efectivness with the 45 acp

j4l said:

Indeed. Havent tried the Federal rounds as yet, so cannot speak to them -for myself-one way or the other. I recall when they'd initially came out though, that some rounds on the shelves were supposedly not the bonded versions.
The Gold Dots -in 230 grains- I have tested extensively for myself.The results have been very consistent- penetrating to an avg. of 12" -15" and expanding fully each time, as well.

As for my hardball- I prefer the TMJ's -for their weight retention. Having that tail end of the round sealed with the jacket makes a difference in both penetration, and weight/mass retention, as well. - The exposed core at the rear of most FMJ rounds tends to "squirt" out the rear, non-jacketed portion of the round, when it impacts solid objects.

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Oh, and for the sake of argument- the .25 acp Gold Dots- they penetrated everything that my .45 has, consistently- on 2 occasions over -penetrating, and blowing right on out through my back-stop, and on down-range, never to be recovered. The recovered rounds didnt expand though. Except for wood- they get clogged and up and stop inside of 1" pine boards. But.. it's "just" a .25 acp..

I started carrying the Gold Dot LEO 124gr +P for my preferred 9mm load several months ago, but still do have HST rounds in both 124 and 147 gr (all +P) in my stash. For my .40S&W carry guns, I use 165gr HST unless I am using a short barreled gun (Glock 27), in which case I use the 155gr HST. For my .45 carry gun, I like the 230gr HST in +P or the Ranger 230gr Ranger SXT +P. I would love to get my hands on some .40S&W Gold Dot 165gr, #53970. Real hard to find this load.

SouthernBoy said:

That and TV/movies will really go a long way in filling her head with garbage. A sad way to introduce someone to the world of firearms.

Do you happen to know which gun store she was told this?

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I didn't ask at the time. If I recall correctly it wasn't someone who worked there but a patron trying to help the damsel in distress.

I told her the guy watched too many movies.


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Steeler-gal said:

I didn't ask at the time. If I recall correctly it wasn't someone who worked there but a patron trying to help the damsel in distress.

I told her the guy watched too many movies.


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Does sound like it. Good thing you steered her away from that sort of nonsense.

SouthernBoy said:

Does sound like it. Good thing you steered her away from that sort of nonsense.

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Yea, I was in Gander Mountain in Greensboro the other day and one of the sales associates was saying to the same effect. I really don't know where they get these guys from.

11B2O said:

Yea, I was in Gander Mountain in Greensboro the other day and one of the sales associates was saying to the same effect. I really don't know where they get these guys from.

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Like with anywhere else, retail, these days. They need staff but will only pay x$$, soo the folks they get working sometimes end up being yahoos..
My local Gander has at least a couple fairly knowledgeable folks who know what they are doing and what they are talking about, including a local Gator hunter/trapper with whom I've gotten some good tips on related matters.

Shot placement, stopping power, penetration/over penetration, velocity.....blah blah blah. The question that needs to be answered is, "I have the gun, what is the best ammo for the price I can afford?" SD ammo and practice ammo for each caliber of gun that you have.

The OP question is based on the wrong premise, not a false premise. You have the gun, or, you have to buy a different gun.

As to the OP question, I'd hate to be hit by a .45acp anywhere on my person. It would pretty much stop me whether it killed me or not.

OC for ME said:

Shot placement, stopping power, penetration/over penetration, velocity.....blah blah blah. The question that needs to be answered is, "I have the gun, what is the best ammo for the price I can afford?" SD ammo and practice ammo for each caliber of gun that you have.

The OP question is based on the wrong premise, not a false premise. You have the gun, or, you have to buy a different gun.

As to the OP question, I'd hate to be hit by a .45acp anywhere on my person. It would pretty much stop me whether it killed me or not.

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I'd hate to be hit anywhere on my person with anything. Don't want or need any extra orifices. The way I see it, God knew what he was doing with the originals.

OC for ME said:

Shot placement, stopping power, penetration/over penetration, velocity.....blah blah blah. The question that needs to be answered is, "I have the gun, what is the best ammo for the price I can afford?" SD ammo and practice ammo for each caliber of gun that you have.

The OP question is based on the wrong premise, not a false premise. You have the gun, or, you have to buy a different gun.

As to the OP question, I'd hate to be hit by a .45acp anywhere on my person. It would pretty much stop me whether it killed me or not.

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I think the better question is, what caliber can you shoot most accurately? For example, I can shoot a .45, but I'm more accurate with a 9mm. (had a yahoo at a gun shop who didn't see the logic of this, and basically believed .45 was the only valuable caliber to carry :banghead I tried to explain to him that a .45 to the shoulder would not be as decimating as a 9mm to the heart.

