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Thread: Cafe Racer Mass Muderer's dad casts blame on lax gun laws in WA

  1. #1
    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
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    Cafe Racer Mass Muderer's dad casts blame on lax gun laws in WA

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...9_danny13.html

    He says it's "more true than you know" what I suggested in a column last week — that it's too easy to get a gun permit and to buy guns in this state.

    It turns out Walter Stawicki, father of the shooter, was himself a gun dealer. He ran a gun shop out of his house in Ellensburg in the 1990s.

    "You can be a raving street schizophrenic here and they won't do anything about your guns," Stawicki says.

    He says we ought to pass a law triggering a gun review when someone is so much as arrested for violence, as his son was twice. (He was never convicted.)
    Maybe, just maybe, he should have taken PERSONAL responsibility to prevent his mentally ill son from committing mass murder.

    That would be the, you know, RATIONAL approach.
    Last edited by Dave_pro2a; 06-13-2012 at 02:48 PM.

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    Regular Member SpyderTattoo's Avatar
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    I was listening to this on the John Carlson radio show this morning. Dave Workman came on the phone with John to talk about it.
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    Regular Member Superlite27's Avatar
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    Someone should ask him if he thinks murder should be made illegal, too.

    What? It already is, he says?

    Then maybe he can tell us how to prevent murderers who ignore that law to agree to obey the one simply requiring them to hand over their firearms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpyderTattoo View Post
    I was listening to this on the John Carlson radio show this morning. Dave Workman came on the phone with John to talk about it.

    I had to...he called me.


    But I just think Mr. Stawicki is looking for some way to atone for his son's misdeeds, which parents often do. This probably is not the way to accomplish that.

    I think I explained that to Carlson.

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    Regular Member cpgrad08's Avatar
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    Is there a link were I could listen to the audio?
    I carry a Para Ordance 1911 .45 ACP.

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    I'd like to hear it too. The one I heard right after the incident didn't go very well. I know that interviewing is different than writing, but I guess I was expecting more from such a talented author.

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    Sure, let's blame the laws, or innocent people or inanimate objects instead of the fricken insane nutjob that committed the crime.

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    As a parent, did he ever notice that his Son was "different"? Did he seek any help for him? Was he possibly one of those parents that told school officials to "stuff it" when they pointed out he had problems when he was in school?

    In short, what role did the Dad play in the development of this deranged individual. My guess is that he turned his back whenever the kid disturbed his life activities.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    As a parent, did he ever notice that his Son was "different"? Did he seek any help for him? Was he possibly one of those parents that told school officials to "stuff it" when they pointed out he had problems when he was in school?

    In short, what role did the Dad play in the development of this deranged individual. My guess is that he turned his back whenever the kid disturbed his life activities.
    Doesn't schizophrenia come about later, around the age of what the guy was? It sounded like, according to the dad, that this transformation happened relatively recently.

    That said, the dad said that the family was worried, not that he'd become a murderer, but that he'd get himself killed. He should have tried to get Ian some help...and take the guns back to his place in the mean time. But like you hinted at, amlevin, he wasn't close to his son at all.

    What I think is funny is he calls himself a "Ron Paul libertarian", but then wants the gov't to step in to try and prevent this from happening again. Knowing that the gov't has the Mida's touch (except everything turns to sh!t), he should know better. This was a freak occurrence, and it's a good example of the "spotlight fallacy". Just because something crazy or memorable happened like this, it doesn't necessarily mean that the probability just went up. A conviction for a crime, or involuntary admission into a mental facility, is where we should leave the threshold for taking away someone's rights. We don't need to start doing it for thought crimes and non-convictions. They don't mean anything and they shouldn't mean anything when it comes to taking away someone's right to defend their life. The rest of us just need to take responsibility as well and arm ourselves...as opposed to the supposed hero, who used a barstool and didn't stop anything (the killer just walked past him, he clearly could have continued his spree if he wanted to).
    Last edited by skiingislife725; 06-15-2012 at 10:39 AM.

  10. #10
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiingislife725 View Post
    Doesn't schizophrenia come about later, around the age of what the guy was?

    According to a website devoted to this disease and helping families identify it, "Three-quarters of persons with schizophrenia develop the disease between 16 and 25 years of age. -- Onset is uncommon after age 30".

    Unless this guy was one of the minority 25%, he showed signs much earlier. The parent is just trying to exonerate himself in the public eye for not "being a parent" and seeking help. He'll go through the full "Shed the Guilt Handbook". Blame the schools, government, medical community, police, guns, gun laws, TV, cosmic rays, and fluoride in the water, fast food, sugar substitutes, and diesel exhaust, just to get the focus away from his shortcomings.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  11. #11
    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Parents never want to accept their precious little children are to blame for their screw ups. They always try to place the blame somewhere else. After all, if they accepted their kids are at fault, then at least some of the blame would fall back on them.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiingislife725
    A conviction for a violent crime, or involuntary admission into a mental facility, is where we should leave the threshold for taking away someone's rights.
    FTFY.
    As long as there's a method - a real, working method, not just something on paper that's never done - for people to get their rights back once they've served their time or gotten treatment, I'd agree with you.

    A career abuser (generally assault is a misdemeanor) shouldn't have legal access to guns. He'll get them anyway, but why make it easier?

    Someone who's cheated on taxes is a felon in many cases, but what makes him more of a risk to the well-being of society than the misdemeanant serial abuser with legal access to guns?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House
    if [parents] accepted their kids are at fault, then at least some of the blame would fall back on them.
    If the (adult) kids do something, the parents aren't at fault, other than that they could possibly have provided more guidance or a better environment while the kids were kids. But even kids from good conditions do bad things.

    Absent mental disease or defect, adults (& older teens) are responsible for their own choices.
    Last edited by MKEgal; 06-16-2012 at 07:39 PM. Reason: space
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  13. #13
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    I blame the lax 'murder violence' laws.

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    I blame the lax media laws. They can say anything they want!

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    I blame the lax media laws. They can say anything they want!
    Without having to demonstrate that they're qualified to do so.

    I demand that we start licensing "talking heads".
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran Bookman's Avatar
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    The family is largely responsible because they TWICE failed to press charges on DV complaints (Well, once on the mother and once on a gf). Their failure to get involved resulted in a tragedy of epic proportions. Their negligence is directly responsible for the deaths that occurred as much as if they'd pulled the trigger themselves.

    NOW, they're trying to do what all good liberals are taught to do... point the finger at everyone but each other.
    "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke


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  17. #17
    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    If the (adult) kids do something, the parents aren't at fault, other than that they could possibly have provided more guidance or a better environment while the kids were kids. But even kids from good conditions do bad things.

    Absent mental disease or defect, adults (& older teens) are responsible for their own choices.
    I should clarify that I meant it's how the parents feel, regardless of the reality.

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