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Thread: So Much For Living In A Small Town....

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    Regular Member Outdoorsman1's Avatar
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    So Much For Living In A Small Town....

    My small town (Silver Lake) village president was involved in a Concealed Carry Firearm incident... Go figure....

    ETA:... No shots were fired...

    Story here...

    http://fox6now.com/2012/04/02/silver...rry-violation/

    Outdoorsman1
    Last edited by Outdoorsman1; 04-02-2012 at 10:34 PM.
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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outdoorsman1 View Post
    My small town (Silver Lake) village president was involved in a Concealed Carry Firearm incident... Go figure....
    The article did not mention a citation for consuming in the Tavern (class B establishment) while carrying but it did mention armed while under the influence... He likely could get up to 3 citations. DC (947.01), Endangering Safety 941.20 and Carrying in a Class B establishment 941.237 if he was consuming there.

    941.20 Endangering safety by use of dangerous
    weapon. (1) Whoever does any of the following is guilty of a
    Class A misdemeanor:
    (b) Operates or goes armed with a firearm while he or she is
    under the influence of an intoxicant;
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 04-02-2012 at 10:45 PM.

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    Unloaded and no magazine... may as well have been concealing a rock! I wonder if that will have any bearing on a verdict.

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    Question

    I wonder if the sobriety tests the article mentions included chemical tests, or simply field sobriety tests. If the latter, he was a maroon for taking them. If the former, is there an implied consent clause in the Wisconsin law, threatening a permit revocation for refusing a chemical test, as is the case with driver's licenses?
    Last edited by ManInBlack; 04-02-2012 at 11:32 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    Unloaded and no magazine... may as well have been concealing a rock! I wonder if that will have any bearing on a verdict.
    My guess would be that he just did not want to leave the weapon in the car while having a few but wanted to get as close to legal as possible. This will be interesting to watch as without any ammo it should just be a chunk of steel, or plastic whatever the case may be

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kc.38 View Post
    My guess would be that he just did not want to leave the weapon in the car while having a few but wanted to get as close to legal as possible. This will be interesting to watch as without any ammo it should just be a chunk of steel, or plastic whatever the case may be
    How does the Wisconsin law define "concealed weapon?" Our concealed weapons law only applies to loaded firearms.
    Total ignorance: an Obama supporter's stock in trade
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    All the talk about Overthrowing Big Government, Revolution, etc., it's just another one of those nostalgic ideas that individuals have idealized.
    O RLY?
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    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Shotgun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManInBlack View Post
    How does the Wisconsin law define "concealed weapon?" Our concealed weapons law only applies to loaded firearms.
    Sounds like the police thought the only thing loaded was the village president! The gun being unloaded doesn't change a thing in WI. It's still considered a dangerous weapon. It will be interesting to see the exact charges. While carrying concealed in the restaurant one is not allowed to consume a drop of alcohol. If he had the alcohol prior to going to the restaurant, he still could be open to a charge of "going armed while under the influence"-- something that has a fairly subjective definition.

    2 morals to the story: 1) don't drink and carry a gun 2) avoid arguments while carrying a gun. 3rd moral: don't do #1 and #2 and the same time or you'll find yourself in doo doo!
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    Herr Heckler Koch
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    A firearm is legally defined as a weapon in Wisconsin, loaded or un-loaded. 939.22(10)

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    it will be interesting to see how this shakes out , if you unload and leave ammo and a magazine in the car things that can be replaced for 50 dollars if some one breaks into your car , it certainly shows intent to not drink and go armed , while not complying with the letter of the law , did it comply with the intent of the law that you should not be able to use your gun while drinking.

    what if it had been locked , would that have changed any thing

    encased and locked in a bag carried on ones person


    also in many cases the gun is not assembled if it contains no magazine , so is a disassembled gun and issue , would it change things if the cylinder was removed from a revolver , or if the barrel and chamber was removed

    when hunting , if we got out to the road and were picked up by a car that we didn't have a case in , we could dissemble our unloaded gun put it in the trunk and get a ride back to camp.


