remark about restrictions in Cary under the "So I can just 'Carry it' openly?" question in the "Questions Regarding Open Carry" section.
    6. Reformatted center column under "FOOTNOTES". Increased font size and vertically center the NC State Constitution quotation.
    7. Edition date changed from 7/11/2012 to 8/17/2012






    From previous uprev...
    I created a new flyer and uploaded it to Google Docs. This was modeled on the last flyer and most of it is copied verbatim. Main changes to the flyer include the changes that occurred on Dec 1, 2011 which include:

    - Removed the prohibition on carry in banks
    - Modified the NC reciprocity information

    Otherwise all the information is the same. Main differences being in some of the graphics and fonts.

    I was thinking about putting in something to cover carry in Parks and Hunting and Fishing reservations and all that, but it seemed somewhat cumbersome for a space constrained flyer. if anyone wants to give it a crack, write something up and we'll see about putting it in.
    Last edited by dmatting; 05-24-2017 at 11:04 AM. Reason: Uprev of Flyer

  2. #2
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    Thank you.

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    That is an awesome source of information. If you by chance have that in whatever format that you created it in, would you mind sharing that? I am a graphic designer and i would like to render it in a high resolution so that i can have it printed with my printing company. And spice it up a little with some textures in the BG since paying for brochures is not cheap and i like to get the most for my $.

    Kinda thought making the whole thing look like old paper like the constitution would be a nice touch.

    Awesome job on compiling it, i hate to know how much time was put into getting all this information in one place.

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    Regular Member PrestonW's Avatar
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    Thank you for your time and work on this flyer.

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    I would like to have this on my phone but i got to the link and the flyer slides down the page

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    Thank you sir. I printed some for me and the wife who also carries.

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    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    Thank you! Every year when I go to NC on vacation I go to the state police website to print out the laws (though it's generally very far out of date). This is SO much better. I just printed copies for spouse and myself; we'll be in NC on vacation next week.

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    I was checking out the revised flyer
    I noticed it is written that guns are prohibited from places with a 'no concealed handguns' sign.
    seems to me this only applies to concealed handguns. obviously a property owner can ask you to leave, but is there some law that specifically states it is illegal to open carry in an area where one is prohibited by a 'no concealed handguns' sign?

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    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    The flyer needs an update post "Bateman v Perdue"

    The flyer needs to be updated to remove the following from "Places where Weapons are prohibited":

    5. Areas of emergency and riot (14-288.7)

    This was found to be unconstitutional by the court in Bateman v Perdue.

    I would also suggest changing "Places where weapons are prohibited:" to "Places where firearms are prohibited:"
    Last edited by carolina guy; 07-01-2012 at 04:28 PM.

  10. #10
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolina guy View Post
    The flyer needs to be updated to remove the following from "Places where Weapons are prohibited":

    5. Areas of emergency and riot (14-288.7)

    This was found to be unconstitutional by the court in Bateman v Perdue.
    I had tried to get some input on this when the decision came in but most just wanted to bicker about the GRNC...

    Thread Here

    My main question on it is how to word it. The statute lists both state of emergencies and riots:
    14‑288.7. Transporting dangerous weapon or substance during emergency; possessing off premises; exceptions.

    (a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, it is unlawful for any person to transport or possess off his own premises any dangerous weapon or substance in any area:

    (1) In which a declared state of emergency exists; or

    (2) Within the immediate vicinity of which a riot is occurring.

    (b) This section does not apply to persons exempted from the provisions of G.S. 14‑269 with respect to any activities lawfully engaged in while carrying out their duties.

    (c) Any person who violates any provision of this section is guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. (1969, c. 869, s. 1; 1993, c. 539, s. 192; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)
    My understanding of the ruling is that it was specifically targeted at the state of emergency ban and not the riot ban. So, perhaps the edit should be:
    5. Areas of riot (14-288.7)3
    The third footnote can say something like:
    3. 14‑288.7(a)(1), which prohibited possession of dangerous weapons in any area in which a declared state of emergency exists, has been ruled unconstitutional in Bateman V. Perdue.
    Quote Originally Posted by carolina guy View Post
    I would also suggest changing "Places where weapons are prohibited:" to "Places where firearms are prohibited:"
    In the context of the flyer, this would seem to make sense.

