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Thread: Receiving ammunition?

  1. #1
    Regular Member derhammer's Avatar
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    Receiving ammunition?

    As I've stated before, I am 18 at the moment. My mother knows I want a handgun, and intends to get me one as a gift, which is, of course, legal under ATF rules. The problem arises from the ammo: I read somewhere that it is illegal to sell or transfer handgun ammo to anyone under 21. Does that mean that, if my mother purchased ammo for my handgun, she would not be able to give it to me to use? I can't see how that could be as it would defeat the purpose of my having the firearm at all. I couldn't go to the range with it, because I'd be in possession of the ammo, nor could I (open) carry it on my person as I would also be in possession of ammo. Surely there's some kind of exemption for if you're receiving ammo for a gun that was purchased for you as a gift by your parents - I just want to make sure.

    -derhammer

  2. #2
    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    What caliber is the gun? If it fits in a rifle, They well ask you if it's for a rifle or handgun. Just tell em it's for a rifle. Also yes your mother can buy the ammo and then give it to you.

  3. #3
    Regular Member derhammer's Avatar
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    The gun will probably be 9mm but maaaaaaybe .40 S&W.

    -derhammer

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    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    They have rifles that use 9mm.

  5. #5
    Regular Member derhammer's Avatar
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    Yeah, the carbines. Okay, what about this: Do the straw purchase laws still come into effect with ammo? Like if I give my mother money of my own, but she buys the ammo, is that okay (such as, they just want to make sure the parent is aware I have the ammo, so it doesn't matter where the money comes from), or is that the same as a straw purchase would be in the case of a firearm?

    -derhammer

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    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    That I'm not sure about. You could just give the money to your mom at home. So that when purchasing the ammo it doesn't look like she's buying it for you.

  7. #7
    Herr Heckler Koch
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    Quote Originally Posted by derhammer View Post
    As I've stated before, I am 18 at the moment. ... The problem arises from the ammo: I read somewhere that it is illegal to sell or transfer handgun ammo to anyone under 21.
    18 USC 922 (b)(1) applies only to Federal Firearms Licensees. It is unlikely Pennsylvania is more restrictive, but you must know the law of your jurisdiction.

    http://reference.pafoa.org/statutes/...-firearms-act/

    Believe nothing that you read or hear without verifying it yourself unless it fits your preexisting world view.
    Last edited by Herr Heckler Koch; 06-08-2012 at 06:27 PM.

  8. #8
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Some hardware stores sell ammo, without an FFL. But what I've seen, it's usually during hunting season, and they may not sell pistol ammo. Have your mother, or another willing friend or relative who's 21 or over, get it for you. It shouldn't be a problem.

    Two things. 1. If I were you, I would not be present when they buy the ammo, that way no one will make any assumptions, or wrong statements.
    2. Know which type of ammo you want, and make sure the person buying it also knows.

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  9. #9
    Activist Member SigGuy23's Avatar
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    CONGRATULATIONS! You just advised the OP to commit a federal felony!
    You're right I did and I apologize and admit that I am wrong.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Oh, heck! I thought this was going to be about the Brown Box of Joy dropping off stuff that required an adult signature.

    Do not lie about what the ammo you are trying to buy is going to be used for. But since many retailers want to see your proof of age if you look to be under 40, you might never get a chance to decide to lie or not.

    If your mom is willing to buy a gun and give it to you as a gift she might be willing to buy a case of ammo as well.

    stay safe.
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  11. #11
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    Another option is find private sales near you, I have a few hundred rounds of 9mm a couple hundred rounds of .40 S&W, and around 100 rounds of .380 I bought myself in private sales and I'm under 21. This option isn't ideal but it is a legal method, and about the ONLY legal method unless you buy a carbine in the same caliber as your pistol. Also just because you can buy it for a rifle doesn't mean the store policy will allow it, Wal-Mart will refuse the sale of any "handgun" ammo to anyone under 21 if they follow the corporate policy.

  12. #12
    Regular Member derhammer's Avatar
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    There's a shooting range near me with tons of ammo. I'm guessing they're not FFL, but they do sell ammo for range use (so I assume they'd sell it in general). In that case, they'd probably sell to me.

    -derhammer

  13. #13
    Regular Member MainelyGlock's Avatar
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    Another option is to order it online, too. Not saying it's a good idea, or that I condone it [because it's illegal] but I know of a few people under 21 who have successfully had handgun ammunition delivered to their door.

    Couldn't your Mom just buy the ammo for you with the gun, and include it in the bill of sale?