At the end of the day, I don't care what size bullet you're carrying; whether it's a .22 or .357, it's still metal shrapnel being propelled several hundred feet per second. I don't want to stand in front of that.

True.

The OPers question is not about what caliber of pistol is best, but if the .45acp pistol he has now is the pistol to have given the more modern round types/configurations.

Me, .40 is best, can shoot it straight, .45 is fine for me too. I get better than average performance from the .40 S&W 180gr Gold Dots and the cost of practice ammo (WWB from Walmart when it is in stock).

Any round may not stop an attacker on first shot. Lots of factors going on at that point in time, stress, fear, etc. that may act in accordance with other variables too numerous to foresee. I recomend shooting till the threat has diminished (not necessarily died, but is no longer a threat) and reassesing the situation.

Steeler-gal said:

I just spent time last might trying to explain to a woman in our group that no caliber is guarantee of anything. Of course this never would've happened if someone at a gun store hadn't told her that a .45 ACP would literally knock a person to the ground even if you hit them in the hand. SIGH. :banghead: :cuss:]

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It not only knocks you down to the ground. But it also takes out tanks.

11B2O said:

It not only knocks you down to the ground. But it also takes out tanks.

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While this is a funny piece of tongue-in-cheek humor, I actually heard a SWAT team officer make a statement that an AK47 uses a round that will go through tanks. It was on the History Channel and was a documentary about the North Hollywood bank shootout. I could not believe my ears when I heard this incredible nonsense.... from a law enforcement officer!

I'm a fan of the 45acp.......but, it is only as effective as the shooter.

Hits are effective.....a miss with a 45 is just as effective as a miss with a .50 Cal.

I don't take any chances.

"Zombie Max™ - Just in case!" http://www.hornady.com/store/45-Auto-185-gr-ZMAX

True of any round, more true for pistol rounds than rifle rounds. Every round ever made has failed to stop something at some point. Some miss, some hit in a bad spot, too many factors to analyze based on the end result.

You can compare the ability for the round to penetrate, you can compare the total energy that is absorbed into a test media. You can compare all kinds of things. I feel most modern rounds are going to perform VERY well for what they do. Pistol rounds are small and easy to carry, that is what they do well. Rifle rounds hit hard, but are large and heavy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dA36NYLqns&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLD3FD19A112C2F87F
Good information based on solid data.

Efectivness of the 45ACP

I carried a 45 in the army and fell in love with it and always felt like that was the round to carry for protection . I have carried a 357 magnum , a 9mm and also a 44 magnum when I worked in the great city of Detroit , MI , The only thing that is certain is that a well placed shot is the only way of stopping a criminal . I now carry a 45 acp again and see that it is my last pistol unless I go to a small bug for concealed carry . No matter what caliber or type of bullet used it does not matter if your shot placement is not accurate

The answer is get the most powerful round you can with the best capacity you can. 9mm, 40, 10mm, 45, they all have their advantages, and I have preferences like anyone else, but the fact is that it's all good stuff. Use a decent hollow point, and above all else shoot till any attackers are down.

2 good sayings I've come to be fond of are "don't stop shooting until you see brains", and "when in doubt, empty the magazine". These sayings were and are a reflection on war time experiences of a couple veterans, but it's clear to see that they apply some what to civilian carriers as well. Accuracy is good, but volume can be just as important in the real world. We all know you don't want to keep shooting after an assailant has been "neutralized" but you also don't want to stop shooting until they get there. This is far more important than caliber.

In other words, shot placement IS key, but you might not get that precise shot in 1 or 2 or 3 shots. 10 or so shots to the killzone, with 1 or more hopefully going to the head, neck or spine, based on everything I know, is a good way to practice, and a good real world strategy to protecting yourself. Poking around youtube and looking at police shootings, this seems to be the typical way it unfolds. I am no combat veteran, so I do encourage anyone who thinks I'm wrong to tell me.

Better sayings would be "when the hole in his chest and the ground line up you've fired too many times" or "only stop shooting when the threat has ceased." The thing here is to not use "excessive" force as you can then have issues in court, and your sayings lend theirselves to excessive force more than these two sayings.

One of the best reasons to carry a heavy round is that a greater mass tends to be able to keep a straight trajectory even after hitting brush, barriers, or body armor. (I call it the three B's)

All things being equal, any size hole in a vital organ that causes a loss of BP will do. The reality is that humans are not stupid and tend to try to find cover.