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My new S&W 637 died after 3 rounds :(

Hevymetal

Regular Member
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Jan 22, 2012
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261
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Clinton Twp
Well if anyone had read a thread I started over a month ago I was trying to decide what new guns to buy for me and the wife. I wound up getting the Sig 229 Scorpion Elite TB (which has been awesome and preformed flawlessly so far).

I also purchased a S&W 637CT for the wife (who wants to carry). I got it as an anniversary present for her. Before sending it in to get Diamondkoted in Pink (yeah I know, save the jokes, she wants a pink gun to carry) I wanted to run a few rounds through it to make sure everything was in proper order before allowing her to "test drive it" before the coating process.

I loaded up the cylinder with 5 rounds of FACTORY LOADED .38 Special 130 grain FMJ ammo (not +P) and preceded to fire the first round in DA, no problems. Second round DA, no problems. Third round DA, OUCH! felt my hand burn a little and thought just powder flash no biggie. Went to pull the trigger for the fourth round and NOTHING, the trigger wouldn't pull and the cylinder didn't rotate. Hmmm, this can't be good I thought, went to open the cylinder and it wouldn't budge, WTF?? After a few minutes of jiggling and pushing the release lever. It opened and I saw this and also noticed the powder burn was infact a burn and a nice little hunk of missing skin to go along with it.

http://www.rencomp.com/sw/IMAG0170.jpg

and

http://www.rencomp.com/sw/IMAG0173.jpg

Took it to my friend the gunsmith who does the coatings, he went WTF? He took it to a guy he knows who's a S&W master armorer, he hadn't seen that happen before in 30+ years. Both verified the ammo used was indeed good and of the recommended type for that model. He thought it maybe a boring offset variance and/or another defect. (DUH) Both said contact S&W.

So I contacted S&W today after assuring the guy I had used FACTORY LOADED ammo, which was his initial thought of the problem. They setup an RMA and assured me they would take care of it. (I sure the heck hope so) so we will see what happens.

My question is has anyone here ever experienced a failure similar to what happened to me, S&W or any other model of revolver? What the heck could have happened? Doesn't S&W factory test them before shipping?

Glad I insisted on shooting it first even though the wife gave me a little grief over it.

I have a couple of S&W revolvers and have put many a round through them downrange (including way hot .44 loads in another snub nose) and never experienced anything like what happened.

Just looking for input.

Hevy
 

j4l

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fl
It's made by man, and his machines. Anything can happen, regardless of Brand, Make or Model
 

Sig229

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Dec 14, 2006
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Im no gunsmith, but I have heard of these problems happening with revolvers when the cylinder doesn't correctly line up with the barrel. Causing the fired round to cause major back-pressure back into the cylinder.
This can happen even if its off by a millimeter.


Now go back and get another Sig! lol
 
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KBCraig

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What are we seeing in the cylinder? It looks like a partial bullet jacket. Part of it's a clean break at the cannelure, which is very curious.

That could have been caused by timing, or it could have been the ammo. The part that's torn/smashed and protrudes out the cylinder could have gotten that way when you forced the cylinder open, or it could have been caught at the forcing cone because of bad timing.

I'll be interested in what S&W has to say.
 

Xulld

Regular Member
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Nov 9, 2010
Messages
159
Location
Florida
Interesting. Yea as was said before, any machine can break, and all machine that are made can have defects. Smith does a great job tho, I have faith they will get you fixed up or send you a pistol that will last many life times. I adore my 629, and a few thousand rounds have gone through it and it still runs like a champ. In fact this week end I have a few hundred more to add to the tab!
 

markush

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May 19, 2011
Messages
172
Location
Kenosha
I'm not sure I can make out exactly what those pics are showing either. Is there a noticeable ridge and constriction in that chamber?

If it's noticeable this would be a perfect example of why you should go through each and every new gun to clean and inspect it...before ever firing it!

I'll attach a pic of what I found in the barrel of my brand new 637 during my initial clean and inspection. Because of this I now bring a bore light and check the bores of every gun before I take delivery from the FFL, no matter who made it and new or used.

714ccb1c.jpg
 
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WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
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North Carolina
By the pictures the first two rounds the timing was not off on those. Clearly the lead separated from the jacket, I would say one round of bad ammo. Send the gun to S&W they will probably fix if it is repairable and return it to you. The only thing I can think is the bullet was oversize causing it to jam in the forcing cone, and then the pressure busting the lead through the barrel. The chunk of skin missing probably was from a piece of the jacket. I would toss that box of ammo.
 

