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Thread: Marine gets turned away from voting because of OC'ing

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Marine gets turned away from voting because of OC'ing

    hey guys. just wanted to let you know about what's going on with my brother. this is being discussed in the indiana forum and in hot topics, but i thought i'd bring this to the attention of my fellow michiganders.

    http://www.abc57.com/news/local/Mari...150690385.html

    and more recently:

    http://www.abc57.com/news/local/Mari...151182135.html

    if anyone is interested in showing support, i have set up a facebook group and a twitter account: @SupportClay1775

    https://www.facebook.com/groups/435282603167094/
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  2. #2
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    Duh I understand du right but not du reason...

    The right is the reason. That guy needs to be fired on the spot. No retirement, benefits or any other .gov perk.

  3. #3
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Guy A. Relford Indianapolis Indiana firearms attorney will be joining Doc Wesson and Mark Vanderberg on the May 16, 2012 episode of Bar Stool Discussion live on the Gun Rights Radio Network. Show starts at 9 PM Eastern time and you can listen live and join in on the chat room by going to http://gunrightsradio.com/live

    Open carry into Indiana polling places will be the topic of discussion for the 1st hour of the show. I know this is IN and not MI, but (almost) the same carry rules apply in both states, and there are police and election workers who think carrying in a polling place is illegal, so this may interest all of us.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
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  4. #4
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Guy A. Relford is the attorney representing my brother Clay Edinger https://www.facebook.com/groups/435282603167094/
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  5. #5
    Regular Member OneForAll's Avatar
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    Your brother served to protect his freedoms, and then had not one but two rejected. I hope this person is fired and is made an example of.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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  7. #7
    Regular Member OneForAll's Avatar
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    I real hope something is done about this. Thank you for the update.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Filed today!


    downloadable copy:
    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/147289/Clay..._Complaint.pdf
    STATE OF INDIANA ) IN THE SAINT JOSEPH COUNTY COURT

    ) SS:
    COUNTY OF ST. JOSEPH ) CAUSE NUMBER:


    CLAY C. EDINGER, )
    )
    Plaintiff, )
    )
    v. )
    )
    THE ST. JOSEPH COUNTY ELECTION )
    BOARD, )
    THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS OF )
    ST. JOSEPH COUNTY, )
    THE ST. JOSEPH COUNTY POLICE )
    DEPARTMENT, )
    THE WARREN TOWNSHIP BOARD )
    OF TRUSTEES, and )
    THE WARREN TOWNSHIP FIRE )
    DEPARTMENT, )
    )
    Defendants. )


    COMPLAINT

    Plaintiff, Clay C. Edinger (“Plaintiff”), pursuant to §35-47-11.1-1, et seq., by and through his undersigned counsel, alleges and says as follows:

    1. Plaintiff brings this action against the St. Joseph County Election Board, the Board of Commissioners of St. Joseph County, the St. Joseph County Police Department, the Warren Township Board of Trustees, and the Warren Township Fire Department (“Defendants,” collectively), based on Defendants’ violation of Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, et seq., as more fully set forth below.



    BACKGROUND

    2. Indiana law has long prohibited most local regulation of firearms by political subdivisions in an attempt to ensure a uniform and consistent system of regulating firearms in Indiana. Otherwise, Indiana residents are at risk of unknowingly and unintentionally violating conflicting and inconsistent firearm regulations imposed by different political subdivisions throughout the State.

    3. Prior to July 1, 2011, Ind. Code §35-41-11-2 (now repealed) identified two exceptions to the general rule that State law preempts local governments’ attempts to regulate firearms: a) a political subdivision could use its zoning powers to prevent the sale of firearms within two hundred (200) feet of a school under most circumstances; and b) a political subdivision could regulate firearms on land, in buildings or on other real property owned or managed by the political subdivision.