    There is also an error on one of the statute cites that I need to correct as well. In the bottom middle, the flyer says:
    Carrying a weapon openly or concealed in
    restaurants that serve alcohol and in bars is
    prohibited. (N.C. Gen Stat. 14-415.11(c))
    That should be N.C. Gen Stat. 14-269.3

    Actually, that whole bit is redundant since the same thing is stated in the bullet list right above it - so I'll just get rid of it.
    Last edited by dmatting; 07-03-2012 at 10:02 AM.

  11. #11
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Sounds good

    Changes look good to me.

    A couple questoins...footnote #1... I think that may no longer be applicable...

    First...what is the statute that authorizes Durham County to require registration of handguns? I keep looking and cannot find it.

    I have searched:
    1) NC General Assembly
    2) Municode for handgun, firearm, registration, etc.

    I do not find anything that indicates that the county is different than the other 99 in NC.

    Second...

    From: Amlegal - Browse

    Amlegal Cary, NC

    (highlighting and snipping are my doing)


    Sec. 22-51. Prohibition of the carrying and display of handguns, firearms and other weapons at certain public locations.

    (a) Concealed handguns.

    (1) Possession prohibited. No person shall carry a concealed handgun in town-owned buildings, on the appurtenant premises of those buildings, or in town recreational facilities as defined by G.S. 14-415.23, which are all town playgrounds, athletic fields and athletic facilities. A list of recreational facilities shall be set out in a Schedule of Recreational Facilities at which Concealed Handguns are Prohibited which shall be updated as necessary and retained permanently in the office of the Director, Parks, Recreation and Cultural Resources. Notwithstanding the foregoing, nothing in this section shall prohibit a concealed handgun permittee from securing the handgun within an enclosed compartment of a locked motor vehicle.

    (2) Posting required. The director of public works or designee is hereby authorized and instructed to post conspicuous signage at appropriate locations on or within each recreational facility and each building and the grounds and parking areas of such buildings owned, leased as lessee, operated, occupied, managed or controlled by the town, as well as any other appurtenant premises to such buildings, indicating that carrying a concealed handgun on the properties and locations described in this section is prohibited therein and thereon unless specifically permitted or authorized by state law or the provisions of the town's code of ordinances. The director of public works or designee shall exercise discretion in determining the number and appropriate location of signs to be placed.


    (b) Other firearms and weapons. No person shall display any firearm or other deadly weapon as defined in G.S. 14-269(a), or any knife having a blade of three inches or longer, BB gun, air gun, paintball gun, airsoft gun, bow and arrow or any type of lethal weapon, while on any public street, alley, sidewalk or other public property within the town, including town greenways, unless specifically permitted or authorized by law. No person shall carry or have possession of a knife having a blade of three inches or longer, a BB gun, air gun, paintball gun, airsoft gun, bow and arrow or any type of lethal weapon in any park, including town greenways. This subsection (b) is not applicable to concealed handguns, which are governed by subsection (a) above.

    (c) Exceptions. The possession or display of a firearm or other weapon is exempt from the provisions of this section 22-51 in the following situations:

    <snip>

    (2) If the possession or display of the firearm, or other weapon, was the result of an individual(s) exercising his or her legitimate right to self defense or the defense of others as allowed by law.
    Last edited by carolina guy; 07-03-2012 at 01:50 PM.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  12. #12
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    I'm not sure about getting rid of footnote #1. The ordinance is still there.

    About Durham County registration ... I have never found the law nor the state law allowing it to exist but I keep getting told that it exists - even by Roy Cooper. See HERE - go to page 36, question "F"

    I've also found some discussions on this board regarding this matter as well...
    Here

    Here's an old old WRAL snippet Here

  13. #13
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmatting View Post
    I'm not sure about getting rid of footnote #1. The ordinance is still there.

