MA vs VA

Recon: The same thing happened/is happening in Murderland. the population centers, PG County, Anna Arrundel, and Balmer, control the laws, but the vast majority of the state, are pretty good people. The eastern shore is very gun friendly, as are the southern western shore, and the hills and valleys west of Balmer...

Recon by Fire said:

Ya, sorry if I created an issue. Indeed that was my point. I'll shut up now!

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No issues and no need to"Shut Up".

Actually, I was a little surprised at MK. He's usually the more diplomatic one but I've been too busy lately to really offend anyone, so I guess he thought he'd pinch hit.:lol:

The comment was made because Virginia and Ma. have nothing in common. Virginia is a free state and we plan to keep it that way. This site is dedicated to the lawful open carry of firearms, without permits or apologies.

When someone moves to Virginia from up north, I judge them by their desire to respect our heritage and traditions. Certainly they will bring the parts of their former home they hold dear, but don't try to convince us that Boston baked beans are in any way superior to Virginia Bar-B-Q :lol:(There are also a lot of private smart assed jokes in most of my posts).

There is no joke about permits though. If you stick around long enough you'll realize that there are several levels here. I'm on the radical right and refuse to get a permit. We have a few that think everyone should have a permit, even to open carry. Needless to say, IMO they can go straight back to where they came from.

Then there is the great majority that are middle of the road. They have a permit because they either need to conceal or feel more comfortable in some instances, concealed. There's nothing wrong with that and they make up the body here.

As suggested earlier, go to some of the dinners. Most of us are nicer in person....most, not all:uhoh:

peter nap said:

No issues and no need to"Shut Up".

Actually, I was a little surprised at MK. He's usually the more diplomatic one but I've been too busy lately to really offend anyone, so I guess he thought he'd pinch hit.:lol:

The comment was made because Virginia and Ma. have nothing in common. Virginia is a free state and we plan to keep it that way. This site is dedicated to the lawful open carry of firearms, without permits or apologies.

When someone moves to Virginia from up north, I judge them by their desire to respect our heritage and traditions. Certainly they will bring the parts of their former home they hold dear, but don't try to convince us that Boston baked beans are in any way superior to Virginia Bar-B-Q :lol:(There are also a lot of private smart assed jokes in most of my posts).

There is no joke about permits though. If you stick around long enough you'll realize that there are several levels here. I'm on the radical right and refuse to get a permit. We have a few that think everyone should have a permit, even to open carry. Needless to say, IMO they can go straight back to where they came from.

Then there is the great majority that are middle of the road. They have a permit because they either need to conceal or feel more comfortable in some instances, concealed. There's nothing wrong with that and they make up the body here.

As suggested earlier, go to some of the dinners. Most of us are nicer in person....most, not all:uhoh:

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Thanks for disspelling some of my ignorance. I have great affection for what WAS the Commonwealth of MA, despite its long down fall. ( And who would respect a man who didn't love his people!)
For the record: I'm all for OC, however there are times that CC just makes more sense. As an Officer in the Army Reserve, not running afoul of the law is sort of expected of me.

Welcome

You will find that Virginia has a lot fewer laws and rules about OC/CC than Massachusettes to run afoul of. State preemption is a tremendous blessing. Joined VCDL yet? At least get on the e-mail alert list. It is free and exceptionally valuable if you want to keep up on the changes, proposed and actual, in the gun laws.

Recon by Fire said:

Ya, sorry if I created an issue. Indeed that was my point. I'll shut up now!

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please don't "...shut up now."
join the fun! this is a great place where folks honestly voice their opinions and often defend them vigorously.
so lock & load!

if i came across as abrupt, i apologize. as PN said above, i'm usually quite diplomatic, but every now and again i slip up. this time, i'd just come off of a 48 hour stretch at work. :uhoh:

Recon by Fire said:

They gave nothing. And how did you figure it was Stafford? Correct btw.

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It's in your profile!

I'm your neighbor to the south. (Or possibly west, depending on what part of Stafford you happen to be in...)

TFred

Recon by Fire said:

Some of you may be surprised to learn that a good part of MA is filled with freedom loving hunters, fishers, and good ole boys. Sadly the power in the state is focused in Boston. I think something happens when you live in a city that destorys your sense of self.

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I'm sure you're right about that. Same can be said for New York and its western enclaves. As Peter said, it's the person, and for me it's that and the mentality (read that as one's view of things) that make the man (ladies, too).

Glad you made the jaunt to our state and I hope you do well here.

You do not need a permit to carry...so open carry while you are waiting.

The police know your rights; just make sure you do too.

T Dubya said:

Because we're the "shock troops" of the gun rights movement and we are willing to help acclimate someone to Virginia. Am I the only one that feels these "how is it related to open carry" questions all the time put off potential new members and good citizens that we need to embrace instead of insulting? Come on.

