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Thread: This could danergous if it continues.....

  1. #1
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    This could danergous if it continues.....

    The Supreme Court ruled Monday that two Secret Service agents are shielded from a lawsuit filed by a man they arrested after a confrontation with then-Vice President Dick Cheney......
    Hmm....
    Eye95......
    ďI am not with you. If the particular way in which you choose to break the laws is to take up arms against the government, know that I will, at the moment, choose to stand on the government's side and take up arms against you."
    In reference to the March on DC.

    The statements made in this post do not necessarily reflect the views of OCDO or its members.

  2. #2
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Well, hopefully Romney is voted in this next election so he can Bench some more fine Justices.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  3. #3
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    The point was that up until the moment that decision was handed down there was not a "bright line" decision that said that the Secret Service guys could not do that without violating some Constitutional right. That's just part of the judicial determination that cops in general, as a species, are too dumb to figure things out on their own and must have each and every possiblity spelled out in minute detail. Kinda, sorta, like dealing with a 3-year old, if you have ever done that.

    I may be wrong in how I read the decision, but I do see it as telling the Secret Service that as of now they can no longer do that. The "bright line" has been drawn.

    In many ways it's wonderful to know that the justice system considers citizens who are not drawing a paycheck through some government agency are capable of reasonable thought and able to figure out on their own that certain behaviors are inappropriate, but government employees are such dolts that they must be told specifically what is not allowed, and cannot be held responsible until and unless the courts have said it is not allowed.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  4. #4
    Regular Member MamaLiberty's Avatar
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    I never really needed any excuse to stay far, far away from politicians and bureaucrats of all sorts - especially cops. But if I needed a reason...

    Having to deal with 3 yr olds using large guns and other stuff would be right up there on top.
    But, in the end, I live and therefore I am. I donít need any other personís permission to live or defend myself. I donít need anyoneís vetting of my intentions or sanity, nor approval for the self defense tool I choose or how I carry it.

    I donít NEED to explain myself. I donít NEED any reasons at all.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Well, hopefully Romney is voted in this next election so he can Bench some more fine Justices.
    Is that sarcasm? If so, you should notice Obama's appointees did just the same as the other Judges; I count abstention in with voting against citizens.
    Don't believe any facts that I say! This is the internet and it is filled with lies and untruth. I invite you to look up for yourself the basic facts that my arguments might be based upon. This way we can have a discussion where logic and hints on where to find information are what is brought to the forum and people look up and verify facts for themselves.

  6. #6
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    the president is not a "God". he is a man, just like anyone else, and a citizen (hopefully) of this country. what makes vice-president cheney so special? is touching him on the shoulder against the law?

  7. #7
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammer6 View Post
    the president is not a "God". he is a man, just like anyone else, and a citizen (hopefully) of this country. what makes vice-president cheney so special? is touching him on the shoulder against the law?
    Well, yes, it actually is. Any touch that is not permitted by the person being touched is a battery, and that act is universally criminalized. Attempting to touch a person without their permission is an assault, another criminalized act.

    And the Secret Service has a special assignment to try to prevent people from assaulting and/or battering certain government officials just because they are certain government officials. How are they to determine before the fact that someone wants to give a congratulatory slap on the back/shoulder as opposed to sinking a kitchen knife there? Since the Secret Seervice cannot accurately guess which sort of touch it would be, they declare all touching off limits. The government official may over-rule them by agreeing to certain touches, such as handshakes. If so, the Secret Service is going to make darned sure all you look like you are going to do is shake that hand with nothing but air ij your hand.

    Now, getting to your question about the specialness of the VP - he is in the line of succession to the Presidency if the President can no longer serve. There are some folks who would see taking out the VP as a positive move towards changing the way Things Are Done and Policies are Made/Followed if certain folks after the VP had a shot at the #1 slot before the #1 slot was made vacant. No tin foil needed to figure that one out.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  8. #8
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Well, yes, it actually is. Any touch that is not permitted by the person being touched is a battery, and that act is universally criminalized. Attempting to touch a person without their permission is an assault, another criminalized act.

    And the Secret Service has a special assignment to try to prevent people from assaulting and/or battering certain government officials just because they are certain government officials. How are they to determine before the fact that someone wants to give a congratulatory slap on the back/shoulder as opposed to sinking a kitchen knife there? Since the Secret Seervice cannot accurately guess which sort of touch it would be, they declare all touching off limits. The government official may over-rule them by agreeing to certain touches, such as handshakes. If so, the Secret Service is going to make darned sure all you look like you are going to do is shake that hand with nothing but air ij your hand.

    Now, getting to your question about the specialness of the VP - he is in the line of succession to the Presidency if the President can no longer serve. There are some folks who would see taking out the VP as a positive move towards changing the way Things Are Done and Policies are Made/Followed if certain folks after the VP had a shot at the #1 slot before the #1 slot was made vacant. No tin foil needed to figure that one out.

    stay safe.

    i actually know all that, but was just making a sarcastic statement. i'm getting at the fact that the elected president is a citizen just like anyone else. i know the VP is second in line..

  9. #9
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammer6 View Post
    i actually know all that, but was just making a sarcastic statement. i'm getting at the fact that the elected president is a citizen just like anyone else. i know the VP is second in line..
    Sarcasm comes over the internet so well that there is absolutely no reason to use the convention of [sarcasm][/sarcasm]

    [/sarcasm]

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  10. #10
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Obama is the president but the SS is charged with ensuring that the Office of the Presidency/Veep is not compromised. I don't really think it's really about the individual, per se, but about the office and its occupier. Can't let the citizenry think that their top dogs are at risk any more than is absolutely required.

    Would the SS put Obama and Biden in a sphere of 12" thick bullet-resistant Lexanģ, You bet they would. Do you think the SS would let Moochelle be alone with Barry? Not if they could get away with keeping them separate.
    I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.

    Politicians are the tyrants 3000 miles away; thug cops are 3000 tyrants 1 mile away. (Adapted from Benjamin Martin, fictional character extraordinaire)

  11. #11
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Sarcasm comes over the internet so well that there is absolutely no reason to use the convention of [sarcasm][/sarcasm]

    [/sarcasm]

    stay safe.
    seriously? i mean, can't someone honestly assume that everyone in america knows that the VP is next in line to be POTUS if something were to happen?

  12. #12
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Do you think the SS would let Moochelle be alone with Barry? Not if they could get away with keeping them separate.[/SIZE]
    really? u think so?

  13. #13
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    I found the ruling reasonable. Couple of key excerpts to help keep the skimmers from jumping to errant conclusions:

    "The Supreme Court ruled Monday that two Secret Service agents are shielded from a lawsuit filed by a man they arrested after a confrontation with then-Vice President Dick Cheney."

    "Even so, the appeals court said Howards could sue the agents for violating his rights."

    "The agents and the Obama administration asked the court for broad protection against claims of retaliatory arrests. The justices did not grant that wish."

    I note with some rather extreme shock: "Justice Elena Kagan did not take part in the case." I also wonder why she abstained here, and refused to abstain from other issues on which she was seriously conflicted/biased.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. They both protect the rest, but only if you exercise them both.

    Nothing in this post is to be misconstrued as "advice" of any kind. It is merely my opinion.

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