    About Durham County registration ... I have never found the law nor the state law allowing it to exist but I keep getting told that it exists - even by Roy Cooper. See HERE - go to page 36, question "F"

    I've also found some discussions on this board regarding this matter as well...
    Here

    Here's an old old WRAL snippet Here
    According to the two links, it is NOT an ordinance, rather it was allegedly passed by the General Assembly. I think it has been pre-empted by 14‑409.40 (2002) and the story is from 2000. Further, it appears that Ch 157 contains no mention of Durham at all, and the portion transferred to 160A in 1973 makes no mention of firearms in any manner.

    14‑409.40. Statewide uniformity of local regulation.

    (a) It is declared by the General Assembly that the regulation of firearms is properly an issue of general, statewide concern, and that the entire field of regulation of firearms is preempted from regulation by local governments except as provided by this section.

    (a1) The General Assembly further declares that the lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer of firearms or ammunition to the public is not an unreasonably dangerous activity and does not constitute a nuisance per se and furthermore, that it is the unlawful use of firearms and ammunition, rather than their lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer that is the proximate cause of injuries arising from their unlawful use. This subsection applies only to causes of action brought under subsection (g) of this section.

    (b) Unless otherwise permitted by statute, no county or municipality, by ordinance, resolution, or other enactment, shall regulate in any manner the possession, ownership, storage, transfer, sale, purchase, licensing, or registration of firearms, firearms ammunition, components of firearms, dealers in firearms, or dealers in handgun components or parts.

    (c) Notwithstanding subsection (b) of this section, a county or municipality, by zoning or other ordinance, may regulate or prohibit the sale of firearms at a location only if there is a lawful, general, similar regulation or prohibition of commercial activities at that location. Nothing in this subsection shall restrict the right of a county or municipality to adopt a general zoning plan that prohibits any commercial activity within a fixed distance of a school or other educational institution except with a special use permit issued for a commercial activity found not to pose a danger to the health, safety, or general welfare of persons attending the school or educational institution within the fixed distance.

    (d) No county or municipality, by zoning or other ordinance, shall regulate in any manner firearms shows with regulations more stringent than those applying to shows of other types of items.

    (e) A county or municipality may regulate the transport, carrying, or possession of firearms by employees of the local unit of government in the course of their employment with that local unit of government.

    (f) Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from application of their authority under G.S. 153A‑129, 160A‑189, 14‑269, 14‑269.2, 14‑269.3, 14‑269.4, 14‑277.2, 14‑415.11, 14‑415.23, including prohibiting the possession of firearms in public‑owned buildings, on the grounds or parking areas of those buildings, or in public parks or recreation areas, except nothing in this subsection shall prohibit a person from storing a firearm within a motor vehicle while the vehicle is on these grounds or areas. Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from exercising powers provided by law in declared states of emergency under Article 36A of this Chapter.

    (g) The authority to bring suit and the right to recover against any firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association by or on behalf of any governmental unit, created by or pursuant to an act of the General Assembly or the Constitution, or any department, agency, or authority thereof, for damages, abatement, injunctive relief, or any other remedy resulting from or relating to the lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer of firearms or ammunition to the public is reserved exclusively to the State. Any action brought by the State pursuant to this section shall be brought by the Attorney General on behalf of the State. This section shall not prohibit a political subdivision or local governmental unit from bringing an action against a firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association for breach of contract or warranty for defect of materials or workmanship as to firearms or ammunition purchased by the political subdivision or local governmental unit."

    SECTION 2. The provisions of this act are severable. If any provision of this act is held invalid by a court of competent jurisdiction, the invalidity does not affect other provisions of the act that can be given effect without the invalid provision.

    SECTION 3. This act is effective when it becomes law and applies to any action pending or filed on or after that date.

