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City of Washington OC ban

WCrawford

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2007
Messages
592
Location
Nashville, Tennessee, United States
Are you kidding me? You've got to be a troll at this point. How you over simplify and generalize context and entire issues must be an indicator of how simple minded you are. I am specifically labeling Bess as a cop baiter because of his -documented- action. He seeks out police officers and engages in behavior that is non-normative to daily routine in order to draw the attention of said police. If he was going about it normal business when -this- particular incident happened, then yes shame on the cop. However, I would still hold issue as Bess was directly asked to avoid OC in this particular town for 30 days. The fact that he didn't, the fact that negative press came from it, the fact that Bess has a history of facilitating confrontation with LEOS and creating bad PR, all culminates to my position on this matter.

I am starting to think, Bess like many others in this community have some sort of social deficiency. I feel a lot of the guys in the OC movement use the gun to exhibit or challenge authority. This exhibition of authority isn't used against criminals as a means of deterrence, but more often as a way to exhibit authority over the general populace. OCers like this get off on the looks and whispers they get and the feeling of power or recognition (or even mistaken authority) they get from it. This undoubtedly some sort of mental mechanism used to supplement a lack of self confidence, lack of authority, or overall beta-male existence. IMO its pretty f***ing pathetic. Know what else? I think every one of you tools who don't see that is probably some neck-beard beta-male loser too.

Not only a statist, but a crimnal cop appologist. Sad and pathetic.

Bow down and lick the boots of your masters, slave.

Sent from my M865 using Tapatalk 2
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
Why is it that you OC? Are you wanting to restrict or condemn those OCing for any different reason than yours? This moral justification for OCing is a slippery slope you have put yourself on. I personally don't care if some does it to pick up chicks or they like the to look like a cowboy. It is a person freedom that I have no right to ask it be restricted from others.

Doc

Doc

I agree. When we start to act like OUR reason for (insert constitutionally protected activity here) is the ONLY legitimate reason to do it, we are effectively behaving no differently than those who would like to see the abolition of said right altogether. As I said earlier in this thread, NONE of us get to be the arbiter of conduct for everyone else here. As long as folks are conducting themselves LAWFULLY, it's really nobody's business but their own.

That said, I see plenty of opportunity here for rational, adult discussion and exchanging of ideas, but for the life of me I can't understand the nasty personal attacks, child-like insults, and petty name calling that has permeated this conversation. You want to be taken seriously and treated with respect? Then show some respect and courtesy for your fellow members here. None of us come here to be bashed or called names. Grow up, folks.
 
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9026543

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
509
Location
Southern MO
I agree. When we start to act like OUR reason for (insert constitutionally protected activity here) is the ONLY legitimate reason to do it, we are effectively behaving no differently than those who would like to see the abolition of said right altogether. As I said earlier in this thread, NONE of us get to be the arbiter of conduct for everyone else here. As long as folks are conducting themselves LAWFULLY, it's really nobody's business but their own.

That said, I see plenty of opportunity here for rational, adult discussion and exchanging of ideas, but for the life of me I can't understand the nasty personal attacks, child-like insults, and petty name calling that has permeated this conversation. You want to be taken seriously and treated with respect? Then show some respect and courtesy for your fellow members here. None of us come here to be bashed or called names. Grow up, folks.

That is the very reason that there isn't more discussion and exchange of ideas on this thread. No one likes the idea that if they present an opinion contrary to some that they get called petty names and child like insults from those with child like behavior calling for those with ideas and thought contrary to theirs to be black balled. So those with new ideas and would like to help are told in so many words to shut the hell up and get out of the way.

So grow up folks and quit acting like spoiled brats is good advice but I am afraid it is a little late.
 

afcarry

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2010
Messages
206
Location
Southeast of KC Mossouri
You bring bad attention to us when you do crap like get in other people's business. Did the "citizen" ask you to record the cop for him? No. Did the cop ask you to record the citizen? No. So what possessed you to insert your nose into their business? So all you did was inject a lot of bull**** into an irrelevant situation with Law Enforcement and another individual, then you argued, made fools of all of us (because whether we like it or not, you represent us), and drove off. Normal day? Are you still arguing that you are not an attention *****? Because I know that two year-olds get into arguments and then storm off as well, or tweenage girls. I'm sure you wouldn't like to be classified as either one of those, but in this case, that may be better than the alternate.

