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Thread: Glock Locked Case or Not (school zones)

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Glock Locked Case or Not (school zones)

    School zone question that popped in my mind for someone w/no CCW.

    I know it is not the locks intended purpose. Just one of those questions.

    Last edited by Rollbar; 03-22-2012 at 10:52 PM.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    That is NOT a locked case.

    Now, I know of no case (sorry about the pun) where a normal person has been found in violation of the unconstitutional Federal GFSZ. My understanding is that it MAY be used as a secondary offense against those who otherwise are also committing real crimes near a school.

    If there are any real cases against normal people in a free state because of this law, I'd like to hear about it.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Just an outside the box question and that is why I posted it on a few forums for some to think about/discuss.

    My Colt box has a MFG ring on it whereas I can lock it.

    Wondering if I drill a hold in the handle and insert lock?

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    Regular Member The Big Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollbar View Post
    School zone question that popped in my mind for someone w/no CCW.

    I know it is not the locks intended purpose. Just one of those questions.

    If you are asking if having your firearm in a locked case would keep you from running afoul of the federal law concerning school zones, I would say no. The bigger problem as I understand it, you would be in violation of the state conceal carry law. It does not matter if it is in a clasped case, with a lock and then wrapped in duct tape, without a CC permit, you would be guilty of CC without a license. Silly, but looks to be the way it is.

    TBG
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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    I thought in Nevada U can have a concealed weapon in your car? Just not carry CCW if no permit.\

    And from what I was told U had to have it locked up going w/in 1K feet of a school/driving through a known school zone, right.
    Last edited by Rollbar; 03-22-2012 at 11:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Guy View Post
    If you are asking if having your firearm in a locked case would keep you from running afoul of the federal law concerning school zones, I would say no. The bigger problem as I understand it, you would be in violation of the state conceal carry law. It does not matter if it is in a clasped case, with a lock and then wrapped in duct tape, without a CC permit, you would be guilty of CC without a license. Silly, but looks to be the way it is.

    TBG
    If I am not mistaken, (and really, all my U.S information comes from this forum)...as long as a person is not actually holding the case, then it is not CC, so casing it while driving through the school zone, then unlocking/uncasing it after, would be ok?

    As for locking a Glock case... I'm not sure if it is the same as in Canada, but oddly, even with our very restrictive laws, just a simple zip strap like the ones for automotive wiring are allowed to be used, as technically, they require a tool to remove them. (knife, pliers, etc)

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    Regular Member The Big Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollbar View Post
    I thought in Nevada U can have a concealed weapon in your car? Just not carry CCW if no permit.\

    And from what I was told U had to have it locked up going w/in 1K feet of a school/driving through a known school zone, right.
    Yes, you can have it concealed in your car. No, you can not have it concealed upon your person and that includes in a box, bag, breifcase or wrapped in a towel. If it is concealed and in your hand, it is CC without a license.

    TBG
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    Regular Member battleborn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollbar View Post
    I thought in Nevada U can have a concealed weapon in your car? Just not carry CCW if no permit.\

    And from what I was told U had to have it locked up going w/in 1K feet of a school/driving through a known school zone, right.
    Correct me if I am wrong but it isn't a school zone we need to be concerned about, but school grounds/premises...

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    Quote Originally Posted by battleborn View Post
    Correct me if I am wrong but it isn't a school zone we need to be concerned about, but school grounds/premises...
    correct me if I'm wrong, im still learning... isn't there a 1000 foot gun free "zone" around schools if you don't have a CC permit?

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by battleborn View Post
    Correct me if I am wrong but it isn't a school zone we need to be concerned about, but school grounds/premises...
    We are refering to an unconstitutional Federal Law, Title 18 Chapter 44 Section 922 (q) (2) (A):
    It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    Title 18 Section 921 defines a school zone as within 1000 feet of a school.

    Exceptions to this law include being on private property, having a state license, or having the firearm unloaded and in a locked case.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Larson View Post
    correct me if I'm wrong, im still learning... isn't there a 1000 foot gun free "zone" around schools if you don't have a CC permit?
    That is what I have studied. We have talked about this before as fallonJeeper has explained w/the statutes cited, but the case in question is at hand. Outside of the box technically it is locked.

    The 1K rule even applies from the football field /edge of the grass two block over.

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    or having the firearm unloaded and in a locked case.
    Does that mean the clip (magazine) can be in the same box but the firearm unloaded?

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    Regular Member battleborn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    We are refering to an unconstitutional Federal Law, Title 18 Chapter 44 Section 922 (q) (2) (A):
    It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    Title 18 Section 921 defines a school zone as within 1000 feet of a school.

