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Thread: Detroit fireworks, no place for CPL and OC folks

  1. #1
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Detroit fireworks, no place for CPL and OC folks

    There has been information coming from gang and Police sources that on some gang sites there is an effort for do the flash mob attacks of last year in much greater numbers. This latest call by Gang member's is for in excess of 500 gang members to join a massive and well organized attack on Fireworks goers for Robbery and also racial attacks. If you start searching you will find even on Tumblr.com and other sites, it's being talked about. This is a setup for some CPL holder or OC'er to be killed and a bad place to be until the City of Detroit either cancels the Fireworks or grows a spine and get the proper amount of Police and potential firepower to deal with a 500 man armed and organized Gang out to spill blood and make headlines. I for one will not even consider walking into a situation that might have me being accused of something I didn't do when I merely tried to protect myself, and frankly if it is worse than last years insanity, no sane CPL holder or OCer would venture there when the threat is as it is stated. Supposedly the authorities are taking this seriously, but with looming Lay offs of Police officers and and a bankrupt city this is a disastrous mix, short of the State providing National guard as a backup to the low Detroit Police dept ranks to deal with this potential disaster. After 34 plus years of carry I learned one thing, you don't walk into a sh*t storm and expect to come out smelling like Roses. Some things are not worth the risk. And those who would cry foul or coward, should remember George Zimmerman thought he was doing the right thing and we now see what a Political mess that turned into. Common sense should prevail... We can only hope.

    I have got this from reliable sources and after 15 minutes surfing the Internet I have confirmed this appears to be real.

    The gang is called RTM Related through Money.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzG9VcOuls8






    http://www.detroituncovered.com/
    Is it time to shut down the fireworks?
    The city of Detroit no longer has the manpower to police the annual fireworks display and the rest of the city at the same time. Each year a reported 1 million people are in downtown Detroit during this event. Last year there were numerous fights, several shootings and the gangs have even taken to social media to discuss what they will do during the event. In addition there is the cost of clean up after the 30 minute show ends. City workers are left with mounds of trash and repairs of city owned fixtures. The cost is too great for a city with no money and its unsafe for visitors and officers because of the dangerously low police manpower numbers.
    Should the fireworks be canceled this year?

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................
    Last edited by Bailenforcer; 06-10-2012 at 07:57 PM.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  2. #2
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Seems to me this is a bad event for anyone to show up to. CPL holder/OCer or not.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  3. #3
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    Im on the other side of the fence. We as gun owners should unite, and show up in force, to deal with problens (legally) as they arise. It could be the answer to our gang problems.

  4. #4
    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Good idea stainless. But its still better to advoid an ambush. Especially when you can see it a mile off.
    Last edited by NHCGRPR45; 06-11-2012 at 02:58 PM.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

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    Quote Originally Posted by NHCGRPR45 View Post
    Good idea stainless. But its still better to advoid an ambush. Especially when you can see it a mile of.
    The first step in avoiding a trap, is in knowing of its existence.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Detroit is an exceptionally well armed city. Coleman Young telling the KKK to come on in and do their march comes to mind. So too do the 43 and 67 police riots.

    Any major gang related violence will not be something that a small gaggle of outsiders will have any business foolishly thinking they can inhibit or otherwise influence.

    I've walked all over Detroit, sometimes through some of the worst areas, always with multiple guns. If you mind your own business, only look someone in the eye once, and cross to the other side of the street to give drug deals their room, no one will mind you just passing through. No one wants to die usually, so if you look dangerous yet indifferent to gang bangers, you'll not likely have problems.

    But to all of a sudden think you'll come in and lay down the law? That's why their are untold thousands of unregistered LMG's and things in Detroit. It's a wonderful city with a lot of wonderful people, but it's not a city that intelligent outsiders will attempt to fix. So yes, I agree with bailenforecer. I'm definitely staying away.
    Last edited by Michigander; 06-11-2012 at 08:15 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BGordon42 View Post
    The first step in avoiding a trap, is in knowing of its existence.
    Be the trap.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Sounds like a good time to excersize that first line of 2a. "A well regulated militia...."