    Also, is it common practice for stores to ask what type of gun the ammo will be used for? I bought a case of mini-mags and was asked that question at Wal-Mart once, and thought it was just the cashier asking out of curiosity. Guess not!
    Last edited by MainelyGlock; 06-10-2012 at 10:42 PM.
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  14. #14
    Regular Member MainelyGlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    There would be nothing illegal about that at all so long as the online dealer was not an FFL and the recipient was over 18 years old.
    Really? The last time I did it, there was a window with an accept button acting as a waiver that stated I was at least 21 years of age. Maybe the website just put it there to cover themselves, though.
    Once more into the fray.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    If the online ammunition dealer does not have an FFL, the legal age for handgun ammunition is 18, according to Federal law. If the online ammunition dealer does have an FFL, the legal age for ammunition intended to be used in a handgun is 21, according to Federal law. State laws of both the seller and the purchaser may be more restrictive, although the seller can hardly be held responsible for not complying with the buyer's state laws.
    Most sellers will follow the federal law for FFL's just for liability reasons, and it's not a particularly bad practice in case someone does an illegal act and then the ammo was bought from you, something I would be concerned about if I was selling to someone and didn't see them in person, remember if the ATF is involved you don;t want to be a suspect, never know when they might shoot you in the back.
    Last edited by wolfgangmob; 06-13-2012 at 04:03 PM.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    If a dealer in ammunition only does not have an FFL, which they are not required to, exactly how would following the law applicable only to FFLs do anything for them if the buyer committed an illegal act with ammunition bought from them? Why wouldn't following the law applicable to non-FFLs not be good enough? That's like saying that following the laws applicable to Commercial Driver's License (CDL) holders professionally driving semi-trucks cross country is a good idea for a regular state licensed driver of a personal car to follow while going to the corner store, including log books, rest stops, inspections - in case they are stopped by law enforcement for some reason.
    Go try buying handgun ammo at a K-Mart and then say someone's actions with what they bought from you has no effect. A seller has a responsibility to ensure the purchaser is legal to buy ammunition according to their conditions, most do this with a simple affidavit or "check if you agree to the terms of sale". They also need to watch their ass publicly, no one wants to be the company selling ammunition to minors so most say 21 for handgun ammo and if you agree to those terms that say you must be 21 and you are not you have just broken the law which even if it's a minor law is just stupid, it's more fun to find a loophole you can fully exploit and do something legally. The world isn't what's legal and what's not, it's also what appeals to the masses, in an effort to stop "terrorism" most Americans let their rights be taken away, in an effort to not be the next K-Mart companies want handgun ammo buyers to be 21.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    What the hell difference does it make if the check box on the website says "check here if are over the age of 18 years old" or "check here if you are over the age of 21 years old" when both are COMPLETELY LEGAL for handgun ammunition (by Federal law) if the seller does not have an FFL? In addition, any 12 year old can put a check in the check box on a website. Like I said, and you have failed to answer, exactly how would following a statute that is not applicable do anything to prevent liability?
    I did actually, it's not legal liability but reputation liability, if they get named because of one random extreme case massacre the company could get screwed over. There is no true, legal liability but that does little to help if an over zealous liberal tries chasing a company with a civil suit for "recklessly selling ammunition to minors" and manages to jurisdiction shop their way into a liberal venue. People don't "need" liability insurance on their home but people willing to sue force people to seek it, smaller, local gun shops don't need to prohibit lawful carry but they do out of liability concerns of having a loaded gun go off in a gun shop having a chance of wrongfully affecting their insurance and even possibly deter possible clients who fail to look into such an incident.

    Just because something is completely legal doesn't mean it is completely accepted, just look around on here and see some of the ways baiting OCers get attacked for "not doing it properly". I'm not really be big on the baiting, but don't see a problem with it just like I'm not a fan of the idea of illegally purchasing ammunition, which checking the box that says you are 21 when you are not is illegal as you violated the terms of sale, but if you do it an no problems that's fine, just don't go recommending others do so as that does NOTHING to change the seller's policy while encouraging the sending of emails does.
    Last edited by wolfgangmob; 06-14-2012 at 03:29 AM.

  18. #18
    Regular Member punisherprice's Avatar
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    I had the same issues and I am also 18. I felt stupid having a loaded gun on me, but not being able to buy ammo from a store -.-. Your best bet is what i do, online ammo purchasing. i use (midwayusa.com, georgia-arms.com, and ammotogo.com) good .45 colt and the rare .32 magnum ammo are hard to find in sporting goods stores.
    "Si vis pacem parabellum" - If you want peace, Prepare for war.

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