to the OP, i live in Lynchburg. Was it a city cop or state police? i often times drive with my gun in the passenger seat next to me, but if i ever get a cop behind me, i'll put it in my center console. So i'm curious how everyone else would have handled the cop asking to put it in your trunk? also on the question of if you are arrested for a simple citation? yes you are. i know this because many decades ago i tried to go out on a police ride along. i couldnt because on the questionnaire, they ask if you have ever been arrested. i said no. i hadn't so i thought. but when the police dept called to tell me i was rejected it was because of this answer. the lady said ANYTIME you are given a ticket you have been arrested, even if its for a seatlbelt, speeding, whatever the offense. you get a ticket, you've been arrested.
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The cop took my gun...
- Thread starter love4guns
- Start date
what kind of response is this?? this is why we cant fix America today. you think throwing ppl in jail for every little thing is the answer?? i guess you'll tell us you've never sped in your whole life next.
A question for all of you debating that being stopped for "traffic offenses" is not an /arrest/ -
If traffic offenses are not crimes, by what legal theory can the cops
1) use their emergency lights as a signal that you are compelled to pull over
2) give chase to you if you refuse to pull over (especially if you do a "low-speed chase")?
3) charge you with the crimes of eluding/evading, failing to stop, etc.?
In other words, if "traffic offenses" are not crimes, they must be civil torts, for which one cannot be arrested and for which there is a formal procedure for serving someone with notice that they have been accused of committing (of which being chased down and held with force is not one of those).
As an example, parking when the time has expired on a parking meter is a civil tort. It is not a crime, and thus there is no penalty for driving off before the cop has finished writing the ticket (although the cop will try to create one out of your doing so). If the cop was convinced that time had expired, he can mail the ticket to you (cheaper than driving to your house and nailing it to the front door).
I'll be sitting over there in the corner holding my breath waiting for your answers.
stay safe.
If traffic offenses are not crimes, by what legal theory can the cops
1) use their emergency lights as a signal that you are compelled to pull over
2) give chase to you if you refuse to pull over (especially if you do a "low-speed chase")?
3) charge you with the crimes of eluding/evading, failing to stop, etc.?
In other words, if "traffic offenses" are not crimes, they must be civil torts, for which one cannot be arrested and for which there is a formal procedure for serving someone with notice that they have been accused of committing (of which being chased down and held with force is not one of those).
As an example, parking when the time has expired on a parking meter is a civil tort. It is not a crime, and thus there is no penalty for driving off before the cop has finished writing the ticket (although the cop will try to create one out of your doing so). If the cop was convinced that time had expired, he can mail the ticket to you (cheaper than driving to your house and nailing it to the front door).
I'll be sitting over there in the corner holding my breath waiting for your answers.
stay safe.
Where did you see me say its cool to drive 20 over???? Your quick and ignorant assumption that i was in a residential area is incorrect. I was behind my office which is next to an old country road that starts out 35mph and then jumps up to 55mph. As for praying for the cops to come before you do........damn im sooooooooo scared
They've cured all the problems in their state and want to help the po folks here:lol:
My response
Many of you seem to think I am some idiot that was unaware of the cop's intentions in reguards to my firearm. I knew fully what was going to happen once I turned over the firearm. Had I said NO leave the gun there, he would have claimed that I was under arrest therefore he had a right to remove the gun. I did not argee to some sort of arrangement with the officer. Hey, "you run my gun and Ill get a $30 ticket instead of a $200 ticket." The reason I said the cop was "cool" was because I was judging him based on my standards for cops (not very high). Bottomline you live and you learn. If I am in this situation again the gun will remain in the glovebox or center console. As for the gun being entered into some federal database....i bought it from a FFL dealer therefore its already in a database. I am the last person to "bend over" as some of you tastefully put it, for a cop. What many of you are doing is Monday quarterbacking. You may think you would have turned to the cop and said f-off after doing 25 in a 55. I could have said that but that would have created more problems for me. I have a clean driving record and still do after this incident mainly because I know how to handle the police. You people are crazy that say I gave up a right to forego a speeding ticket.
Many of you seem to think I am some idiot that was unaware of the cop's intentions in reguards to my firearm. I knew fully what was going to happen once I turned over the firearm. Had I said NO leave the gun there, he would have claimed that I was under arrest therefore he had a right to remove the gun. I did not argee to some sort of arrangement with the officer. Hey, "you run my gun and Ill get a $30 ticket instead of a $200 ticket." The reason I said the cop was "cool" was because I was judging him based on my standards for cops (not very high). Bottomline you live and you learn. If I am in this situation again the gun will remain in the glovebox or center console. As for the gun being entered into some federal database....i bought it from a FFL dealer therefore its already in a database. I am the last person to "bend over" as some of you tastefully put it, for a cop. What many of you are doing is Monday quarterbacking. You may think you would have turned to the cop and said f-off after doing 25 in a 55. I could have said that but that would have created more problems for me. I have a clean driving record and still do after this incident mainly because I know how to handle the police. You people are crazy that say I gave up a right to forego a speeding ticket.
nuc65
Activist Member
I'm not really certain what an anti-virus company has to do with word choice.