    4. In recent years, the Indiana General Assembly recognized that different political subdivisions in Indiana were regulating firearms in widely varying ways on municipal property or in local government buildings, so that lawful Indiana gun owners remained in jeopardy of unknowingly and unintentionally violating conflicting and inconsistent ordinances in effect in different local jurisdictions throughout the State, which was directly inconsistent with the original intent of the preemption statute. As such, the General Assembly substantially amended the scope of the statute in 2011.

    5. Effective July 1, 2011, the preemption statute, now codified as Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-1, et. seq., disallows most regulation of firearms on property or in buildings owned or managed by a political subdivision (although certain exceptions, including the zoning powers identified above, remain in place).

    6. The new statute prohibits most local regulation of firearms, ammunition and firearms accessories, as follows:

    Except as provided in section 4 of this chapter, a political subdivision may not regulate:
    (1) firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories;
    (2) the ownership, possession, carrying, transportation, registration, transfer, and storage of firearms, ammunition, and firearm accessories; and
    (3) commerce in and taxation of firearms, firearm ammunition, and firearm accessories.

    Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2.

    7. In addition, any attempt to regulate firearms by a political subdivision, in conflict with Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2 above, is void and unenforceable:

    Any provision of an ordinance, measure, enactment, rule, or policy or exercise of proprietary authority of a political subdivision or of an employee or agent of a political subdivision acting in an official capacity:
    (1) enacted or undertaken before, on, or after June 30, 2011; and
    (2) that pertains to or affects the matters listed in section 2 of this chapter;
    is void.

    Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-3.

    8. The preemption statute provides a remedy to persons adversely affected by the illegal regulation of firearms by a political subdivision:

    A person adversely affected by an ordinance, a measure, an enactment, a rule, or a policy adopted or enforced by a political subdivision that violates this chapter may file an action in a court with competent jurisdiction against the political subdivision for:
    (1) declarative and injunctive relief; and
    (2) actual and consequential damages attributable to the violation.

    Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-5.


    THE PARTIES

    9. Plaintiff is a lawful resident of Warren Township and St. Joseph County, Indiana, United States of America.

    10. Plaintiff is a lawful owner of a firearm under the laws of the State of Indiana and holds a valid License to Carry Handgun issued by the Superintendant of the Indiana State Police in full compliance with Ind. Code §35-47-2-3.

    11. Warren Township is a political subdivision within the meaning of Ind. Code §3-5-2-38 and §35-47-11.1-1 and is located in St. Joseph County, State of Indiana. Warren Township operates by and through the acts and/or omissions of Defendants, the Warren Township Board of Trustees (“Board of Trustees”) and/or the Warren Township Fire Department (“WTFD”).

    12. St. Joseph County is a political subdivision within the meaning of Ind. Code §3-5-2-38 and §35-47-11.1-1 and is located in the State of Indiana. St. Joseph County operates by and through the acts and/or omissions of Defendants, the Board of Commissioners of St. Joseph County (“Board of Commissioners”), the St. Joseph County Election Board (“Election Board”) and/or the St. Joseph County Police Department (“SJCPD”).

    13. The Election Board was created by statute, Ind. Code §3-6-5-1, and has the legal duty to “conduct all elections and administer the election laws within [St. Joseph] county” pursuant to Ind. Code §3-6-5-14(a)(2).

    JURISDICTION AND VENUE
    14. Jurisdiction and venue are proper in this Court for the following reasons:

    A. Plaintiff is a resident of St. Joseph County, State of Indiana.

    B. Each defendant is a governmental entity located in St. Joseph County, State of Indiana.
    C. Rules, policies or exercises of proprietary authority were enforced against Plaintiff by agents and/or employees of Defendants that violated Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, above. Those violations occurred in St. Joseph County, State of Indiana, as more thoroughly set forth below.
    FACTUAL ALLEGATIONS

    15. On May 8, 2012, primary elections were conducted in St. Joseph County and overseen by the Election Board.

    16. At approximately 9:40 a.m. on May 8, 2012, Plaintiff arrived at his designated polling station, the Warren Township Fire Station #2, located at 59330 Crumstown Highway, North Liberty, Indiana. That fire station is owned and/or operated by and through the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees and/or WTFD.