I can see that you love to play like a marine, and I can also see that you have never missed a dinner in your life. No problem, I'm just painting a picture here - So you have a fantasy of becoming a hero or authority figure one day, however you can not make any of the required sacrifices (diet, exercise, moving schedule, medical condition, etc.) for that "heroism" or authority so you moved on to something else - one thing you assert that you think nobody can take away. You'll start carrying a gun! Not many people do that, just those with authority! Great idea! It's a right, so nobody can tell you not to. EXCEPT THAT THEY CAN. Darrow proved it and you follow suit. Hope you're proud.
 

ChiangShih

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2009
Messages
628
Location
KC
Why is it that you OC? Are you wanting to restrict or condemn those OCing for any different reason than yours? This moral justification for OCing is a slippery slope you have put yourself on. I personally don't care if some does it to pick up chicks or they like the to look like a cowboy. It is a person freedom that I have no right to ask it be restricted from others.

Doc

Doc

I made no "moral justification" to OC, I did point out motivations for OC that I believe to derive from social deficiencies that I do not like. I have not asked OC be -restricted- for those individuals. I do want those losers to stop OCing (personally) because they make the responsible, politically minded, intelligent OCers look like idiots through affiliation.

It is also painfully obvious that you don't care if you have idiots representing your side of MO's movement, as it is you folks that seem to keep getting bad PR and municipalities to ban OC.

So let me just deconstruct your straw-man here.
I'm not asking for restriction or to suppress the rights of others because of their motivation to OC. That doesn't mean I have to like them. That doesn't mean I have to support them in anyway, or take their side when they have bad confrontations with LEOs or the press. That doesn't mean I have to include them in the local group, or in anyway put up with their BS.

Obviously I struck a bit of a nerve with some of you beta-males with authority issues. Just know it is the cop baiters and attention ****** that hurt the OC movement, and cause contention among other OCers and 2A groups. The push for OC (at least on the political side) would be better off without you.

If you are one of those loser types who OC in order to feel like a "cowboy," supplement a lack of authority in interpersonal relationships, get your rocks off through cop confrontation, or to exhibit some sort power over the general public, please don't come to the KC side. You aren't welcome and if you show up to our meetings I'll make it painfully obvious.
However, drive out to St. Louis and they will welcome you with open arms! Then you can go bother a cop eating lunch; make sure to get a table right next to him! Make sure to sit with your hips out! Maybe even interrupt his conversation with pointless small talk just so he notices you have a gun (record him while you are at it).

Stop making fools of yourselves.

Oh yeah, to answer your question. I OC because it is my preferred method of carry. I OCed for a long time because I was too young to have a CCW. I OC to make the practice as normal as possible, to integrate it smoothly into normal social interaction in order to facilitate more positive perspectives regarding the presence of a gun in public and social situations.
 
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Thomas Masse

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
42
Location
Warrensburg
I OC to make the practice as normal as possible, to integrate it smoothly into normal social interaction in order to facilitate more positive perspectives regarding the presence of a gun in public and social situations.

+1
I want to be seen as a nice and normal guy with a gun on his hip. Not a gun attached to a guy.
 

ChiangShih

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2009
Messages
628
Location
KC

Motivational reading?

DidntReadLOL.gif
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
I made no "moral justification" to OC, I did point out motivations for OC that I believe to derive from social deficiencies that I do not like. I have not asked OC be -restricted- for those individuals. I do want those losers to stop OCing (personally) because they make the responsible, politically minded, intelligent OCers look like idiots through affiliation.

It is also painfully obvious that you don't care if you have idiots representing your side of MO's movement, as it is you folks that seem to keep getting bad PR and municipalities to ban OC.

So let me just deconstruct your straw-man here.
I'm not asking for restriction or to suppress the rights of others because of their motivation to OC. That doesn't mean I have to like them. That doesn't mean I have to support them in anyway, or take their side when they have bad confrontations with LEOs or the press. That doesn't mean I have to include them in the local group, or in anyway put up with their BS.

Obviously I struck a bit of a nerve with some of you beta-males with authority issues. Just know it is the cop baiters and attention ****** that hurt the OC movement, and cause contention among other OCers and 2A groups. The push for OC (at least on the political side) would be better off without you.

If you are one of those loser types who OC in order to feel like a "cowboy," supplement a lack of authority in interpersonal relationships, get your rocks off through cop confrontation, or to exhibit some sort power over the general public, please don't come to the KC side. You aren't welcome and if you show up to our meetings I'll make it painfully obvious.
However, drive out to St. Louis and they will welcome you with open arms! Then you can go bother a cop eating lunch; make sure to get a table right next to him! Make sure to sit with your hips out! Maybe even interrupt his conversation with pointless small talk just so he notices you have a gun (record him while you are at it).