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    Yep. Too bad that the gun owners dont have the backbone to stand up to a street gang. How do you expect to get your rights back from the .gov if you can't even watch fireworks because of some street punks?

    The irony in this, fireworks and all, is something.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Okay here's goes the clueless comments again.. I spent 39 years living and working the streets of Detroit, not hiding in a trailer park many miles away in Suburbia. First line of defense is not to pick a fight you know can't be won. Your silly assertion we should go in force shows your Political ignorance. If we did such there would be not only a invitation for the brain dead gang bangers who would love to die for their cause (stupidity) as we see daily in this country, but the Media and 90% of the Politicians would paint such an incident as proof they need to ban guns because dangerous gun owners came to pick a fight or war in Detroit.

    I suggest you think before opening your mouth, as evidenced by the endless crap you cause for yourself and steady run ins with Law Enforcement. More and more you prove the point where this is smoke there is fire. If you are going to whine about this being some personal attack, save your breath as your comments are provoking serious stupidity. Anyone who thinks that acting like a Gang and confronting gangs is the best solution is in need of professional help.

    How about leaving the fantasy world and get with reality, just for once, you might actually like reality.

    For those of us who know about Gangs, confrontation like you speak of always ends in a mess, both in real terms and in Political reality. Or did you forget the Politicians hate gun owners more than gang bangers?



    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Yep. Too bad that the gun owners dont have the backbone to stand up to a street gang. How do you expect to get your rights back from the .gov if you can't even watch fireworks because of some street punks?

    The irony in this, fireworks and all, is something.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Thanks for the common sense, this site seems to be lacking that on the part of some.

    The Gang problem is a greater problem with the mentality of the majority of the Citizens of Detroit who bought the Coleman A Young Politics of hatred and have still not let go of that silliness.

    You are 100% correct. If a few Gun owners really think some silly last stand will help the cause of gun rights, they have a serious reality check coming and it won't be pretty.

    I lived at Mack and Connors during the 1967 riots, it was not any fun, and mind you people were not as armed as the drug gangs are today. Never bring a Glock to an AK-47 fight as one in here thinks is a good idea....

    .

    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Detroit is an exceptionally well armed city. Coleman Young telling the KKK to come on in and do their march comes to mind. So too do the 43 and 67 police riots.

    Any major gang related violence will not be something that a small gaggle of outsiders will have any business foolishly thinking they can inhibit or otherwise influence.

    I've walked all over Detroit, sometimes through some of the worst areas, always with multiple guns. If you mind your own business, only look someone in the eye once, and cross to the other side of the street to give drug deals their room, no one will mind you just passing through. No one wants to die usually, so if you look dangerous yet indifferent to gang bangers, you'll not likely have problems.

    But to all of a sudden think you'll come in and lay down the law? That's why their are untold thousands of unregistered LMG's and things in Detroit. It's a wonderful city with a lot of wonderful people, but it's not a city that intelligent outsiders will attempt to fix. So yes, I agree with bailenforecer. I'm definitely staying away.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Exactly..

    Quote Originally Posted by NHCGRPR45 View Post
    Good idea stainless. But its still better to advoid an ambush. Especially when you can see it a mile of.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  13. #13
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Wow -- I'm going to have to consider taking Bailenforcer off ignore.

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Fantasy never escapes your life, does it?


    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Im on the other side of the fence. We as gun owners should unite, and show up in force, to deal with problens (legally) as they arise. It could be the answer to our gang problems.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    I have pity on the few cops that will have to deal with this threat if it materializes as it appears to be the potential. These Idiots in RTM want a war to make headlines. This is what this is all about.