    17. At the time that Plaintiff arrived at the polling station, and consistent with his daily practice, Plaintiff had in his possession a legally-owned handgun. He also had in his possession his valid Indiana License to Carry Handgun.

    18. Plaintiff entered the “chute” of the polling station and handed his valid Indiana driver’s license to a poll worker. The poll worker accepted the Plaintiff’s driver’s license and began to look up Plaintiff’s name in the roll of registered voters.

    19. A person identified as “T. Vanoverbergh” approached Plaintiff and informed Plaintiff that he “could not have a gun in the building.” Plaintiff inquired as to the authority that Mr. Vanoverbergh was relying upon to make that statement. Mr. Vanoverbergh responded with various and conflicting answers, including: a) “It’s against my policy because I’m in charge here;” b) “It’s against Warren Township policy to have a gun in a fire station;” c) “Federal law prohibits guns in polling places;” d) “It’s illegal to ‘open carry’ in Indiana;” e) “State law prohibits guns in fire stations;” and f) “State law prohibits guns at polling places.” At all relevant times, Mr. Vanoverbergh was acting as an agent and/or employee of the Election Board, the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees, WTFD and/or the SJCPD.

    20. Mr. Vanoverbergh then ordered Plaintiff to leave the polling station and Plaintiff complied by walking outside the building. Mr. Vanoverbergh then informed Plaintiff that members of the SJCPD were already in route to the polling station at the request of Mr. Vanoverbergh.

    21. Thereafter, Officer Banicki of SJCPD arrived and informed Plaintiff that the reasons that Officer Vanoverbergh had refused to allow Plaintiff to vote were valid and that Plaintiff could not vote while in possession of a firearm. Officer Banicki also informed Plaintiff that if Plaintiff persisted in his attempts to vote without relinquishing his firearm, Banicki would “revoke your permit on the spot, confiscate your handgun and force you to appeal that decision in Indianapolis.” At all relevant times, Officer Banicki was acting as an agent and/or employee of the Election Board, the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees, WTFD and/or the SJCPD.

    22. Another agent and/or employee of WTFD then approached with a laptop computer and stated that he was attempting to identify a law that Plaintiff was violating by not concealing his handgun and/or by possessing a firearm at a polling place and/or possessing a firearm at a fire station. No such law was identified by that individual.

    23. Sgt. K. Glueckert of the SJCPD then arrived and took possession of Plaintiff’s License to Carry Handgun and Indiana driver’s license. Sgt. Glueckert eventually received word, reportedly from an attorney at the Election Board, that Ind. Code §35-47-2 prohibited Plaintiff from carrying a firearm in a polling station. Plaintiff knew that said statute was entirely inapplicable to the circumstances, but complied with the various orders of the Defendants that he not enter the polling station to vote. At all relevant times, Sgt. Glueckert and the unidentified attorney who communicated with Sgt. Glueckert were acting as agents and/or employees of the Election Board, the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees, WTFD and/or SJCPD.

    24. Later in the day, Plaintiff confirmed that Ind. Code §35-47-2 did not prevent him from carrying a firearm at a polling station or a fire station and returned to the polling station at approximately 5:40 p.m. in another attempt to exercise his legal right to vote. As Plaintiff approached the building, the poll inspector, Mr. Gus Tillman, was standing at the door of the polling station, blocking the way inside. Plaintiff stated to Mr. Tillman, “I’d like to vote tonight. Will you let me do that?” Mr. Tillman responded, “I cannot let you come in. I had the election board call me. I cannot let you come in.” As a result, Mr. Tillman denied Plaintiff his legal right to vote, specifically and solely because Plaintiff was legally carrying a firearm. At all relevant times, Mr. Tillman was acting as an agent and/or employee of the Election Board, the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees and/or the WTFD.