KYGlockster

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Dec 9, 2010
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Ashland, KY
Sounds like an offset of the chamber with the cone, however the fact that the trigger wouldn't even move after the third shot is a little puzzling. I own a 637, and for the price it is an incredible little revolver. I have fired hundreds of +p Gold Dot's through it along with hundreds of regular rounds without a problem. The bad news is I have had bad dealings with Smith and Wesson's customer service with my Walther P22. I was told there was nothing wrong with my P22 and that I could ONLY use CCI if I wanted it to function properly. Besides the fact that I had already used CCI through the gun and it mis-fired with it as well as others, I also wondered what good is a gun if I can only count on it with one type of ammunition?! I don't know if they will be the same with a gun that has Smith and Wesson in the name, but their service on my Walther was horrible. Needless to say, I sold the Walther! Hope you have better luck with them than I did.

Update: I have now dealt with S&W concerning an issue with an M&P and they were great. They handled the problem quickly and I didn't pay a sent after I was given some free stuff. It seems the Walther service is different than for their own products.
 
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KBCraig

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Sounds like an offset of the chamber with the cone, however the fact that the trigger wouldn't even move after the third shot is a little puzzling.
The partial jacket that is sticking out the front of the chamber had the cylinder bound up so that it couldn't turn. That is why the trigger wouldn't move.
 

Levi

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Mar 20, 2012
Messages
188
Location
Tacoma
A local gun shop has had a rash of S&W .38spl revolvers that have had issues like this. With some looking into it, it turned out to be a particular brand of ammo had some quality control issues. At least it didn't split the chamber. Sorry you had bad luck and I hope it gets resolve quickly.

I had a S&W J-frame and it was very well made. It should be good for you once this is settled.
 

moonie

Regular Member
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Sep 13, 2010
Messages
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Location
High Point NC
Also note the OP said it happened on his third shot, note the carbon on the cylinder faces, third shot but fourth chamber. Looks like the cylinder spun too far with the third shot but not far enough to line up with the fourth hole, or something similar.
 

Hevymetal

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Jan 22, 2012
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Location
Clinton Twp
UPDATE:

I have an update about my gun. S&W contacted me finally and attributed the failure due to bad ammo? They said the gun cannot be repaired and must be replaced. I have contacted the manufacturer of the ammo and they are now in contact with S&W and are getting the lab results and samples of the ammo and the used casings for their own testing. If it is indeed the ammo's fault they assured me they would replace my gun. So we will see, the wheels of progress turn slow. I will keep you all in the loop once a final determination has been made.
 

Glock9mmOldStyle

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Apr 21, 2010
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2,038
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Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
UPDATE:

I have an update about my gun. S&W contacted me finally and attributed the failure due to bad ammo? They said the gun cannot be repaired and must be replaced. I have contacted the manufacturer of the ammo and they are now in contact with S&W and are getting the lab results and samples of the ammo and the used casings for their own testing. If it is indeed the ammo's fault they assured me they would replace my gun. So we will see, the wheels of progress turn slow. I will keep you all in the loop once a final determination has been made.

Damn metal that's crazy! I had a 20 yr old hi-point (stallard JS9) that kept jamming. I called them up "thinking yeah lifetime warranty sure..." tech said send pistol & all mags, so I did. Two weeks later what shows up? A new pistol with 5 new mags to replace the old ones with a hand written note from the tech explaining the frame had worn allowing mag travel. I was astounded and called and asked to speak to a manager, I didn't say why and they were nice and said we'll have a manager call you back today. I again thought sure...

An hour later my cell rings, who is on the line? -Tom Deeb the owner of the company. He was nice and asked what he could help me with? I just said I wanted to commend his company and his staff for the outstanding service, we chatted for a few and before we hung up I told him he's got a customer for life. That was last summer & since then we have two new 45 pistols & a 45 carbine with 10 new spare mags in the house.

My point is in the USA there are still some companies that know how to do business. Not bashing S&W but they have probably lost more business dinking around over this vs. had they just given you a replacement gun (tested first) hopefully. They have the resources to recoup the unit cost from the ammo maker if they were truly at fault. Why should you be out while they point fingers?

They are lucky you are a honest guy, some folks would be going to the lawyer instead of waiting to hear from their investigative team. :confused::confused::rolleyes:


Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both! :eek:
 
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markand

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Sep 29, 2006
Messages
512
Location
VA
I'll bet most of us would think is the "right" thing to do is replace your gun. This sounds like a rare enough situation that replacing one gun isn't going to kill the bottom line. We'd all be writing about what a great company they are, great customer service, etc.

Unfortunately, I suspect if they did that, a crafty lawyer could make a good case in court that replacing the gun is admission by the gun manufacturer that the gun was at fault, regardless of what the facts are, and the gun manufacturer is liable for the failure. Even if the injury is a small one, the potential loss in court is something that really could trash the company's bottom line. So you're out a gun while all of this is dragging on. Yuk.
 

WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
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I'll bet most of us would think is the "right" thing to do is replace your gun. This sounds like a rare enough situation that replacing one gun isn't going to kill the bottom line. We'd all be writing about what a great company they are, great customer service, etc.

Unfortunately, I suspect if they did that, a crafty lawyer could make a good case in court that replacing the gun is admission by the gun manufacturer that the gun was at fault, regardless of what the facts are, and the gun manufacturer is liable for the failure. Even if the injury is a small one, the potential loss in court is something that really could trash the company's bottom line. So you're out a gun while all of this is dragging on. Yuk.

Not really, a no questions asked return policy would only imply very good customer service. In fact it could protect them from liability suits if it was their policy to replace for any reason.
 

KYGlockster

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Joined
Dec 9, 2010
Messages
1,842
Location
Ashland, KY
UPDATE:

I have an update about my gun. S&W contacted me finally and attributed the failure due to bad ammo? They said the gun cannot be repaired and must be replaced. I have contacted the manufacturer of the ammo and they are now in contact with S&W and are getting the lab results and samples of the ammo and the used casings for their own testing. If it is indeed the ammo's fault they assured me they would replace my gun. So we will see, the wheels of progress turn slow. I will keep you all in the loop once a final determination has been made.

What type of ammo were you using? I am assuming Winchester white box since you said they were 130 grain. Right or wrong? If it was a large name manufacturer then S&W shouldn't be blaming the ammunition unless there was a recall on a certain lot number that you just happnened to purchase. I go on-line every other week or so and check and see if any of the ammunition I have purchased has been recalled; you would be surprised to see how often they do recall ammunition.

Like I have said though, I have shot hundreds of rounds of +p ammunition through my little 637 without a single problem. I don't see a round having such a high quantity of extra powder to cause that type of damage. You may have damage to the barrel where the round was impacting at extreme velocities with an over-charge, but where the damage is is just puzzling. I believe it was weak steel or a machining error that caused the metal to be weakened.
 
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WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
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What type of ammo were you using? I am assuming Winchester white box since you said they were 130 grain. Right or wrong? If it was a large name manufacturer then S&W shouldn't be blaming the ammunition unless there was a recall on a certain lot number that you just happnened to purchase. I go on-line every other week or so and check and see if any of the ammunition I have purchased has been recalled; you would be surprised to see how often they do recall ammunition.

Like I have said though, I have shot hundreds of rounds of +p ammunition through my little 637 without a single problem. I don't see a round having such a high quantity of extra powder to cause that type of damage. You may have damage to the barrel where the round was impacting at extreme velocities with an over-charge, but where the damage is is just puzzling. I believe it was weak steel or a machining error that caused the metal to be weakened.

If you look at the pictures in his OP you will see that the jacket separated from the core. Even guns with timing off do not have a core separation unless there is a problem with the ammo. IMO I think it is clear that it was the ammo.
 

CCinMaine

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Jun 27, 2012
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Windham, Maine
What type of ammo were you using? I am assuming Winchester white box since you said they were 130 grain. Right or wrong? If it was a large name manufacturer then S&W shouldn't be blaming the ammunition unless there was a recall on a certain lot number that you just happnened to purchase. I go on-line every other week or so and check and see if any of the ammunition I have purchased has been recalled; you would be surprised to see how often they do recall ammunition.

Like I have said though, I have shot hundreds of rounds of +p ammunition through my little 637 without a single problem. I don't see a round having such a high quantity of extra powder to cause that type of damage. You may have damage to the barrel where the round was impacting at extreme velocities with an over-charge, but where the damage is is just puzzling. I believe it was weak steel or a machining error that caused the metal to be weakened.

I was out with a buddy a while back while breaking in his brand new 1911. He bought a 250 round box of remi UMC .45auto. Halfway through the box of ammo his gun had a failure to fire. The hammer wouldn't even drop. So we ejected the round and I loaded it into an empty mag of my G21 and chambered the round. This is when I noticed that the slide wasn't all the forward. It was just barely off. I removed the round and compared it to another round and the brass was about 1/32 of an inch longer then all the other rounds. Just because its a big brand doesn't mean they catch everything and it doesn't mean that they only have problems in large quantities. Not to mention someone has to be the first one to have a problem.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
 

davidmcbeth

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Jan 14, 2012
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if the only issue is with the cylinder then maybe just a cylinder change is all that is needed ? That's nothing much ... maybe the ammo that's at fault.

Of course there is always the standard reason: the wife did it. That goes over well here ... not withstanding the lumps on my head ..
 

RetiredOC

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Dec 21, 2009
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This is fascinating considering revolvers are the cutting edge of self-defense technology - of the 19th century

fine_troll_dancing.gif
 
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