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Challenge to the "lesser of two evils" crowd

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
I keep hearing mooselips dither and qualify and back-pedal. Okay. He's feeling attacked. And he is being attacked. And rightly so. His half-baked justification for voting for someone he doesn't like is about as useful as nipples on men.

This thread is irrevocably derailed. FINE YOU BASTARDS I HATE YOU! :) So let's talk, yet again, about principled voting.

There are two fundamental positions, when it comes to voting: 1) you vote for the person you think might be able to win, based upon some selection criterion that identifies such person as being the closest, however far away, to your world view; and 2) you vote for the person you think would actually represent you.

Interestingly, it's always the people in camp 1) who appeal to principle while insisting that their just-less-than-worst-case pick is the only moral choice, while insisting that those in camp 2) are secret agents for the other side at best, or ignorant morons who want to destroy the world, at worst. In reality, only the people in camp 2) can sleep with a clear conscience.
 

hjmoosejaw

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
406
Location
N.W. Pa.
If that's the case, I presume you'll vote for Obama if a poll comes out shortly before the election stating he is ahead.


I said my favorite. Not Obama! If you read any of my replies, I think it's obvious that I don't want Obama to win. There seems to be a lot of jumping on the bandwagon, but nobody seems to be willing to answer the original question. Will you vote for Romney or stay home? Before words are put in my mouth. I understand that who you vote for is private and your own business. BUT, I also understand that some of you just don't want to be ostracized from the Ron Paul club.
 

hjmoosejaw

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
406
Location
N.W. Pa.
I keep hearing mooselips dither and qualify and back-pedal. Okay. He's feeling attacked. And he is being attacked. And rightly so. His half-baked justification for voting for someone he doesn't like is about as useful as nipples on men.

This thread is irrevocably derailed. FINE YOU BASTARDS I HATE YOU! :) So let's talk, yet again, about principled voting.

There are two fundamental positions, when it comes to voting: 1) you vote for the person you think might be able to win, based upon some selection criterion that identifies such person as being the closest, however far away, to your world view; and 2) you vote for the person you think would actually represent you.

Interestingly, it's always the people in camp 1) who appeal to principle while insisting that their just-less-than-worst-case pick is the only moral choice, while insisting that those in camp 2) are secret agents for the other side at best, or ignorant morons who want to destroy the world, at worst. In reality, only the people in camp 2) can sleep with a clear conscience.


"Mooselips" That's a hoot! Think that up by yourself? I'm not dithering,qualifying, or back-pedaling. Also, I don't feel attacked. I don't have to justify who I'm voting for. What do I care what you think? It doesn't bother me that others agree with you. There must be a lot of people voting for Romney, being that he's the front-runner, and Ron Paul, well, isn't. I am curious about the original question though. Could be some agree, but don't want to deal with the B.S.
 

hjmoosejaw

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
406
Location
N.W. Pa.
You said "the favorite." In American English, that phrase refers to the likely winner.

Go back and check my reply. It says "my favorite". We can go back and forth all day. Why don't some of you just go on record by answering the question? I say what I mean. I don't care what others think.
 

DrakeZ07

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,080
Location
Lexington, Ky
Hmm, Romney vs Obama... I'll vote for Obama, again. The only decent president to come from Massachusetts was John Adams, and his Son, and that's a big stretch of things, but at-least the former was a fighter during the revolutionary war in the diplomatic sense, a level headed lawyer who wasn't afraid to play devils advocate, and the latter was sent to learn of Russian, and other societies. Cannot say the same for Romney.
 

Sorcice

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2011
Messages
381
Location
Madison, WI
Is there really a point to voting in the main election if the electoral colleges don't have to follow popular vote? Sure they do most times but as seen in in recent years bush won not of popular vote but electoral. I've heard of people renting an apartment and changing where they are registered so their vote counts for more in the elections within the same party leading up to the big show. Say your state is going to lean heavily to santorum and your a Romney fan. In order to help another state that's more on the fence you could rent a property and register to vote in that state where your vote would technically mean more than your home state..
 
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gunns

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2011
Messages
270
Location
Minnesota
I read allot of good arguments here so here is mine.

If Ron Paul runs and so does Romney, the Obama will win. Ron just won't get enough votes, sadly, because he has mine.

If Ron does not run and puts all his support behind Romney, Romney may win. If Obama wins he will destroy whats left of our Constitution and we will be answering to the U.N. If Romney wins, he will destroy us much slower, but he too has to pony up to those elite in charge.

So its death by bullet train, or death by a million paper cuts.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
After reading comment about the subject on Lewrockwell.com on the lack of "Romney" campaign signs, I started looking. I haven't seen one bumper sticker one sign for him in my county. And the lack of Obama signs and stickers interest me too, compared to the last election.

I do see a lot of Ron Paul signs and bumper stickers. Too bad people will just vote for who they believe to be the likely winner of the two evils.
 

hjmoosejaw

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
406
Location
N.W. Pa.
True. And the Republican Party obviously didn't learn the lesson the first time. Perhaps it is time for the lesson to be repeated.

I agree that the Republican party has some lessons to learn. I just don't think that learning a lesson at the time Obama could be re-elected is the right time. This country is on a verge right now. We may not have a country in 4 years.
 