Welcome to Virginia Recon and OCDO.

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no, you're not.

While I agree that an open carry board should be about open carrying and I understand about keeping things relevent, there is also a great deal of experience and knowledge amongst the seasoned members here. If an honest question can be answered by someone who knows the answer then is there any harm in helping the newcomer? If they later show themself to be a complete ass then sure, jump up and down on their skull.

The Virginia sub forum here is one of the best collections of firearm knowledge that exists and there are many outstanding people who regularly post good information here (I'm not going to mention names, those who read here often will already know who they are). Is it so surprising that someone googling for help on firearm topics ends up coming here? I know that was how I found this site, I think I also found the answer to whatever question I had before I had to ask it, so I was spared the 'how is it related to OC' initiation. Not only did I find an informative and interesting depth of knowledge and opinion, I also found some great characters to share Saturday breakfast with from time to time.

scouser said:

no, you're not.

While I agree that an open carry board should be about open carrying and I understand about keeping things relevent, there is also a great deal of experience and knowledge amongst the seasoned members here. If an honest question can be answered by someone who knows the answer then is there any harm in helping the newcomer? If they later show themself to be a complete ass then sure, jump up and down on their skull.

The Virginia sub forum here is one of the best collections of firearm knowledge that exists and there are many outstanding people who regularly post good information here (I'm not going to mention names, those who read here often will already know who they are). Is it so surprising that someone googling for help on firearm topics ends up coming here? I know that was how I found this site, I think I also found the answer to whatever question I had before I had to ask it, so I was spared the 'how is it related to OC' initiation. Not only did I find an informative and interesting depth of knowledge and opinion, I also found some great characters to share Saturday breakfast with from time to time.

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Amen.

The Wolfhound said:

You will find that Virginia has a lot fewer laws and rules about OC/CC than Massachusettes to run afoul of. State preemption is a tremendous blessing. Joined VCDL yet? At least get on the e-mail alert list. It is free and exceptionally valuable if you want to keep up on the changes, proposed and actual, in the gun laws.

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This is one of the interesting things about MD. If you have a MD License to Carry, there are almost NO restrictions as to WHERE you may carry--bars, restaurants, churches, public parks, state parks--permits pretty much give you carte blanche. In MOST of teh state, you can even legally OC with a MD permit (except the 4 Urban counties).

The catch is that nobody gets a permit in MD unless you are well-connected, or a vocal "anti" elected official like Babs Mikulski, or you can prove that someone already violently attacked you and you survived with enough of your faculties to fill out an application.

But I think we're going to see a HUGE change in that situation come June, when the Circuit Court delivers Round Two of their Constitutional Bitch Slap to the MSP and the MD AG...

SouthernBoy said:

Amen.

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I know both Scouser and TD and like them, get along well with them and have a good deal of respect for them both. Through the board, I know you also SB and the same goes for you.

I also disagree with all three of you about this!
Anyone that's been here for any length of time knows I can go from abrasive to dowright silly dealing with CHP questions and issues. The BIG reason is that CHP's have been used as a tool for legislation that's dangerous to the freedom we have in Virginia. Aside from that, There's nothing wrong with having a CHP.

OCDO isn't my board and I have no control over it. While it's talked up as all things to open carry, it really isn't and in fact it only scratches the surface of OC. Lots of us have been doing it for a very long time, long before OCDO, VCDL or for that matter, long before many of the members here were born.

OCDO does not allow discussion of long guns which excludes two thirds of the people who carry in this state. The simple truth is OCDO was created by Urban folks to address Urban carry of handguns.

All that is well and good. I have no real problem with it as long as that doesn't have any adverse effect on the rights we already have.

That brings us back to CHP's. Just as discussion of long guns is forbidden and much of the discussion of OC where there aren't any sidewalks, the discussion of concealed carry is also technically forbidden.

Recently I had a post disappear. I suspect the Super Moderator nuked it because it was about places without smog. So be it, ain't my board and was probably a little off topic. I didn't cry about it although I suspect his ears burned a little when his name came up with Philip.:lol:

MK4 posted in this thread, "and what does this have to do with the open carry in Virginia". He was entirely right! It had nothing to do with OPEN CARRY, it centered on permits.

You asked why we insult new people who post questions or experiences about permits or concealment.

The answer is because it does not involve open carry. Perhaps we should be asking ourselves why we insult the tens of thousands of people in this state, who live, work and play outside of the inner cities by refusing to discuss how or what they carry.

peter nap said:

I know both Scouser and TD and like them, get along well with them and have a good deal of respect for them both. Through the board, I know you also SB and the same goes for you.

I also disagree with all three of you about this!
Anyone that's been here for any length of time knows I can go from abrasive to dowright silly dealing with CHP questions and issues. The BIG reason is that CHP's have been used as a tool for legislation that's dangerous to the freedom we have in Virginia. Aside from that, There's nothing wrong with having a CHP.