    25. A few minutes later, Officer Chuck Flanagan of SJCPD arrived and approached Plaintiff. Officer Flanagan informed Plaintiff that he could not vote while carrying a firearm. At that point, Plaintiff again left the premises, having again been prevented from exercising his legal right to vote. At all relevant times, Officer Flanagan was acting as an agent and/or employee of the Election Board, the Board of Commissioners, the Board of Trustees, WTFD and/or SJCPD.

    26. No legal justification existed for Defendants, through their agents and/or employees, to deny Plaintiff his right to vote while carrying a legally-possessed and carried firearm.

    CAUSE OF ACTION
    27. Plaintiff asserts a single cause of action in this matter: the statutory cause of action defined by Ind. Code §§35-47-11.1-5 through 35-47-11.1-7:
    A person adversely affected by an ordinance, a measure, an enactment, a rule, or a policy adopted or enforced by a political subdivision that violates this chapter may file an action in a court with competent jurisdiction against the political subdivision for:
    (1) declarative and injunctive relief; and
    (2) actual and consequential damages attributable to the violation.

    * * *
    A person is "adversely affected" for purposes of section 5 of this chapter if either of the following applies:
    (1) The person is an individual who meets all of the following requirements:
    (A) The individual lawfully resides within the United States.

    (B) The individual may legally possess a firearm under the laws of Indiana.

    (C) The individual is or was subject to the ordinance, measure, enactment, rule, or policy of the political subdivision that is the subject of an action filed under section 5 of this chapter. An individual is or was subject to the ordinance, measure, enactment, rule, or policy of the political subdivision if the individual is or was physically present within the boundaries of the political subdivision for any reason.
    * * *
    A prevailing plaintiff in an action under section 5 of this chapter is entitled to recover from the political subdivision the following:
    (1) The greater of the following:
    (A) Actual damages, including consequential damages.
    (B) Liquidated damages of three (3) times the plaintiff's attorney's fees.
    (2) Court costs (including fees).
    (3) Reasonable attorney's fees.

    28. As set forth in Paragraphs 15 through 25, above, Defendants, by and through their agents and/or employees and on behalf of St. Joseph County and Warren Township as political subdivisions, enforced “a measure, enactment, rule, policy or exercise of proprietary authority” against Plaintiff, specifically:

    A. Defendants adopted and enforced an illegal policy that required Plaintiff to relinquish his legal right to carry a firearm in order to vote.

    B. Defendants adopted and enforced an illegal policy that prevented Plaintiff from carrying a firearm into a polling station.

    C. Defendants adopted and enforced an illegal policy that prevented Plaintiff from carrying a firearm into a fire station. (“Illegal Policies,” collectively),

    29. The Illegal Policies set forth above each constitute the regulation of “firearms” and/or the “carrying of firearms” in violation of Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, above.

    30. Plaintiff has been adversely affected by Defendants’ Illegal Policies, as defined by Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-6. Specifically, Plaintiff was “subject to” the Illegal Policies set forth in Paragraph 26, inter alia, by being ordered by Defendants to relinquish his firearm in order to vote and/or for being prevented from carrying a firearm into the polling station by Defendants, through their agents and employees. In addition, Plaintiff was “subject to” the Illegal Policies by being physically present within the boundaries of Warren Township and/or St. Joseph County where said Illegal Policies were “adopted or enforced” against Plaintiff, as defined in Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-5 and 35-47-11.1-6.