    In the General Assembly read three times and ratified this the 8th day of August, 2002.

    s/ Beverly E. Perdue

    President of the Senate

    s/ Joe Hackney

    Speaker Pro Tempore of the House of Representatives

    s/ Michael F. Easley

    Governor

    Approved 7:24 p.m. this 15th day of August, 2002
    Last edited by carolina guy; 07-04-2012 at 12:54 PM.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

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    Regular Member FurnitureGuy's Avatar
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    Excellent Resource - Thanks

    I am new to this site and have already found many great comments and resources, such as this brochure. Thank you much!

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    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    The flyer has been revised and uploaded to google docs. The link is below:

    July 2012 Revision of NC Open Carry Flyer

    The changes to the flyer are:
    1. "Places Where Weapons Are Prohibited" was changed to "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited"
    2. Part 5 of the aforementioned section was changed from "Areas of emergency and riot (14-288.7)" to "Areas of riot (14-288.7)3
    3. Footnote 3 was added
    4. The statement "Carrying a weapon openly or concealed in restaurants that serve alcohol and in bars is prohibited. (N.C. Gen Stat. 14-415.11(c))" was removed as this is already covered by Part 2 of the "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited" section.
    5. Revision date was changed from 3/22/2012 to 7/11/2012

    Footnote #1 regarding open carry restrictions in Cary, NC was left intact. As far as I can tell, the ordinances are still there.

    The mention of registering handguns in Durham, NC was also left intact. The NCAG has stated it is law and Durham is still doing this. Until something definitive comes along, this will stay in the flyer.

    Public access to the last revision of the flyer has been removed.
    Last edited by dmatting; 07-11-2012 at 10:07 AM.

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    Regular Member REDFIVE48's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmatting View Post
    The flyer has been revised and uploaded to google docs. The link is below:

    July 2012 Revision of NC Open Carry Flyer

    The changes to the flyer are:
    1. "Places Where Weapons Are Prohibited" was changed to "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited"
    2. Part 5 of the aforementioned section was changed from "Areas of emergency and riot (14-288.7)" to "Areas of riot (14-288.7)3
    3. Footnote 3 was added
    4. The statement "Carrying a weapon openly or concealed in restaurants that serve alcohol and in bars is prohibited. (N.C. Gen Stat. 14-415.11(c))" was removed as this is already covered by Part 2 of the "Places Where Firearms Are Prohibited" section.
    5. Revision date was changed from 3/22/2012 to 7/11/2012

    Footnote #1 regarding open carry restrictions in Cary, NC was left intact. As far as I can tell, the ordinances are still there.

    The mention of registering handguns in Durham, NC was also left intact. The NCAG has stated it is law and Durham is still doing this. Until something definitive comes along, this will stay in the flyer.

    Public access to the last revision of the flyer has been removed.
    Great job Dmatting, I would recommend that you update the first post (and keep it updated) so that people wont have to troll through pages of threads to find the right version.

    Thanks

  17. #17
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REDFIVE48 View Post
    Great job Dmatting, I would recommend that you update the first post (and keep it updated) so that people wont have to troll through pages of threads to find the right version.

    Thanks
    didn't think of doing that - good idea.

    Also, after re-reading the Cary ordinances, I probably do need to change footnote #1, but I don't see it as a big deal right now.

  18. #18
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    Hi. First time poster. Let me start by saying that the NC Flyer is fantastic and thank you for all the work you've put into it. I carry at least one in my wallet and several in my car for handing out to people I meet who are interested in learning more about NC gun rights and open carry. I open carry just about everywhere that it is legal to do so and am an advocate of open carry but I also have my CHP and understand that there are good reasons (not just the laws) for keeping your weapon hidden when appropriate.

    I recently have been doing some ordinance research concerning both open and concealed carry on the greenway system in wake county, specifically the section of River Greenway that is managed by the city of Raleigh but part of the Mountains to Coast State Park and came upon something that might need to be researched and possibly included in the flyer at some point. I apologize if this isn't the proper place to bring this up and request that a mod move it to a proper place if I've posted it in the wrong place but...