Stop making fools of yourselves.

Oh yeah, to answer your question. I OC because it is my preferred method of carry. I OCed for a long time because I was too young to have a CCW. I OC to make the practice as normal as possible, to integrate it smoothly into normal social interaction in order to facilitate more positive perspectives regarding the presence of a gun in public and social situations.

Irony = the same shortcomings you accuse these folks of trying to make up for by openly carrying a gun, are ones you could be accused of trying to make up for with the "holier than thou", "know it all", "leader of the pack" attitude you are displaying here.

You want to accuse others of making things worse? Well why don't you enlighten everyone here to all of your HUGE accomplishments in regards to statewide OC preemption. After all, you folks on the KC side are just SO on the ball, and just so dang good at what you do, that you've accomplished...................................what? Patiently waiting for the list..................



So I guess I will note that the suggestion that everyone grow up and act like adults has officially been ignored. (And you guys wonder why you can't get anything accomplished).
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
You bring bad attention to us when you do crap like get in other people's business. Did the "citizen" ask you to record the cop for him? No. Did the cop ask you to record the citizen? No. So what possessed you to insert your nose into their business? So all you did was inject a lot of bull**** into an irrelevant situation with Law Enforcement and another individual, then you argued, made fools of all of us (because whether we like it or not, you represent us), and drove off. Normal day? Are you still arguing that you are not an attention *****? Because I know that two year-olds get into arguments and then storm off as well, or tweenage girls. I'm sure you wouldn't like to be classified as either one of those, but in this case, that may be better than the alternate.

I can see that you love to play like a marine, and I can also see that you have never missed a dinner in your life. No problem, I'm just painting a picture here - So you have a fantasy of becoming a hero or authority figure one day, however you can not make any of the required sacrifices (diet, exercise, moving schedule, medical condition, etc.) for that "heroism" or authority so you moved on to something else - one thing you assert that you think nobody can take away. You'll start carrying a gun! Not many people do that, just those with authority! Great idea! It's a right, so nobody can tell you not to. EXCEPT THAT THEY CAN. Darrow proved it and you follow suit. Hope you're proud.

It is extremely presumptuous of you to act like you know the intricacies of this person's personal life, health condition, dreams, and aspirations - and then to mock him on an open forum when you have absolutely no clue as to what you are talking about. This is behavior unbecoming of an adult.
 

9026543

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
509
Location
Southern MO
I made no "moral justification" to OC, I did point out motivations for OC that I believe to derive from social deficiencies that I do not like. I have not asked OC be -restricted- for those individuals. I do want those losers to stop OCing (personally) because they make the responsible, politically minded, intelligent OCers look like idiots through affiliation.

It is also painfully obvious that you don't care if you have idiots representing your side of MO's movement, as it is you folks that seem to keep getting bad PR and municipalities to ban OC.

So let me just deconstruct your straw-man here.
I'm not asking for restriction or to suppress the rights of others because of their motivation to OC. That doesn't mean I have to like them. That doesn't mean I have to support them in anyway, or take their side when they have bad confrontations with LEOs or the press. That doesn't mean I have to include them in the local group, or in anyway put up with their BS.

Obviously I struck a bit of a nerve with some of you beta-males with authority issues. Just know it is the cop baiters and attention ****** that hurt the OC movement, and cause contention among other OCers and 2A groups. The push for OC (at least on the political side) would be better off without you.

If you are one of those loser types who OC in order to feel like a "cowboy," supplement a lack of authority in interpersonal relationships, get your rocks off through cop confrontation, or to exhibit some sort power over the general public, please don't come to the KC side. You aren't welcome and if you show up to our meetings I'll make it painfully obvious.
However, drive out to St. Louis and they will welcome you with open arms! Then you can go bother a cop eating lunch; make sure to get a table right next to him! Make sure to sit with your hips out! Maybe even interrupt his conversation with pointless small talk just so he notices you have a gun (record him while you are at it).

Stop making fools of yourselves.

Oh yeah, to answer your question. I OC because it is my preferred method of carry. I OCed for a long time because I was too young to have a CCW. I OC to make the practice as normal as possible, to integrate it smoothly into normal social interaction in order to facilitate more positive perspectives regarding the presence of a gun in public and social situations.

Ah, the great beta male has spoken and let it be known that he is the great beta male of the KC area and all lesser than he will be banned from the group in the KC area. That is fine because KC is just as big a hell hole as the Loo is.
 