    Exceptions to this law include being on private property, having a state license, or having the firearm unloaded and in a locked case.
    Having state license (NV CCW?) exempts you from the disputed 1000 ft rule?

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollbar
    Does that mean the clip (magazine) can be in the same box but the firearm unloaded?
    This being a Federal law, the Federal (ATF) definition of loaded is a loaded chamber or an "attached" magazine containing ammunition. My understanding is that a nearby (even touching) magazine does not constitute "loaded" for a Federal law. I will promise to shake your hand and wish you well if my opinion does not stand up in court.

    NV defines loaded as a round in the chamber.
    Last edited by MAC702; 03-23-2012 at 12:39 AM.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by battleborn View Post
    Having state license (NV CCW?) exempts you from the disputed 1000 ft rule?
    Yes. And it does so regardless of how you carry, so it expands legal OC.
    Last edited by MAC702; 03-23-2012 at 12:37 AM.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    This being a Federal law, the Federal (ATF) definition of loaded is a loaded chamber or an "attached" magazine containing ammunition. My understanding is that a nearby (even touching) magazine does not constitute "loaded" for a Federal law. I will promise to shake your hand and wish you well if my opinion does not stand up in court.

    NV defines loaded as a round in the chamber.
    Thank you. I wouldn't mind shaking your hand anyway for all the help you have been on here and some other forums.

    Jim

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollbar View Post
    Thank you. I wouldn't mind shaking your hand anyway for all the help you have been on here and some other forums.

    Jim
    +1 ... Thanks

    Im in LV March 25 to 29 if anyone wants to meet up in the evenings.

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    Regular Member Rollbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Larson View Post
    +1 ... Thanks

    Im in LV March 25 to 29 if anyone wants to meet up in the evenings.
    I'm 400 miles away, can't.

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    Keep in mind Nevada law does not allow you to have even a cased and locked gun on school property unless you have written permission. This is different than just the 1000 ft rule.

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    What about if you are on a highway within the 1000 ft. zone, just happen to get pulled over for something, and are OC? Are you still guilty of violating the GFSZ even though you had no intention of stopping in the first place?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    We are refering to an unconstitutional Federal Law, Title 18 Chapter 44 Section 922 (q) (2) (A):
    It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    Title 18 Section 921 defines a school zone as within 1000 feet of a school.

    Exceptions to this law include being on private property, having a state license, or having the firearm unloaded and in a locked case.
    Well, no. The law that was determined unconstitutional was struck down. The NEW law has not been tested by SCOTUS, so no matter what we think, that statement is not fact. Yet.
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrightme View Post
    Well, no. The law that was determined unconstitutional was struck down. The NEW law has not been tested by SCOTUS, so no matter what we think, that statement is not fact. Yet.
    There are plenty of facts that have not been tested by SCOTUS.

    And there are plenty of people in prison for breaking unconstitutional laws, as well.

    I am aware of the history of the old and new laws.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b0neZ View Post
    What about if you are on a highway within the 1000 ft. zone, just happen to get pulled over for something, and are OC? Are you still guilty of violating the GFSZ even though you had no intention of stopping in the first place?
    Technically, if you had reason to believe it was a school zone, yes.

    Also, in NV, you are technically in violation of CCW laws when you carry your cased handguns into and around your home.

    Whatever you do, don't expect the laws to make sense. Show me the man, and I'll show you a felon.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    We are refering to an unconstitutional Federal Law, Title 18 Chapter 44 Section 922 (q) (2) (A):
    It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    Title 18 Section 921 defines a school zone as within 1000 feet of a school.

    Exceptions to this law include being on private property, having a state license, or having the firearm unloaded and in a locked case.
    As far as I am aware, no Nevada school property, including surrounding public sidewalks and streets, has been ceded to the Federal Government by the State of Nevada. How is it that the Federal Government thinks it has legal jurisdiction to make laws restricting Nevada citizens' lawful use of State-owned public streets and sidewalks, and why does Nevada let the Feds get away with it?

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed2276 View Post
    As far as I am aware, no Nevada school property, including surrounding public sidewalks and streets, has been ceded to the Federal Government by the State of Nevada. How is it that the Federal Government thinks it has legal jurisdiction to make laws restricting Nevada citizens' lawful use of State-owned public streets and sidewalks, and why does Nevada let the Feds get away with it?
    Well, I like the way you want to think, but ...

    The US Federal Government has jurisdiction over EVERYTHING. NV has sub-jurisdiction over its territory, and et cetera on down the line. Laws can only get more and more strict as you go, right up to what time you tell your kids they have to be in bed by.

    Now, the issue is whether the laws are in harmony with Constitutional authority for those laws, whether at the US Constitution or NV State Constitution levels.
    Last edited by MAC702; 03-23-2012 at 03:37 PM.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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