    It appears that Raleigh does have an ordinance banning some types of open carry on city streets and sidewalks. It's found in Raleigh City code 9-2021 which specifically states that open carry is unlawful at any meeting, assemblage, or parade on any property, street, alley, public way, park, or greenway. (of course how do we differentiate between city streets and state streets and what is the definition of "meeting" and "assemblage"?) Concerning concealed carry the ordinance follows recent changes in statewide uniformity and recent definitions included in NC GS 14-415.23.

    Raleigh also makes it illegal to possess a firearm on ANY city property in 13-2010 d (this includes parks and greenways) with the exception of permitted concealed carry which is protected by statewide uniformity and addressed in 9-2021. 13-2010 d has its own issues that I won't get into here and needs to be re-written but the city has acknowledged the states authority concerning uniformity and I've been told that the parks dept has too.

    Also...Cary code still prohibits open carry in all public spaces and public property just like Raleigh under Cary Ordinance 22-51 Section B (Other Firearms and weapons). But, like Raleigh, Cary has fallen inline with the uniformity statutes for concealed carry making concealed carry the more flexible and easier of the two ways to carry your weapon in those municipalities. You may not want to remove the Cary footnote just yet.

    The authority for both Cary and Raleigh to regulate open carry is be found in NC GS 160A-189 which gives local municipalities the right to regulate the display of firearms. A lot of debate can be had on that issue but I'm not doing it here, only stating that Raleigh and Cary have claimed their authority to regulate open carry as a method of firearms display under 160A-189.

    I am not a lawyer nor do I claim to be an expert on the laws. I might hazard a guess though that with concealed carry uniformity in place as a method of ensuring 2A compliance throughout the state more municipalities might be drafting legislation that will prohibit the open display of firearms in public spaces under the authority granted them in 160A-189.

    I figured I'd bring this up so that someone new to gun ownership doesn't get the wrong idea and think that A. municipalities don't have rights to regulate how you display and carry your firearm, and B. doesn't decide to pull up the NC Flyer when approached by LEO while walking through a downtown park with a holstered weapon and expect that just because they are open carrying they aren't breaking any local laws in the city in which they live. I live and Raleigh. I open carry a holstered weapon around town a lot and have never had any problems.

    If I'm off base on this please disregard. If it requires some debate please move it somewhere more appropriate. If I have offended anyone, that was not my intention. Just wanted to bring it up is all.
    Last edited by McFlash; 07-13-2012 at 05:10 PM.

  19. #19
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlash View Post
    Hi. First time poster. Let me start by saying that the NC Flyer is fantastic and thank you for all the work you've put into it. I carry at least one in my wallet and several in my car for handing out to people I meet who are interested in learning more about NC gun rights and open carry. I open carry just about everywhere that it is legal to do so and am an advocate of open carry but I also have my CHP and understand that there are good reasons (not just the laws) for keeping your weapon hidden when appropriate.

    I recently have been doing some ordinance research concerning both open and concealed carry on the greenway system in wake county, specifically the section of River Greenway that is managed by the city of Raleigh but part of the Mountains to Coast State Park and came upon something that might need to be researched and possibly included in the flyer at some point. I apologize if this isn't the proper place to bring this up and request that a mod move it to a proper place if I've posted it in the wrong place but...

    It appears that Raleigh does have an ordinance banning open carry on city streets and sidewalks. It's found in Raleigh City code 9-2021 which specifically states that open carry is unlawful on any city property, street, public way, park, or greenway. (of course how do we differentiate between city streets and state streets?) Concerning concealed carry the ordinance follows recent changes in statewide uniformity and goes on to state that the only places where the city prohibits concealed carry are limited to those defined in the recent definitions included in NC GS 14-415.23.

