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Thread: Tulsa World - Open carriers put police on notice re 4th Amendment rights

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    Tulsa World - Open carriers put police on notice re 4th Amendment rights

    http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/ar...49456&allcom=1

    SNIP




    . . . when our new open-carry law goes into effect on Nov. 1? Are conflicts between police and gun-carriers inevitable? Are protests, lawsuits, and other such ramifications on the horizon for us?

    Even before the law has become effective, gun-rights advocates have made it clear they'll be keeping an eye on Oklahoma. Reacting to comments from some members of Oklahoma law enforcement, advocacy leaders have declared they "will be watching the police" and will take appropriate actions they deem necessary to protect the right to open carry.

    After several failed attempts, Oklahoma lawmakers last session passed an open-carry law that essentially allows anyone who has a concealed-carry permit to also openly carry their weapon.

    The legislation prompted a welcome note from OpenCarry.org, a national advocacy group claiming to have more than 28,000 members, which joined with the Oklahoma Second Amendment Association (known as OK2A) to also issue a warning.

    "Though we are disappointed that the Oklahoma Legislature saw fit to require a license to open carry, this reform is still a great step forward for freedom and self-defense rights. But we are also alarmed that some Oklahoma law enforcement officials seem ready to hijack the license requirement as an excuse to violate gun owners' Fourth Amendment rights," said a joint press release from the two organizations.

    . . .

    OpenCarry.org co-founder and spokesman John Pierce had this response: "Earth to Oklahoma police: In the United States, guns are not contraband, and gun ownership is not suspicious."

    The two advocacy groups called on Attorney General Scott Pruitt and law enforcement leaders to "ensure that all Oklahoma law enforcement officers are reminded that gun, or no gun, the Fourth Amendment requires at least 'reasonable articulable suspicion' of crime afoot before they may seize any person. And this goes for license checks as well."

    Police may not seize or detain someone openly carrying a weapon "just to demand production of a license to carry," the two groups maintain.

    Tim Gillespie, director and founder of the Oklahoma Second Amendment Association, declared: "We will be watching the police, and if need be, we will conduct open carry freedom of movement exercises and file lawsuits if we detect unconstitutional practices aimed at chilling the right to open carry."

    . . .

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    Regular Member FireHawk911's Avatar
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    I don't get this article. She trashes OC and then says it won't be a problem in OK? I do know that she needs some education.

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    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/ar...49456&allcom=1


    Tim Gillespie, director and founder of the Oklahoma Second Amendment Association, declared: "We will be watching the police, and if need be, we will conduct open carry freedom of movement exercises and file lawsuits if we detect unconstitutional practices aimed at chilling the right to open carry."

    . . .
    I guess we don't need OKOCA after all. Looks like Mr. Gillespie and the good folks at OK2A and OCDO are all over this issue. We'll never have 28,000 members. We just can't compete...
    Last edited by Springfield Smitty; 06-18-2012 at 12:22 PM.
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
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    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

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    Ok2a

    As a member of OK2A. Our group has been working towards constittutional open carry for the state of Oklahoma. We understand that to achieve this goal and change the minds of the public and LE certain steps must be taken. We have a person who has spent many hours, (volunteering his own time,) meeting with Legislators of both houses to achieve what we have now. Constitutional carry won't happen overnight and to try for it all at once would have met in failure.
    What we have is the first step accomplished in a long battle to achieve our goal. Our group will continue to work towards this. If you wish you can go to OK2A.org for further information.

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    Regular Member FireHawk911's Avatar
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    Smitty we will one day be just as big and as influential as OK2A. It just takes a little time.

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    I have faith in OKOCA.

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    Regular Member Springfield Smitty's Avatar
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    Thanks to those who do believe in what we are doing at OKOCA. I guess I should make it clear that I was being sarcastic in my first post to this thread. I am frustrated with the sense of betrayal that I feel from OK2A, but that is a personal feeling and in no way a public statement from OKOCA.
    -U.S. Army Veteran (2002-2005) 11BVB4 (Infantry, Airborne, Ranger, some other stuff) SGT (E-5)
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    -Certified NRA Instructor
    -CPL / CCW (whatever other acronym you can think of for carrying a concealed pistol) Instructor
    -Co-founder of OKOCA

    I am not an attorney. None of my statements should be accepted, nor are they intended to be offered, as legal advice or fact of law.

  8. #8
    Regular Member FireHawk911's Avatar
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    I agree with you about betrayal. It is very disheartening, but OKOCA will prevail!! This also is a personal opinion and in no way shape or form represents the views of OKOCA, it's Directors, Regional Coordinators, and/or Members.

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    To me, this just looks like a reprint of the original press release, nothing more.
    I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be accepted as legal advice

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    Regular Member Gary S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FireHawk911 View Post
    I don't get this article. She trashes OC and then says it won't be a problem in OK? I do know that she needs some education.
    I enjoyed reading the comments as well some people make no sense at all and others just need to get educated on their rights.
    Quote Originally Posted by FireHawk911 View Post
    Smitty we will one day be just as big and as influential as OK2A. It just takes a little time.
    Im a pretty new member to the forum and would like to also become a member of okoca, it may take time but it will get there. I tell people all the time about the site and ask them to visit the site.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary S View Post
    Im a pretty new member to the forum and would like to also become a member of okoca, it may take time but it will get there. I tell people all the time about the site and ask them to visit the site.
    Check out the OKOCA website and print out the registration for to become a member of OKOCA.
    I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be accepted as legal advice

  12. #12
    Regular Member Gary S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hrdware View Post
    Check out the OKOCA website and print out the registration for to become a member of OKOCA.
    I already have one printed out i just have to check my funds first im not working now but i want to become a member on Thursday at the lunch.

  13. #13
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    Hej Guys!

    I just sent a Email to the author of the above article in the OP....and asked her to write a followup opinion after your 1 Nov open carry provisions take effect.

    I also pointed her to what happened to Sean Michael Combs, the young 18 year old that go in trouble in MI for OCing a M1 Garand, and who's arrest she started her original opinion with.

    http://troy.patch.com/articles/rifle...s-civil-rights

    Please post any new article in the Tulsa paper so we can all read it.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Gary S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hrdware View Post
    Check out the OKOCA website and print out the registration for to become a member of OKOCA.
    Just to update you i printed out the form after filling it out and wrote a check for the amount and they are in the mail now, i look forward to calling myself a member of okoca, i like the help i get on the forum and how okoca got started and the cause okoca stands for. Thank you

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