    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    Seems to me this is a bad event for anyone to show up to. CPL holder/OCer or not.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Maybe this year more will stay home and light off their own now that we can legally buy and shoot here...

    one of my 2manyhobbies is pyro and we just had a shoot this last Saturday in Mentone IN at PRA the airport. They know me as the guy with the gun on his hip, BOT it was so dry we had to pre burn off the field before the shoot so be careful out there. Fireworks are fun but do not set anything on fire due to the current drought!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    Okay here's goes the clueless comments again.. I spent 39 years living and working the streets of Detroit, not hiding in a trailer park many miles away in Suburbia. First line of defense is not to pick a fight you know can't be won. Your silly assertion we should go in force shows your Political ignorance. If we did such there would be not only a invitation for the brain dead gang bangers who would love to die for their cause (stupidity) as we see daily in this country, but the Media and 90% of the Politicians would paint such an incident as proof they need to ban guns because dangerous gun owners came to pick a fight or war in Detroit.

    I suggest you think before opening your mouth, as evidenced by the endless crap you cause for yourself and steady run ins with Law Enforcement. More and more you prove the point where this is smoke there is fire. If you are going to whine about this being some personal attack, save your breath as your comments are provoking serious stupidity. Anyone who thinks that acting like a Gang and confronting gangs is the best solution is in need of professional help.

    How about leaving the fantasy world and get with reality, just for once, you might actually like reality.

    For those of us who know about Gangs, confrontation like you speak of always ends in a mess, both in real terms and in Political reality. Or did you forget the Politicians hate gun owners more than gang bangers?
    lol

    Nothing else has worked, the gangs just keep getting stronger. Perhaps a new law might work. Or, you can continue to do the same thing and expect a different result? If so, Im not the one who needs help. Oh, maybe we could throw more money at the problem, yeah, that will fix it.

  18. #18
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    lol

    Nothing else has worked, the gangs just keep getting stronger. Perhaps a new law might work. Or, you can continue to do the same thing and expect a different result? If so, Im not the one who needs help. Oh, maybe we could throw more money at the problem, yeah, that will fix it.

    Go join the Detroit 300 -- I'm sure they'd welcome you.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Superlite27's Avatar
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    "The first step in avoiding a trap is knowing of its existence."

    I agree. The keyword here is "avoiding". Although someone who inadvertently steps into a bear trap might be classified as a moron, the only thing that could be worse is someone who knows about it and steps into it anyway.

    Good intentions and fantasies of noble heroism all go out the window when you look down and see the blood spouting out of the stump of your severed leg.

    Personally, I've found the best way to avoid laying on the ground slowly bleeding out from gunshot wounds wondering if the cause I received them for was really worth it, is to avoid testing the hypothesis in the first place.

  20. #20
    Regular Member G22's Avatar
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    My buddy & I usually go every year. But, we go on his boat and anchor outside the safety zone a bit up river. I think we'll just skip it this year.

    We used to go to Heart Plaza until we were leaving one time and some ******* decided to loft a 40oz bottle into the crowd and hit my buddy in the head. 28 stitches. Oh then there was the person who thought it would be funny to put an M80 in the porta toilet with a long wick... The girl that came out deaf and covered in feces didn't appreciate that prank...

    Thanks for the heads up sir.

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    The streets belong to the everyday law abiding citizens, not the gangs. We have a gang problem in our society, and they have made the people afraid..to live, to walk, to shop, to party, etc.. If you want the streets back, and want to end the gang problem in this city, and others, you will have to do it yourself. Does the term Domestic enemy mean anything at all to you? Or "for the defense of himself and the state"?. What, do you think your gun is only for yourself, or show and tell?. If they have AK-47s, fine, bring yours. Don't rely on the .gov to take care of the problem, it's job security for them to leave the problems as they are. They haven't been taking care of the problem for decades, do you think they are going to start now?

    What's your plan? If you have a better idea, let's hear it.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 06-11-2012 at 12:10 PM.

