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Thread: Gun-buster signs in Indiana... truly no force of law?

  1. #1
    Regular Member CathyInBlue's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Terre Haute, Indiana, USA

    Gun-buster signs in Indiana... truly no force of law?

    Somewhere here on, I clicked on this link:
    It contains the following on page 5:
    “No Firearm” signs in Indiana have no force of law unless they are posted on property that is specifically
    mentioned in State Law as being off limits to those with a Permit/License to Carry. If you are in a place not
    specifically mentioned in the law that is posted and they ask you to leave, you must leave. If you refuse to
    leave then you are breaking the law and can be charged. Even if the property is not posted and you are asked
    to leave you must leave. Always be aware of the possibility that responding Police Officers who may have
    been called without your knowledge and may not know the laws on trespass etc. could arrest you even if you
    are within the law.
    I beg to differ.

    IC 35-43-2-2
    Criminal trespass; denial of entry; permission to enter; exceptions
    Sec. 2. (a) A person who:
    (1) not having a contractual interest in the property, knowingly or intentionally enters the real property of another person after having been denied entry by the other person or that person's agent;
    (2) not having a contractual interest in the property, knowingly or intentionally refuses to leave the real property of another person after having been asked to leave by the other person or that person's agent;
    (b) A person has been denied entry under subdivision (a)(1) of this section when the person has been denied entry by means of:
    (1) personal communication, oral or written;
    (2) posting or exhibiting a notice at the main entrance in a manner that is either prescribed by law or likely to come to the attention of the public; or
    (3) a hearing authority or court order under IC 32-30-6, IC 32-30-7, IC 32-30-8, IC 36-7-9, or IC 36-7-36.
    (f) Subsections (a), (b), and (e) do not apply to the following:
    I read the bolded parts to indicate that a conspicuous "NO FIREARMS", "NO WEAPONS", or gun-buster sign at the main entrance means anyone ignoring it and entering the property anyway is committing criminal trespass in the state of Indiana. There is no need to wait for an employee to notice you carrying, asking you to leave, and you refusing for the trespass statute to apply to you and your actions. If you are carrying a weapon in an establishment so posted at its main entrance (merely posting at auxiliary entrances not being sufficient to engage this statute) and come to the notice of police, you can already be arrested for trespassing, even absent the owner of the establishment or the owner's agent having called them and complained.

    There is nothing in subsection (f) about the 2nd Amendment to the US Constitution; Art. 1, Sec. 32 of the Indiana Constitution; or lawful carry of arms in any fashion. In fact, it seems predominantly about railroad property.

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    South Bend, Indiana, USA
    In order for your interpretation to be true, you would have to show that a firearm is a "person" under 35-43-2-2. "No firearms" does not prohibit a person from entering. It merely suggests that the owner does not wish a firearm to be present.

    You can't post a notice to an inanimate object, only to a person. A "No Trespassing" sign would qualify as denial of entry. A "No guns" sign would not, because it does not notify a person that he is trespassing if he enters.

  3. #3
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Portage, MI
    Similar language in Michigan.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

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