OCDO isn't my board and I have no control over it. While it's talked up as all things to open carry, it really isn't and in fact it only scratches the surface of OC. Lots of us have been doing it for a very long time, long before OCDO, VCDL or for that matter, long before many of the members here were born.

OCDO does not allow discussion of long guns which excludes two thirds of the people who carry in this state. The simple truth is OCDO was created by Urban folks to address Urban carry of handguns.

All that is well and good. I have no real problem with it as long as that doesn't have any adverse effect on the rights we already have.

That brings us back to CHP's. Just as discussion of long guns is forbidden and much of the discussion of OC where there aren't any sidewalks, the discussion of concealed carry is also technically forbidden.

Recently I had a post disappear. I suspect the Super Moderator nuked it because it was about places without smog. So be it, ain't my board and was probably a little off topic. I didn't cry about it although I suspect his ears burned a little when his name came up with Philip.:lol:

MK4 posted in this thread, "and what does this have to do with the open carry in Virginia". He was entirely right! It had nothing to do with OPEN CARRY, it centered on permits.

You asked why we insult new people who post questions or experiences about permits or concealment.

The answer is because it does not involve open carry. Perhaps we should be asking ourselves why we insult the tens of thousands of people in this state, who live, work and play outside of the inner cities by refusing to discuss how or what they carry.

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Why thank you, sir. Sometimes I fail to elaborate where I should or step in the proverbial excrement pile when I should not. The spirit and essential message of scouser's post is that to which I was responding and it is that with which I agreed with my "Amen". I don't believe we are so rigid on these forums where we cannot or will not try to help with constructive answers those who ask them in a respectful and honest manner. That's part of being a Virginian.

I also enjoy good tongue-in-cheek humor and know you are among those on this site who uses that particular tool. There are only a few members here with whom I have had issues and I tend to avoid them when I deem it to be the better path. Goes along with what my mom told me.... treat everyone with dignity and respect until they give you reason not to; then just avoid them.

We're good to go.

scouser said:

no, you're not.

While I agree that an open carry board should be about open carrying and I understand about keeping things relevent, there is also a great deal of experience and knowledge amongst the seasoned members here. If an honest question can be answered by someone who knows the answer then is there any harm in helping the newcomer? If they later show themself to be a complete ass then sure, jump up and down on their skull.

The Virginia sub forum here is one of the best collections of firearm knowledge that exists and there are many outstanding people who regularly post good information here (I'm not going to mention names, those who read here often will already know who they are). Is it so surprising that someone googling for help on firearm topics ends up coming here? I know that was how I found this site, I think I also found the answer to whatever question I had before I had to ask it, so I was spared the 'how is it related to OC' initiation. Not only did I find an informative and interesting depth of knowledge and opinion, I also found some great characters to share Saturday breakfast with from time to time.

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Ditto and Amen, hallelujah! However, Peter Nap (whose post I read after posting this) did bring up some good issues. I'd rather we have some discussion of long gun carrying, along with the concealed carrying discussions we get anyway. All forms have their place, but as Mr. Nap indicated this is not my board either.

Even when we get somewhat off topic.....

I still believe that this IS the premiere gun rights forum in Virginia and likely is in other states as well. The focus may have been CC from the OP but the topic and many comments have included OC. When we re-achieve Constitutional Carry universally, we may end up bored with nothing to talk about. Any discussion of our situation and remedies to our loss of ability to access our rights is beneficial to the greater cause. Besides, where else could I wait like a moray eel and snark from the sidelines? Who knows, our discussion might tempt the OP to OC, he is in Virginia now.

SouthernBoy said:

I just hope that any MA residue remains outside of our borders so as not to taint that which we still hold dear here in our state.

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Ask our brothers and sisters in Maine about this.

The Wolfhound said:

I still believe that this IS the premiere gun rights forum in Virginia and likely is in other states as well. The focus may have been CC from the OP but the topic and many comments have included OC. When we re-achieve Constitutional Carry universally, we may end up bored with nothing to talk about. Any discussion of our situation and remedies to our loss of ability to access our rights is beneficial to the greater cause. Besides, where else could I wait like a moray eel and snark from the sidelines? Who knows, our discussion might tempt the OP to OC, he is in Virginia now.

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The moderators usually have enough restraint to allow related discussion to continue. The above bolded point is exactly why I believe some threads while starting out not related do wind their way around issues to where it does relate to OC. Yes I would like to see more long gun discussion and wish the mods would create a thread where it is allowed other than the Social Lounge. If the S ever does hit the fan, a pistol will only be used to fight your way to your long gun.

