amzbrady
Regular Member
If you were on the bus would you draw on this guy or like others just go toe to toe?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Uln9cwUFOs&feature=share
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Uln9cwUFOs&feature=share
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Would you draw on this guy?
- Thread starter amzbrady
- Start date
DCKilla
Regular Member
There was plenty of help on that bus to take care of the threat. I didn't see any reason to do so in that situation. If I was alone, one on one, good chance.
decklin
Regular Member
No way. There are too many people too close to eachother. Even if I was all the way at the front and had a clear shot I would likely be jostled by all the other people. I would be responsible for any stray rounds. In that situation the passengers did the right thing. Now if the bus were empty that may be different. There is no way of knowing what you'll do until you are in a situation.
jdholmes
Regular Member
What is always amazing is how many sheep just stood there and didn't react to help in any way...that someone at the back of the bus could make it to the front before others start reacting? Ridiculous society...
Stanley
Regular Member
It's not society. This is a known psychological phenomenon and it's not going away. It's always been the case.
Google Bystander Effect
People experience shock, then assume someone else will do something and then when someone finally does others start to jump in. Herd behavior.
This phenomenon is why in emergencies the person responding has to point to people and get their attention when yelling commands like "call 911." You can't just say it because people will assume another person will do it.
Very few people actually act during emergencies. No one knows what they'll do until they are in the situation. Some act instinctively, some freeze, some run away.
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sirpuma
Regular Member
I would definitely do something, but what would be situation dependent. If I was the only one there to help and there was no chance of collateral damage, you bet your cookies I'd draw. Someone that big is a deadly threat, even with just punches.
Twice he communicated his intent to kill her. That pretty much covers the "imminent threat of death" part.
Where I live we have case law saying that force up to and including lethal force is permitted without needing to first retreat from anywhere one has a legal right to be. I have not read the fine-print license agreement on the back of the bus ticket to see what I have waived by boarding and paying the fare.
Could I, personally, physically haul him off of her? No.
Would I shoot? The answer depends on so many other factors. About the only thing I can say with any degree of certainty (and that isn't much, given this situation) is that it probably would be a contact shot.
What makes me happy about having scenarios like this presented is that the majority of responses put the lie to the accusation that gun owners are just looking for an excuse to shoot someone.
stay safe.
Where I live we have case law saying that force up to and including lethal force is permitted without needing to first retreat from anywhere one has a legal right to be. I have not read the fine-print license agreement on the back of the bus ticket to see what I have waived by boarding and paying the fare.
Could I, personally, physically haul him off of her? No.
Would I shoot? The answer depends on so many other factors. About the only thing I can say with any degree of certainty (and that isn't much, given this situation) is that it probably would be a contact shot.
What makes me happy about having scenarios like this presented is that the majority of responses put the lie to the accusation that gun owners are just looking for an excuse to shoot someone.
stay safe.
Metalhead47
Regular Member
My only comments, this is one reason they should wait till everyone's seated before moving the dang bus. Metro... <facepalm>
Other than that, does not look like drawing was in any way warranted in the situation. Brings up a different problem tho, if you're openly armed & decide to get physically involved, what about the likelihood of someone else (good guy OR bad guy) taking your weapon & using it while your hands are busy?
Metro... <facepalm>Other than that, does not look like drawing was in any way warranted in the situation. Brings up a different problem tho, if you're openly armed & decide to get physically involved, what about the likelihood of someone else (good guy OR bad guy) taking your weapon & using it while your hands are busy?
Kryteon
Regular Member
This is why I always carry pepper spary in addition to my firearm. I like having a non-lethal option available.
SpyderTattoo
Regular Member
Now that is an interesting thought and warrants some consideration. Sometimes a person carrying a gun needs to stand back and observe the situation and not jump into it right away.
PistolPackingMomma
Regular Member
I wouldn't shoot unless all other methods had been exhausted. If he couldn't be restrained, subdued or otherwise incapacitated, then perhaps...
TechnoWeenie
Regular Member
I would not use a spray in a confined area.
I dont know if I would have shot,or stood there like the others did until someone else jumped in, I have never been in that position. I would like to think I would have been the frist one up to help. The man should have his eye's stomped out of his head, but just dont know how I would have reacted. I do hope if im ever put in that place I act exactly the way I should. I would like to go thur some shoot dont shoot training type course.
Kryteon
Regular Member
There are sprays that limit exposure when properly used. Pepper spray over exposure is preferable to firearm over penetration. It's just another tool I carry for situations like this. Use your own judgement.
MSG Laigaie
Campaign Veteran
This is situational awareness at its best
jdholmes
Regular Member
Yeah, till you start gagging on it yourself...
Pepper spray is not a great close hand solution, a tazer would be preferable to that IMO.
skiingislife725
Regular Member
Yah in a perfect world the taser would be good. But I don't want to wear a duty belt, so it's OC spray, a knife weakside, and my firearm.
Metalhead47
Regular Member
+1
In that situation, you'd be likely to spray the bad guy, the victim, AND possibly the driver, which is a really bad thing in a moving vehicle.
If not a full-fledged taser, maybe a smaller contact stun-gun that can fit in a pocklet would be wise, to avoid "batman syndrome."
Freedom First
Regular Member
Very interesting situation you found there Mike. Taser sounds to me like the only option other than a contact shot which would leave me with penetration concerns on a crowded bus. With others in the action, I agree with standing back and not engaging unless the firearm was required.
jdholmes
Regular Member
Indeed...if you are close enough for the close contact pepper spray to be used effectively on the assailant you are likely also close enough or can get close enough for the contact taser.