Go ask Nuance, I'm not getting very far with them (it).... (took two hours to convince it Taser wasn't spelled with a Z.
Relax. Let me interpret out-of-state-ese for you.
Until and unless = I'm too lazy to go look this up myself
someone can show me = for some reason Wikipedia does not load on my computer
that any traffic stop = as opposed to any other action taken by the police using what in theory and practice is the police power of arrest
in Virginia = as opposed to Utiopia, where I live next door to those farting unicons who live under the skittle-raining rainbows
(for an infraction, not a crime) = see? I know there is both a "criminal code" and all the other stuff
is an arrest, = you know, being stopped by the cops and not free to go until properly dismissed, but really it should involve being spread-eagled on the pavement and being trussed up with handcuffs just so there is no question about my not being able to leave because I cannot pick a set of cuffs that are applied with my hands behind my back
I decline to believe = as opposed to thinking or reasoning things out
that an officer = as opposed to a bus driver or popcorn vendor or any of at least a dozen others who can legally compel me to pull my car over and stop the engine
can search the vehicle absent any other RAS or probable cause = because we all know that cops never violate any of the laws, or ever violate even the teeny-tiniest of the rights of anyone
No charge for the service. It's something any Come-Here ought to do, seeing as we are by definition bi-lingual (Virginian and whatever it was they spoke in the place we had the good sense to leave).
stay safe.
Ha! i think you nailed it Skid.
Well, except for that 'Relax' part... I don't get to worked up about this online sh.... stuff. Life is too short to dwell on silly stuff.
Some isn't too bad.... like Massa Doug used to say:
The prime directive gives rise to the spoiled apple.
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twoskinsonemanns
Regular Member
I apologize in regards to my last post. I don't know what got into me. It was VERY crude. But the points behind the facade are true.
Anyway in principle once anyone starts waving around his POST COUNT like some proof of his intelligence, or brings up grammar I usually realize that person has nothing else intelligent to say and I move on. But I did want to say sorry.
twoskinsonemanns
Regular Member
You've made really GREAT points.
I remember when I was 17 learning about the way traffic tickets are dealt with. I remember thinking "do people know what they are doing?". It's a crime, but the "normal" rights applicable to crimes are removed. No trial, no public defender, etc. Over the years as I learned about life I realized that speeding tickets are nothing more than a tax. If the government really cared about speeding they would deter people from doing it. But they DON'T. Speeding tickets are a required income to support the local gov.
I wasn't waving around MY post count, I was waving around YOURS!
Coming into a Virginia forum from West Virginia and pushing Virginians around is a pretty good way to start an unpleasant conversation.
Now...if you all hadn't decided to leave Virginia and side with the Yankees so you could become West Virginia in the Great War of Northern Aggression, you wouldn't be a foreigner with a low post count.:lol:
Apology accepted and no need to move on. Could have been worse. You could have been from Joisey!:uhoh:
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davidmcbeth
Banned
POACHERS ! lol
twoskinsonemanns
Regular Member
So funny the "coming into a Virginia forum". It really is funny to me. I lived in Virginia for years. Then when I bought my house I picked it without much consideration about the which state it is in. It happens to be 5 miles over the border.
Does that make me not welcome in the Virginia forum? Anyway perhaps this site should institute some kind of system where until you have a certain amount of post you can only respond to other post be selecting one of few pre-written approved replies.
Also I appreciate you accepting my apology. And God couldn't drag me to me to Jersey!
So funny the "coming into a Virginia forum". It really is funny to me. I lived in Virginia for years. Then when I bought my house I picked it without much consideration about the which state it is in. It happens to be 5 miles over the border.
I spent a third of my life with my right foot in West Virginia and the left in Virginia.
Anyway perhaps this site should institute some kind of system where until you have a certain amount of post you can only respond to other post be selecting one of few pre-written approved replies.
That's not a bad idea...I'll write a few up this evening. Thanks!:banana:
Also I appreciate you accepting my apology. And God couldn't drag me to me to Jersey!
....
jmelvin
Founder's Club Member
So funny the "coming into a Virginia forum". It really is funny to me. I lived in Virginia for years. Then when I bought my house I picked it without much consideration about the which state it is in. It happens to be 5 miles over the border.
Anyway perhaps this site should institute some kind of system where until you have a certain amount of post you can only respond to other post be selecting one of few pre-written approved replies.
Also I appreciate you accepting my apology. And God couldn't drag me to me to Jersey!
Twoskins welcome to OCDO. I can't speak for any of the other, but I'm glad to see you here contributing and asking questions no matter whether you come from Virginia, West Virginia or Timbuktu. Please continue to contribute without consideration to some of those who like to be contrary on occasion.
ManInBlack
Regular Member
Just looking for a cite is all. It is a forum rule, after all.