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open carry w/ one in the chamber? why or why not?

Breanne

Regular Member
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
10
Location
Hammond, LOUISIANA
this is all a matter of opinion; no wrong or right answer.

that being said, what do yall think?
also, it may help to specify the action.
 
H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
Yes, I do in both carry guns.

My open carry gun is a SA1911A1 designed to be carried in Cooper Condition one - round chambered, full magazine in place, hammer back and safety on. It is carried in a Blackhawk SERPA with two retention devices, an adjustable draw tension that requires a draw parallel to the device, and a trigger guard latch.

My concealed carry gun is a DA/SA H&K USPc .40 that I carry in Cooper Condition two - round chambered, hammer down with control lever in FIRE because that's the way I trained.

I do not carry my Luger, and I keep it's chamber empty and the safety off because the safety is ineffective and easily defeated. It is not a self-defense gun so there's plenty of time to prepare to fire.
 
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Shoobee

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
599
Location
CCCP (Calif)
If you are in the open carry mode, then your firearm is being proudly displayed to all the world, with the clear message that anyone who can go for it faster than you can, it's theirs.

Should someone try, your only chance is to be able to draw and fire it quickly, in less than one second.

That requires either a revolver, or else a semi-auto with a double or double-and-single action and a round chambered already, the hammer down, in condition #2, so that you do not need to futz with removing the safety, or with chambering a round using both hands, simply draw and pull the trigger, the fastest action possible.

Someone with a weapon already drawn, or who can defeat you without a weapon drawn, will beat you if they can do it in less than 1 second plus your reaction time.

Ergo, yes, you do need one in the chamber, but that's not all.

You need complete awareness of your total surroundings and anyone within 10 yards of you at all times.

You need to practice at least 15 minutes every day to get your draw and trigger pull to under 1 second. When you practice this, and you say "one thousand one" you should be finished before the "thousand."

Otherwise your gun (pistol or revolver) will belong to someone else, not to you.

Concealment is your next best defense. Together with that same less-than 1 second response. But now knowledge is power. And if they don't know where your gun is, then that gives you more time. Same requirement though, as you should be able to draw and fire it in less than 1 second.
 
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Shoobee

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
599
Location
CCCP (Calif)
If not condition ONE.....might as well just carry a hammer!

Most people don't realize that condition 1 is slower than condition 2 for a double action.

The early US Army manuals for the 1911A1 prescribe condition 1 for reholstering the weapon when riding on horseback.
 

newbie

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
148
Location
west bend
my gun is sa/da i keep one in the chamber safety off. the only way the gun will go off is if i pull the trigger with the right holster it wont go off in your pants.
 

4angrybadgers

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2009
Messages
411
Location
Hattiesburg, Mississippi, USA
One in the chamber, always. Doesn't matter whether it's my single-action Rock Island 1911, or my striker-fired Springfield XD. There is no guarantee that I will have a free hand to rack the slide - and if I'm carrying one of my children (which I frequently am), I definitely don't have a free hand!
 

Daylen

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
2,223
Location
America
Its not a matter of opinion. There is a right and wrong way on this, one in the chamber is right and and empty chamber is wrong. I can find the videos right now (any help on linking is appreciated), but there are a few that have floated around on here for a while that show a person trying to defend them-self with a pistol and fail because there is no cartridge in the chamber. In the heat of the moment needing two hands to make the firearm ready is wrong.

As far as the slightly off topic discussion of hammer position, I'd contend that it depends on the firearm.

All firearms are designed with a mode of carry (or a few) in mind, hammer at half, down, or up is one of those as is safety on or off. No pistols (that I've ever heard of anyway) are designed for an empty chamber. Some machine guns are designed for an empty chamber, however that is so far off topic I'll leave it there.
 

SickPythons

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2011
Messages
36
Location
Eastern CT
Its not a matter of opinion. There is a right and wrong way on this, one in the chamber is right and and empty chamber is wrong.

Sorry but the issue isn't black and white. The fact that you can find videos of other peoples' opinions on the matter does not make them the rule.

Obviously, round in chamber is faster in every way but with open carry you've got other factors than speed. I think the OP was trying to get a feel for how concerned everyone is about somebody taking their gun from them and having it be used against them. In this scenario, not having a round in the chamber would buy you some extra time to fight or flee.

4angrybadgers mentioned that he often has his free hand occupied by a child making one-hand use ideal, but that would also make you an easier target to be disarmed. An empty chamber might have a place in that argument also.