As far as others bringing their heritage from other states diluting VA natives, I understand the fear but you have to understand that while some of us weren't Virginians by birth we CHOOSE to be one. I am a good example, I was born in Illinois, moved to NY by my parents, chased a job to CA, and finally wound up in VA. I shot BB & Pellet guns in NY and shot my first 12ga shotgun at around 8yrs old and it nearly put my on my arse. I shot my first pistol in CA at a range. Once living in Virginia I finally BOUGHT my first gun and haven't looked back. I have no plans to move out of VA and plan to retire and die here! I love the freedoms here and work with VCDL to improve them (restore them). I am not an Illinoisan, I am NOT a New Yorker, I am NOT a Californian, I AM a VIRGINIAN! Not by birth but by choice!

I may not have the native accent but living in a military area it is very common not to have the southern drawl. It is funny that when I do speak on the phone with people from up north they say that I do have some form of drawl so I guess it is hard to not adapt. ;-) You mentioned PROSHOOTER as a good import and I agree although we have never met. In my defense I will say at least I love BBQ! ;-) (hate okra though!)

On the topic of CHP's yes some people get testy. With Peter Nap, check the weather and see if his gout may be acting up before taking any offense. ;-) I got my CHP to protect me from some of the bad laws on the books. I will continue to work with VCDL to get them off the books but some are very low priority to them. I am for Constitutional Carry which would solve the issue for the most part but VCDL priorities aren't always mine. I support most of their efforts though.

Me personally, I like hearing about other peoples experience about where they came from and how it compares to VA. I am sure the laws in IL, NY, and CA are different from when I lived there so long ago.

Just an observation from Missouri

I believe it is almost impossible to talk about OC with out the element of CC.

Especially in the States, such as Missouri, where in some parts of the State you cannot OC without a CC.

We are working on it, but if a post comes up in regard to CC...be supportive...welcome them and inform them on the aspects of OC.

They came to this site for info, not a CC site, show respect and we will have another one on our side!!

Just my .02

And welcome aboard!!!

45acpForMe said:

The moderators usually have enough restraint to allow related discussion to continue. The above bolded point is exactly why I believe some threads while starting out not related do wind their way around issues to where it does relate to OC. Yes I would like to see more long gun discussion and wish the mods would create a thread where it is allowed other than the Social Lounge. If the S ever does hit the fan, a pistol will only be used to fight your way to your long gun.

As far as others bringing their heritage from other states diluting VA natives, I understand the fear but you have to understand that while some of us weren't Virginians by birth we CHOOSE to be one. I am a good example, I was born in Illinois, moved to NY by my parents, chased a job to CA, and finally wound up in VA. I shot BB & Pellet guns in NY and shot my first 12ga shotgun at around 8yrs old and it nearly put my on my arse. I shot my first pistol in CA at a range. Once living in Virginia I finally BOUGHT my first gun and haven't looked back. I have no plans to move out of VA and plan to retire and die here! I love the freedoms here and work with VCDL to improve them (restore them). I am not an Illinoisan, I am NOT a New Yorker, I am NOT a Californian, I AM a VIRGINIAN! Not by birth but by choice!

I may not have the native accent but living in a military area it is very common not to have the southern drawl. It is funny that when I do speak on the phone with people from up north they say that I do have some form of drawl so I guess it is hard to not adapt. ;-) You mentioned PROSHOOTER as a good import and I agree although we have never met. In my defense I will say at least I love BBQ! ;-) (hate okra though!)

On the topic of CHP's yes some people get testy. With Peter Nap, check the weather and see if his gout may be acting up before taking any offense. ;-) I got my CHP to protect me from some of the bad laws on the books. I will continue to work with VCDL to get them off the books but some are very low priority to them. I am for Constitutional Carry which would solve the issue for the most part but VCDL priorities aren't always mine. I support most of their efforts though.

Me personally, I like hearing about other peoples experience about where they came from and how it compares to VA. I am sure the laws in IL, NY, and CA are different from when I lived there so long ago.

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That's fine. What I was talking about, and am concerned about, is the dilution of what we hold dear here in our state as we have seen in Florida, Arizona, and Nevada for example. I understand that Arizona and Nevada are having problems with folks migrating there from California and bringing along their California mindset and ideas to Arizona and Nevada. This seems to be human nature but can disrupt generations of tradition and culture in the target states and areas. We've seen that here and it is that which I find less that likeable. There is a saying in Florida, "If you want to go South, go North". The native indigenous population knows this well.

When in Rome, do as the Romans makes a lot of sense. Going into a state or area and then expecting them to adhere to your wishes and what you are accustomed to ain't gonna set to well with the local folks... and for good reason.

Me personally, I like hearing about other peoples experience about where they came from and how it compares to VA.

Me, too. I enjoy hearing what people from other parts of the country have to say.

I don't know how you guys can consider VA "more free" than MA, when you don't have a strip club in the entire state.....