    i have to admit i have been very nervous about leaving my gun locked in the car the few times i have had to


    or would carrying only a fire control unit the serialized part of a SIG P250 be considered carrying a fire arm , would carrying only a casting a stripped ar15 lower registered as a pistol
    Last edited by GreenCountyPete; 04-03-2012 at 09:32 AM.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenCountyPete View Post
    it will be interesting to see how this shakes out , if you unload and leave ammo and a magazine in the car things that can be replaced for 50 dollars if some one breaks into your car , it certainly shows intent to not drink and go armed , while not complying with the letter of the law , did it comply with the intent of the law that you should not be able to use your gun while drinking.

    what if it had been locked , would that have changed any thing

    encased and locked in a bag carried on ones person


    also in many cases the gun is not assembled if it contains no magazine , so is a disassembled gun and issue , would it change things if the cylinder was removed from a revolver , or if the barrel and chamber was removed

    when hunting , if we got out to the road and were picked up by a car that we didn't have a case in , we could dissemble our unloaded gun put it in the trunk and get a ride back to camp.


    i have to admit i have been very nervous about leaving my gun locked in the car the few times i have had to


    or would carrying only a fire control unit the serialized part of a SIG P250 be considered carrying a fire arm , would carrying only a casting a stripped ar15 lower registered as a pistol
    The law does not prohibit you from drinking while carrying. It prohibits you from consuming in a Class B establishment while carrying and it prohibits you from being under the influence (being materially impaired) while carrying.
    WI law does not differentiate (nor did it prior to 11/19/11) between an assembled firearm or a disassembled firearm in regards to requirements of being encased. You and your buddies at hunting camp were in violation of the law prior to 11/19/11 and still are if you travel through a GFSZ in that manner.
    There is no pistol "registration" in WI. In the eyes of the ATF, an AR15 is a handgun/pistol if it was first assembled as a handgun when the receiver was virgin. You may then assemble it as a rifle and back to a pistol an infinite number of times but never have a short barrel and a stock assembled together without the NFA tax stamp being acquired first.
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 04-03-2012 at 10:07 AM.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManInBlack
    I wonder if the sobriety tests the article mentions included chemical tests, or simply field sobriety tests. If the latter, he was a maroon for taking them. If the former, is there an implied consent clause in the Wisconsin law, threatening a permit revocation for refusing a chemical test, as is the case with driver's licenses?
    Since he was "released to the custody of his wife", I suspect those tests were just stupid human tricks & maybe a breathalizer; they didn't take him to a hospital for a blood draw. While the first 2 can be supporting evidence, it's my understanding that only the blood work is admissible in court as proof of a BAC. So they can't legally prove he was under the influence.

    And no, I've seen no mention of coerced consent w/r/t any sort of test or search connected with our cc license (other than presenting license & ID if stopped while cc or in a special zone).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    The law does not prohibit you from drinking while carrying. It prohibits you from consuming in a Class B establishment while carrying and it prohibits you from being under the influence (being materially impaired) while carrying.
    WI law does not differentiate (nor did it prior to 11/19/11) between an assembled firearm or a disassembled firearm in regards to requirements of being encased. You and your buddies at hunting camp were in violation of the law prior to 11/19/11 and still are if you travel through a GFSZ in that manner.
    There is no pistol "registration" in WI. In the eyes of the ATF, an AR15 is a handgun/pistol if it was first assembled as a handgun when the receiver was virgin. You may then assemble it as a rifle and back to a pistol an infinite number of times but never have a short barrel and a stock assembled together without the NFA tax stamp being acquired first.
    we did not enter a school zone , so that wasn't an issue

    I was confused apparently by the listing of pistol marked lowers being sold, i thought that in order to be a hand gun build , the stripped lower needed to be purchased as a pistol with 48 hour wait and 13 dollar background check , where if it was purchased as a rifle lower it could go home with you day of sale.