  22. #22
    Regular Member HKcarrier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    The streets belong to the everyday law abiding citizens, not the gangs. We have a gang problem in our society, and they have made the people afraid..to live, to walk, to shop, to party, etc.. If you want the streets back, and want to end the gang problem in this city, and others, you will have to do it yourself. Does the term Domestic enemy mean anything at all to you? Or "for the defense of himself and the state"?. What, do you think your gun is only for yourself, or show and tell?. If they have AK-47s, fine, bring yours. Don't rely on the .gov to take care of the problem, it's job security for them to leave the problems as they are. They haven't been taking care of the problem for decades, do you think they are going to start now?

    What's your plan? If you have a better idea, let's hear it.


    I sort of agree with stainless's point... but people have been conditioned that the vigilantes are just as bad as the gangsters.... it wouldn't end well, even if the vigilantes escaped with their lives...
    When you put the gun in the holster, put the ego in the gun safe.

  23. #23
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    While I am certainly not one to go looking for a fight, not looking to kill anyone, nor looking to BE killed, I am wondering at what point DO we decide to take our cities and public areas back away from these gangs?

    What many of you are saying is basically let 'em have it, let them own that area to rule it as they see fit. If the Police can't handle the Job, then at some point it is up to the Honest Law abiding citizens to take back control. Will there be bloodshed? Very possibly. But isn't that how our country was freed from British Rule?

    How about we call for our OWN "Gang", 1000 Open Carriers to attend and make sure there are no problems, gang or otherwise? Make it as public as possible so everyone, especially the gang bangers know we'll be there and that we'll be packin..
    Last edited by xd shooter; 06-11-2012 at 12:54 PM.

  24. #24
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    There has been information coming from gang and Police sources that on some gang sites there is an effort for do the flash mob attacks of last year in much greater numbers. This latest call by Gang member's is for in excess of 500 gang members to join a massive and well organized attack on Fireworks goers for Robbery and also racial attacks. If you start searching you will find even on Tumblr.com and other sites, it's being talked about. This is a setup for some CPL holder or OC'er to be killed and a bad place to be until the City of Detroit either cancels the Fireworks or grows a spine and get the proper amount of Police and potential firepower to deal with a 500 man armed and organized Gang out to spill blood and make headlines. I for one will not even consider walking into a situation that might have me being accused of something I didn't do when I merely tried to protect myself, and frankly if it is worse than last years insanity, no sane CPL holder or OCer would venture there when the threat is as it is stated. Supposedly the authorities are taking this seriously, but with looming Lay offs of Police officers and and a bankrupt city this is a disastrous mix, short of the State providing National guard as a backup to the low Detroit Police dept ranks to deal with this potential disaster. After 34 plus years of carry I learned one thing, you don't walk into a sh*t storm and expect to come out smelling like Roses. Some things are not worth the risk. And those who would cry foul or coward, should remember George Zimmerman thought he was doing the right thing and we now see what a Political mess that turned into. Common sense should prevail... We can only hope.

    I have got this from reliable sources and after 15 minutes surfing the Internet I have confirmed this appears to be real.

    The gang is called RTM Related through Money.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzG9VcOuls8






    http://www.detroituncovered.com/
    Is it time to shut down the fireworks?
    The city of Detroit no longer has the manpower to police the annual fireworks display and the rest of the city at the same time. Each year a reported 1 million people are in downtown Detroit during this event. Last year there were numerous fights, several shootings and the gangs have even taken to social media to discuss what they will do during the event. In addition there is the cost of clean up after the 30 minute show ends. City workers are left with mounds of trash and repairs of city owned fixtures. The cost is too great for a city with no money and its unsafe for visitors and officers because of the dangerously low police manpower numbers.
    Should the fireworks be canceled this year?

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................
    I think this will be much ado about nothing.

    Fear is no way to live your life. Go or don't go, but don't let free decide where you can or can not go in a public place.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  25. #25
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Man I sure do love the smell of internet keyboard testosterone!!!!
    Last edited by Bikenut; 06-11-2012 at 01:13 PM.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

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