    Also...Cary code still prohibits open carry in all public spaces and public property just like Raleigh under Cary Ordinance 22-51 Section B (Other Firearms and weapons). But, like Raleigh, Cary has fallen inline with the uniformity statutes for concealed carry making concealed carry the more flexible and easier of the two ways to carry your weapon in those municipalities. You may not want to remove the Cary footnote just yet.

    The authority for both Cary and Raleigh to regulate open carry is be found in NC GS 160A-189 which gives local municipalities the right to regulate the display of firearms, which open carry clearly falls under. I'm not sure if 160A-189 has been superseded anywhere. If it has, please disregard. I am not a lawyer nor do I claim to be an expert on the laws.

    But I figured I'd bring it up so that someone new to gun ownership doesn't get the wrong idea and think that A. municipalities don't have rights to regulate how you display and carry your firearm, and B. doesn't decide to pull up the NC Flyer when approached by LEO while walking through downtown and expect that just because they are open carrying they aren't breaking any local laws in the city in which they live. I live and Raleigh and reading 9-2021 was a shock to me...I open carry a holstered weapon around town a lot and have never had any problems.

    If I'm off base on this please disregard. If it requires some debate please move it somewhere more appropriate. If I have offended anyone, that was not my intention. Just wanted to bring it up is all.
    Welcome...also not sure if this is the right place...should have thought about that before I started shooting my mouth off a while back!

    I think that the Raleigh ordinances are a good find...and potentially worth noting for people in Raleigh. One thing I would point out, however, is that Sec. 9-2021 seems to limit the general open carry to "...any meeting, assemblage, or parade..." ...so...if you are just walking along alone (or almost alone) minding your own business I think it might not apply...whatcha think?

    Sec. 9-2021. - WEAPONS PROHIBITED

    It shall be unlawful for any person to openly carry or possess on or about his person any deadly weapon including but not limited to any: bowie knife, dirk, dagger, sling-shot, loaded cane, metal knuckles, razor, stun gun, pistol, revolver, gun, rifle, or nightstick at any meeting, assemblage, or parade on any property, street, alley or other public way, park, greenway. It shall be unlawful for any person to possess or carry a legally permitted concealed handgun on or at any City owned playground, athletic field, swimming pool, or athletic facility as defined in G.S. 14-415.23.

    As for Cary's Sec. 22-51 they do have an interesting "exception" to the non-concealed carry:

    (c) Exceptions. The possession or display of a firearm or other weapon is exempt from the provisions of this section 22-51 in the following situations:

    (1) If the chief of police, or designee, has authorized the public possession or display of a firearm, or other weapon, as part of an official program or event sponsored or sanctioned by the town.

    (2) If the possession or display of the firearm, or other weapon, was the result of an individual(s) exercising his or her legitimate right to self defense or the defense of others as allowed by law.

    (3) If the possession or display of the firearm, or other weapon, was conducted by a person(s) authorized by law to carry and display such items as part of their official or otherwise recognized lawful duties (e.g., law enforcement officers, military personnel, security guards, etc.).

    (4) If the possession or display of the firearm, or other weapon, was necessary for the temporary transport and securing of the item and was not otherwise in violation of existing statutes or ordinances (e.g., recent purchase and movement to vehicle for transport, securing of firearm by CCH permit holder in vehicle, found item to be turned in to authorities, firearm in approved vehicle gun rack, etc.).

    (5) The possession or display of a knife with a blade longer than three inches in Symphony Lake park property and Fred G. Bond Metro Park when used for fishing purposes only.

    (6) The possession or display of a knife with a blade longer than three inches for the performance of the duties of a town employee or contractor.

    I think the 2nd Amendment is "pretty good" to cover your "...legitimate right to self defense..."

    Anyway...let me say sorry (belatedly) for possibly hijacking dmatting's thread, and say again, great job!!
    Last edited by carolina guy; 07-13-2012 at 04:45 PM.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  20. #20
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    In Raleigh take a look 13-2010 d which (imho) is a blatant violation of 2A meant to provoke a court case..."It shall be illegal to possess a firearm, including concealed handguns otherwise allowed by the provisions of G.S. article 54B, on or about the person on any City-owned or controlled property, whether real or personal."