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    Regular Member ncwabbit's Avatar
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    from the accounts posted, it sounds a bit politically motivated...interesting to note the board is already calling for his resignation there goes the presumption of innocent...

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    He could have brought the gun in establishment by permission of owner and had a drink by permission of owner too. Right? Anyway booze and guns, booze and cars do not mix. I never drink in public but at home. And when I do, I don't drive.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Law abider View Post
    He could have brought the gun in establishment by permission of owner and had a drink by permission of owner too. Right? Anyway booze and guns, booze and cars do not mix. I never drink in public but at home. And when I do, I don't drive.
    Only if he was OCing as the law only prohibits concealed and consuming.
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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Only if he was OCing as the law only prohibits concealed and consuming.
    It does not differentiate between concealed and open carry. What the Statute (941.237) does is carve out an exception for a licensee. A licensee may still Open Carry. There is no WI Statute which requires a licensee to ever carry concealed anywhere.
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 04-03-2012 at 04:25 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenCountyPete View Post
    we did not enter a school zone , so that wasn't an issue

    I was confused apparently by the listing of pistol marked lowers being sold, i thought that in order to be a hand gun build , the stripped lower needed to be purchased as a pistol with 48 hour wait and 13 dollar background check , where if it was purchased as a rifle lower it could go home with you day of sale.
    A bare receiver (lower) is neither a long gun nor a hand gun regardless if it is marked "pistol only" or not. Manufacturers such as RRA will transfer a lower receiver with a pistol buffer tube attached as a handgun. The dealer must generally then transfer it to you as such with the 48 hour wait, $13 fee etc in WI.

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    As to the stripped AR lower..............

    I got one a little while back, on the 4473, it was described as "OTHER" by the dealer since it is neither a long gun or a hand gun, yet it is the part with the serial number, so that is the only AR part that requires the NICS check from an FFL. Now if I could just find a barreled upper assembly that is not on a 6-month backorder, I might be happy.

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    http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR15-...Groups-s/1.htm

    Bunch in stock, but the popular ones come and go. Great quality and a WI company to boot.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nutczak View Post
    I got one a little while back, on the 4473, it was described as "OTHER" by the dealer since it is neither a long gun or a hand gun, yet it is the part with the serial number, so that is the only AR part that requires the NICS check from an FFL. Now if I could just find a barreled upper assembly that is not on a 6-month backorder, I might be happy.
    Check out Nelson Tactical in Green Bay. He has DPMS and RRA uppers for less than $500 in stock (as of last week when I picked one up). Call them if you do not see what you want on the web site.....www.nelsontactical.com ... he lists stuff on gunbroker also that you can buy from the store if there are no bids.....http://www.gunbroker.com/All/BI.aspx...5&SearchType=0
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 04-04-2012 at 03:35 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outdoorsman1 View Post
    My small town (Silver Lake) village president was involved in a Concealed Carry Firearm incident... Go figure....

    ETA:... No shots were fired...

    Story here...

    http://fox6now.com/2012/04/02/silver...rry-violation/

    Outdoorsman1
    Illinois CofP too!

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,2348335.story

    "The police chief was charged with operating while under the influence and taken to Kenosha County Jail, according to the police report."


    Nothing about a weapons charge though! Perhaps ossifer courtesy?

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    Regular Member xenophon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slingblade View Post
    The guy must have a decent attorney, Kenosha County only charged him with Disorderly Conduct. Filed today on WCCA website.
    I saw they charged the other guy with just disorderly. But didn't see an update on what they charged the president. Either way, I bet the media will leave out the unloaded part. Either way, bad press. He should have been properly concealing anyhow.

    Sounds like he should have refused the breathalizer. And as quoted above, don't get into confrontations, avoid avoid avoid.

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