    31. As a result of the above, Plaintiff has incurred actual damages and/or is entitled to liquidated damages.

    NO CAUSE OF ACTION IN TORT IS ALLEGED
    32. Plaintiff does not assert any cause of action based on any theory of tort, however named, on behalf of himself or any other person. Plaintiff’s sole cause of action is based on Defendants’ violation of Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, et seq.
    RELIEF REQUESTED
    33. WHEREFORE, Plaintiff requests judgment on his behalf, and against the Defendants, and each of them, awarding the following relief:
    (A) The greater of the following:
    (1) actual damages, including consequential damages, or
    (2) three (3) times Plaintiff’s’ attorney’s fees as liquidated damages.
    (B) Declaratory relief, in the form of a Declaratory Judgment finding the Illegal Policies to be void and unenforceable under Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, et. seq.
    (D) Injunctive relief, ordering Defendants to refrain from enforcing the Illegal Policies or any other “ordinance, measure, enactment, rule, or policy or exercise of proprietary authority” that violates Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-2, et. seq.
    (E) Attorneys’ fees, as authorized by Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-7.
    (F) Costs of this action, including fees, as authorized by Ind. Code §35-47-11.1-7.
    (G) Such other relief as the Court deems just and proper in the premises.


    Guy A. Relford
    Attorney No. 6450-49

    Attorney for Plaintiff, Clay C. Edinger

    Law Offices of Guy A. Relford
    4181 First Flight Circle
    Zionsville, IN 46077
    (317) 450-8252
    (317) 873-9193 (facsimile)
    grelford@global-lit.com
    Last edited by smellslikemichigan; 08-22-2012 at 06:05 PM.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  9. #9
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    I came here to update this thread. LOL.

    Did you post this to MOC yet?
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
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  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    nah, since it was indiana i left it off of there. i updated INGO though.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  11. #11
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    i updated INGO though.
    Yeah, I saw it over there.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  12. #12
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    Sounds like this should be a quick open and shut case. Sounds like this attorney is going to tear the city and its employees apart for what happened that day! I cant wait to hear the outcome, thanks for posting this.
    The worst weapon is the human mind, its created and done things far worse than a gun can, has, or ever will. Its the human mind that tells the gun what to do and animates the inanimate object.

    With all these gun control laws in place I have yet to find a single one that has saved someones life, but I can find hundreds of stories where a gun has.

  13. #13
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    yes, his attorney is a gun nut. even runs a tactical runs a tactical firearms training academy:
    https://www.facebook.com/TFT.Indy
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  14. #14
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Re: Marine gets turned away from voting because of OC'ing

    Thanks for the update. I hope your brother wins; following the law this should be an open/shut case.

    Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both!
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  15. #15
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    New news article on the incident that points out just how poorly local officials, including law enforcement, are educated about gun laws. One attorney, not affiliated with this case, states, “I think the average person carrying openly into a polling station would do it because (the Second Amendment) is the reason they’re voting.”

    Lawsuits test gun restrictions at polling places, local regulations
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
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  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    he's absolutely right
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  17. #17
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  18. #18
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    Thanks for the update. INGO banned me for four days.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    really?!?!?!?
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  20. #20
    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Cool Victory!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post

  21. #21
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    really?!?!?!?
    Yep. However, the ban will be lifted about the same time we know for sure who our next president will be.
    Last edited by griffin; 11-05-2012 at 09:14 PM.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  22. #22
    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by griffin View Post
    Thanks for the update. INGO banned me for four days.
    You naughty boy, you- were you telling the truth again? People hate that.....
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Statement from Attorney Guy Relford regarding the disposition of (my brother) CCE1302's lawsuit:
    Congratulations to Clay on the successful resolution of this litigation. Because he stood his ground and defended his Constitutional rights, poll workers across the state have been reeducated and Indiana gun owners are much less likely to have their rights infringed at the polls. It was my honor and privilege to represent Capt. Edinger in this case and I am proud to call him my friend as well.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  24. #24
    Regular Member MI_XD's Avatar
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    Way to go Clay! Glad to hear they got some education down there in Indiana!

    Will this be of any benefit to us here in Michigan? Or, is it only going to affect voters in Indiana?

    MI_XD

  25. #25
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    What does "successful resolution" mean? Settlement? OK...sure....what settlement?

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