ManInBlack

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
1,551
Location
SW Idaho
Hmm, Romney vs Obama... I'll vote for Obama, again. <snipped wholly irrelevant non sequitur>

Hmm, as a good liberal, weren't you against the wars, the abuse of civil liberties under the PATRIOT act and executive orders, the crackdowns on medical marijuana patients (all things I also opposed, by the way), and other unfortunate actions of the Bush administration? Obama has continued and expanded all of the above, yet simple Obamatons like you still think he's better for some reason (voting for a man of (half) color makes you feel better about yourself?).

How's that whole "hope and change" thing working out for you? If you opposed Bush and vote for Obama again, you are either a fool, a hypocrite, or both.

P.S.: Just because he gave your little "community" a reacharound the other day (forced on him by bin Biden, the dumbest VP since Quayle), doesn't mean that he is expressing his true liberal values. Obama, during his career, has not "evolved" on the issue, only completely changed his position when it suited him, depending on which race he was running at the time. It is more clearly an example of his master manipulation skills. He sees what makes folks like you tick, and played you like a violin. The existence of so many blind drones, like yourself, who are easily controlled by demagogues, provides a great illustration of why the Founders (along with every great political thinker since Aristotle) considered democracy to be, by far, the worst form of government.
 

SoLasVegas

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
120
Location
Las Vegas, ,
I read allot of good arguments here so here is mine.

If Ron Paul runs and so does Romney, the Obama will win.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...three_way_race_romney_44_obama_39_ron_paul_13
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...radio_updates/radio_update_romney_49_obama_44

These two polls were from the same day last week.

In a 2-way race, Romney wins 49 to 44.
In a 3-way race including Ron Paul, Romney still wins 44 to 39, and RP picks up 13%.

It shows that Paul pulls just as many points from Obama as he does from Romney, and also picks up 3% who were either undecided or voting for a different candidate.
 

DrakeZ07

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,080
Location
Lexington, Ky
Hmm, as a good liberal, weren't you against the wars, the abuse of civil liberties under the PATRIOT act and executive orders, the crackdowns on medical marijuana patients (all things I also opposed, by the way), and other unfortunate actions of the Bush administration? Obama has continued and expanded all of the above, yet simple Obamatons like you still think he's better for some reason (voting for a man of (half) color makes you feel better about yourself?).

How's that whole "hope and change" thing working out for you? If you opposed Bush and vote for Obama again, you are either a fool, a hypocrite, or both.

P.S.: Just because he gave your little "community" a reacharound the other day (forced on him by bin Biden, the dumbest VP since Quayle), doesn't mean that he is expressing his true liberal values. Obama, during his career, has not "evolved" on the issue, only completely changed his position when it suited him, depending on which race he was running at the time. It is more clearly an example of his master manipulation skills. He sees what makes folks like you tick, and played you like a violin. The existence of so many blind drones, like yourself, who are easily controlled by demagogues, provides a great illustration of why the Founders (along with every great political thinker since Aristotle) considered democracy to be, by far, the worst form of government.

Actually, I whole-heartedly, and still do, support the war effort in Afghanistan, and I supported the invasion, take-over, and war in Iraq as well. As I have also supported Military action in Libya, Egypt, and Syria in any and all forms. So no, little MIB, I was -not- opposed, or against any of the U.S. Lead, or backed military actions Since Dubya became President.

I do however, have and still oppose the USAPATRIOT act, and similiar policies and/or legislation. In all actuality, I only oppose few of Fmr President Bush's policies, and legislation, as opposed to my hostility to a majority of current President Obama's policies and indescreations.

Tell me, on how exactly openly supporting the LGBT community, helps us in any way, when the slight majority of our House, and senate at-large, still oppose same-sex, and trans-gender equality.

Obama's lack of evolution within his career, his near-constant flip-flopping of issues, and choices, deciding, and undeciding, is not that uncommmon for the Office of President. As, if anyone of a sane, level-head can tell, every single president we've had, since our nations' founding, has displayed the same exact 'features'. Even the, so-called "great republican", Lincoln, flip-flopped on the issue of emancipation, at first favoring deportation of Black-americans, then to "separate, but equal" in his later months in office.

Oh, and for the record... I am -not- 'liberal'; I'm a "dixiecrat", a Southern-Democrat, I hold ultra-conservative views on economy, Liberal on Social issues, and neutral on foreign policy. Furthermore, I would ask you to please keep your personal attacks on my character, and latent down-grading, to yourself. Just because you can put someone down, insult them, and their political decisions/opinions/points-of-view on issues their most vocal on, doesn't mean you should; As this is online, and a private board, such "free speech" is not guaranteed, you want to enjoy such freedoms, do so offline, in a peaceably assembled group of like-minded individuals, etc.
 
H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
I'm a "dixiecrat", a Southern-Democrat, I hold ultra-conservative views on economy, Liberal on Social issues, and neutral on foreign policy.
You don't know what you're talking about. My good friend Strom Thurmond is spinning in his grave. Prolly grinning for the unholy epithet he might have spat at you with a swig of good corn liquor. Mind your tongue and your manners.
 
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