    Has to be a typo??? Couldn't be actual law could it??? But it is...and you could probably still get arrested for it regardless of whether you OC or CC. It's almost too ludicrous to acknowledge which is why I was doing the research before I OC'd on the local section of the MSC trail.

    http://library.municode.com/HTML/103...3-2010FIDIWICI

    Cary exception #4 (temporary transport) might get you farther than self defense when cited for a violation unless you could prove a real and immediate threat to you or someone else that caused you to display your firearm in self defense. I don't want to be the one to test that theory.

    From this angle Raleigh looks worse for open carry than Cary.

    And sorry for the hijack too...
    Last edited by McFlash; 07-13-2012 at 06:19 PM.

  21. #21
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlash View Post
    In Raleigh take a look 13-2010 d which (imho) is a blatant violation of 2A meant to provoke a court case..."It shall be illegal to possess a firearm, including concealed handguns otherwise allowed by the provisions of G.S. article 54B, on or about the person on any City-owned or controlled property, whether real or personal."

    Has to be a typo??? Couldn't be actual law could it??? But it is...and you could probably still get arrested for it regardless of whether you OC or CC. It's almost too ludicrous to acknowledge which is why I was doing the research before I OC'd on the local section of the MSC trail.

    http://library.municode.com/HTML/103...3-2010FIDIWICI

    Cary exception #4 (temporary transport) might get you farther than self defense when cited for a violation unless you could prove a real and immediate threat to you or someone else that caused you to display your firearm in self defense. I don't want to be the one to test that theory.

    From this angle Raleigh looks worse for open carry than Cary.

    And sorry for the hijack too...
    (red above is my editing) --Moderator edited to bold black, color fonts are a rule #19 violation --

    I think the Cary ordinance would have to say USED in self defense for the person to need to prove a real or immediate threat. Otherwise, simply HAVING it is the essence of self defense...and I don't think you need to "prove" your intent...simply the fact that you state it as your motivation is MORE than enough. The 2A does the rest. I think the prosecution would have to be the one to establish that it was NOT carried for self defense. Hard to prove a negative without the defendant shooting them self in the foot.

    As far as Raleigh...I think it MIGHT be unconstitutional as far as current court decisions...but only if you are actually in an assembly, gathering or parade. And I think if the "gathering" decided it was a protest against the ordinance, then it might get REALLY dicey if they wanted to try to prosecute!
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 06-01-2017 at 02:58 PM.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  22. #22
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    About the flyer

    The flier, under the "Does North Carolina Honor My State's Permit' refers to NC Statute NC 14-215.24a. I have a copy of the "north Carolina Criminal Law and Procedure" and the NC Statutes posted elsewhere in this forum (http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/gascript...l?Chapter=0014) Neither of them have anything under NC 14-215. Is there something missing on my end or was this a typo?
    On that topic, some good info here: http://www.ncdoj.com/About-DOJ/Law-E...iprocity.aspx\

    Bob

  23. #23
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarhead1981 View Post
    The flier, under the "Does North Carolina Honor My State's Permit' refers to NC Statute NC 14-215.24a. I have a copy of the "north Carolina Criminal Law and Procedure" and the NC Statutes posted elsewhere in this forum (http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/gascript...l?Chapter=0014) Neither of them have anything under NC 14-215. Is there something missing on my end or was this a typo?
    On that topic, some good info here: http://www.ncdoj.com/About-DOJ/Law-E...iprocity.aspx\

    Bob
    That's a typo - thanks for the catch. It should be 14-415.24(a). It will be fixed in the next revision.

  24. #24
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    Flyer has been upreved. The newest revision is for August 2012. Please see the first post in this thread for the link and for the list of changes.

    Also, please keep the comments coming. Most of the edits are based on the feedback.

  25. #25
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    To the mods: Can the title of this stickied thread be changed to remove the date so that it just reads "North Carolina Flyer"? Thanks

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