I'm not saying that I have a stance either way, just try not to shoot down someone's legitimate concerns because your views are so strong.
 

newbie

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
148
Location
west bend
there is no how to guide on to carry one in the chamber or without. just pulling your gun is going to stop an attacker most of the time (not everyone needs to be trigger happy to get that kill under your belt.).

now if you have to use it and hopefully you never have to because im pretty sure it will haunt you. you will have the option that your ready for it because you have one in the chamber. now if you have had your carry gun for a while you can rack it pretty quick however i see no need to waste my time racking my gun in a attack. so i will keep one in the pipe but if i ever have to pull it i wont take that safty off until im sure there is no other options for me.


but like i said do what you are comfortable with
 

Daylen

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
2,223
Location
America
Sorry but the issue isn't black and white. The fact that you can find videos of other peoples' opinions on the matter does not make them the rule.

Obviously, round in chamber is faster in every way but with open carry you've got other factors than speed. I think the OP was trying to get a feel for how concerned everyone is about somebody taking their gun from them and having it be used against them. In this scenario, not having a round in the chamber would buy you some extra time to fight or flee.

4angrybadgers mentioned that he often has his free hand occupied by a child making one-hand use ideal, but that would also make you an easier target to be disarmed. An empty chamber might have a place in that argument also.


I'm not saying that I have a stance either way, just try not to shoot down someone's legitimate concerns because your views are so strong.

If you can't discharge a cartridge when the matter is life and death, then you are carrying chunk of metal, not a firearm, kinda pointless and dangerous. If you can't keep control of your weapon, then you've already lost and carrying probably wasn't for you, perhaps running would have been a better option. Any delay in discharging a firearm in self defense once a need has arisen will benefit the offender as it gives time for them to complete their violent action, delays are the wrong way to go. And I don't feel strongly on any such subject, such would take caring; I don't care how you or anyone else carries a firearm as long as it is not a threat to me. All opinions are not correct as opinions are simply a judgement based upon incomplete knowledge.
 

thebigsd

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
3,535
Location
Quarryville, PA
I always carry with one in the chamber. If open carrying, I always use a proper retention holster. This is just common sense, I don't see much of a debate here.
 

newbie

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
Messages
148
Location
west bend
I always carry with one in the chamber. If open carrying, I always use a proper retention holster. This is just common sense, I don't see much of a debate here.

agreed.

using a cheap holster with a strap can be a bad idea. ill admit iv got a cheap one. when i first got my gun i thought just any would do. i thought it was perfect because it was made for my sidearm i got it off there web page also. but after having my girlfriend come behind me to try to take it she can do it almost with out a problem.

spend the extra money get a nice holster, no one will get your gun besides you.
 

MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,331
Location
Nevada
Most people don't realize that condition 1 is slower than condition 2 for a double action...

No it isn't. The thumb safety is disengaged during the rotation of the draw stroke, before the firearm is pointed downrange. At any time after rotation, while the firearm is being extended, it may be fired, just like with a double-action, only with a better trigger.
 

magnuman45

New member
Joined
May 23, 2012
Messages
2
Location
bossier city, louisiana
No matter what anyone says, one in the chamber, hammer back, safety on. I have a magnum research 1911g, so I have a thumb and grip safety. No worries about a negligent discharge. I've done lots of reading, and if anyone comes to disarm you, elbow on the grip. They may be strong, but not strong enough to break your arm bone. If you elbow down on the grip, they can't pull it out of the holster, they can't disarm. I will always have a full mag and a round chambered. Never know if you have one or nine assailants. I'm prepared either way.
 

Breanne

Regular Member
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
10
Location
Hammond, LOUISIANA
OP HERE.

I figure one in the chamber is the best way to go.
But as a female (and a small one at that) there is constantly this thought of "what if he gets a hold of my gun?"

Maybe it's just my own paranoia.
 

Ghostrunner

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Joined
Sep 6, 2009
Messages
5
Location
, ,
Why would you not carry one in the chamber. It just doesn't make any sense not too. ALWAYS CARRY ONE IN THE CHAMBER UT WILL MOST LIKELY SAVE YOUR LIFE OR A LOVED ONES.


Sent from my iPhone 4
 
H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
OP HERE. I figure one in the chamber is the best way to go. But as a female (and a small one at that) there is constantly this thought of "what if he gets a hold of my gun?" Maybe it's just my own paranoia.
That's what a good quality retention holster is for.
 

Daylen

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
2,223
Location
America
agreed.

using a cheap holster with a strap can be a bad idea. ill admit iv got a cheap one. when i first got my gun i thought just any would do. i thought it was perfect because it was made for my sidearm i got it off there web page also. but after having my girlfriend come behind me to try to take it she can do it almost with out a problem.

spend the extra money get a nice holster, no one will get your gun besides you.

Except police and criminals that make themselves familiar with such holsters and how to disengage the locking mechanisms...
 
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