Thomas Masse

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
42
Location
Warrensburg
Irony = the same shortcomings you accuse these folks of trying to make up for by openly carrying a gun, are ones you could be accused of trying to make up for with the "holier than thou", "know it all", "leader of the pack" attitude you are displaying here.

You want to accuse others of making things worse? Well why don't you enlighten everyone here to all of your HUGE accomplishments in regards to statewide OC preemption. After all, you folks on the KC side are just SO on the ball, and just so dang good at what you do, that you've accomplished...................................what? Patiently waiting for the list..................

You don't have to be "holier than thou" to be better than a lot of the OCer's in Missouri. You just have to not **** up. As for accomplishments, it is simply enough of an accomplishment not to have gotten a municipality banned or had negative PR. From what I've seen and heard about the St. Louis side of the OC movement, those two acts are rarely accomplished by you "good OCers." As for ChiangShih's accomplishments, he is the foremost planner and activist we have on the west side. He is one the original organizers of all of our meetings. About a year and a half ago, ChiangShih, along with Peter Arthur and others, were interviewed by Fox 4 News. The interview aired both locally on television and nationally on their website. The interview was very positive for open carry. And lastly, JXD and ChiangShih were nice enough to fund, ChiangShih also taking the role of lead designer, MissouriOpenCarry.org. This website provides a more professional look to help legitimize us as a cohesive political organization. What have the majority of you all done?... aside from facilitating people like Darrow and Bess who continue to set the OC movement back. If you numbskulls can't see that, then this movement deserves to fail.
 

ChiangShih

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2009
Messages
628
Location
KC
Ah, the great beta male has spoken and let it be known that he is the great beta male of the KC area and all lesser than he will be banned from the group in the KC area. That is fine because KC is just as big a hell hole as the Loo is.


Ask your wife if I'm beta. ZING

jimmiesrustled.png




Lol, I kind of felt bad for being this much of a douche...but then I didn't.
 
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ChiangShih

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2009
Messages
628
Location
KC
You want to accuse others of making things worse? Well why don't you enlighten everyone here to all of your HUGE accomplishments

Not making things worse IS an accomplishment. Name ONE municipality banned in the west side of Missouri as a direct result of MOOC members.....Patiently waiting for the list....

Patiently waiting for the list..................

+1 Masse.
 
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cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
You don't have to be "holier than thou" to be better than a lot of the OCer's in Missouri. You just have to not **** up. As for accomplishments, it is simply enough of an accomplishment not to have gotten a municipality banned or had negative PR. From what I've seen and heard about the St. Louis side of the OC movement, those two acts are rarely accomplished by you "good OCers." As for ChiangShih's accomplishments, he is the foremost planner and activist we have on the west side. He is one the original organizers of all of our meetings. About a year and a half ago, ChiangShih, along with Peter Arthur and others, were interviewed by Fox 4 News. The interview aired both locally on television and nationally on their website. The interview was very positive for open carry. And lastly, JXD and ChiangShih were nice enough to fund, ChiangShih also taking the role of lead designer, MissouriOpenCarry.org. This website provides a more professional look to help legitimize us as a cohesive political organization. What have the majority of you all done?... aside from facilitating people like Darrow and Bess who continue to set the OC movement back. If you numbskulls can't see that, then this movement deserves to fail.

So in short, despite all of your back-patting and all of your "good PR", you've managed to get absolutely zilch accomplished, or about as much as Bess and Darrow......lol. Nice try.
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
Not making things worse IS an accomplishment. Name ONE municipality banned in the west side of Missouri as a direct result of MOOC members.....Patiently waiting for the list....

Name one that has lifted an OC ban.....again, patiently waiting for the list. You can't point to inaction and claim it as an accomplishment for your group. It's simply not quantifiable. It may well be that none of those munis have placed a local ban on OC DESPITE anything you folks are doing.

But I digress, you are quick to point out how great you are and how pathetic everyone else is, and in reality, you haven't accomplished anything more than those you sit there and deride. Perhaps one of these days you'll realize that a single person can't fix the OC problems we have in this state any more than one person can singlehandedly "ruin it for everyone else". But it must be nice to live in that big glass house on the hill whilst you chuck rocks at all the passersby.
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
Are you retarded?

Do you not understand the English language? I asked for a list of accomplishments. You posted some nonsense about how great of a "leader" Chiang is (and that may be), but that ISN'T an accomplishment. The facts are, despite all of your self-congratulating and self-importance, you KC folks have managed to accomplish the same thing that the folks in the rest of the state have (perhaps less if you consider that some STL folks actually got a couple of bills in committee this year). So save it for somebody who's buying it, because that sure as heck isn't me.
 
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