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Thread: Beer Tent

  1. #1
    Regular Member WilDChilD's Avatar
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    Beer Tent

    I was wondering if a beer tent is considered a PFZ.

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    depends on if you have a CPL or not and if there is a liquor license
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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    Its a PFZ regardless if you have a CPL. I don't think you can sell alcohol in the state without a license, so yes, it's a PFZ.

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    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    don't be ridiculous. it's not PFZ for those with a CPL who openly carry
    P, as in pistol F, as in free
    if i can carry a pistol into that zone it's not pistol free
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  5. #5
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Its a PFZ regardless if you have a CPL. I don't think you can sell alcohol in the state without a license, so yes, it's a PFZ.
    What are you rambling about? It is only a PFZ if you don't have a CPL.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    ha, no kidding!
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  7. #7
    Regular Member WilDChilD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by autosurgeon View Post
    What are you rambling about? It is only a PFZ if you don't have a CPL.
    So, cc no, OC yes?

  8. #8
    Regular Member WilDChilD's Avatar
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    Was wondering because 28.425o (d) only states bar or tavern, not tent placed by city on city property.


    EDIT: I didn't post this on MGO on the cc forum because 50% of them are aholes and will just tell you there opinion and not the law. So thanks OC friends
    Last edited by WilDChilD; 06-20-2012 at 02:09 PM.

  9. #9
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    that's an interesting point... is a tent covered?
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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  10. #10
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    that's an interesting point... is a tent covered?
    1. OC/CPL No problem.

    2. CC/CPL

    "Bar" means a barrier or counter at which alcoholic liquor is sold to, served to, or consumed by
    customers. page 24 of this http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dl...s_343265_7.pdf

    "Tavern", is an establishment licensed to sell beer and wine ONLY.
    page 4 of this manual: http://www.michigan.gov/documents/CI...al_80316_7.pdf

    Ostensibly, this event would get a Temporary Authorization to sell beer. http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dl...9_264177_7.pdf


    IMHO, since this event is not "licensed" per se, rather it is "authorized", it really can't be considered under either of the two entities listed above. Therefore, I have a real difficult time applying the 28.425o prohibition if they wanted to charge you with a cc violation at a beer tent... as that only pertains to Bars and Taverns see:

    MCL 28.425o

    (d) A bar or tavern licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, where the primary source of income of the business is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass and consumed on the premises.

    I, however, am not an attorney and this is MY interpretation only. If you need a lawyer, please contact your state bar association.

    3.OC/ without a CPL

    The law states that a person, who does not fall into any of the listed exemptions, may not possess a firearm on the premises of an establishment licensed under the liquor control act. Whether a tent is "licensed" is, IMHO, arguable... the state seems to differentiate between a "license" and an "authorization". Also, I've looked up the word "establishment" in a number of dictionaries and in most (but not all) instances", an "establishment" denotes a place of business with some sense of permanence... something a beer tent really doesn't seem to have. But, since I am not an attorney, please take this as my thoughts only and definitely not legal advice.

    MCL 750.234d Possession of firearm on certain premises prohibited; applicability; violation as misdemeanor;penalty.


    Sec. 234d.

    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:


    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
    Last edited by DrTodd; 06-20-2012 at 03:38 PM.
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  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Beer & Guns = bad idea...just saying. Remember blood alcohol level in MI to be legal to drive is .08 but to carry under a CPL is far lower .02 if memory serves me correctly ( I don't drink ) so I could be off a bit.
    Last edited by Glock9mmOldStyle; 06-20-2012 at 03:49 PM.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  12. #12
    Regular Member WilDChilD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    Beer & Guns = bad idea...just saying. Remember blood alcohol level in MI to be legal to drive is .08 but to carry under a CPL is far lower .02 if memory serves me correctly ( I don't drink ) so I could be off a bit.
    I would not be drinking, but i do like florida's drinking and carrying law.

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    Quote Originally Posted by autosurgeon View Post
    What are you rambling about? It is only a PFZ if you don't have a CPL.
    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    don't be ridiculous. it's not PFZ for those with a CPL who openly carry
    P, as in pistol F, as in free
    if i can carry a pistol into that zone it's not pistol free

    You're both wrong. It is a PFZ, technically, a firearm free zone, the CPL simply provides an exemption to the law.

  14. #14
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    ok, so what you are saying is that the zone is pistol free. even when there are pistols in it.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

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    Law is a funny thing is it not?

    This is like a clean shoot. Killing someone is murder in the eyes of the law, but the SDA gives an affirmative defense for it.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 06-20-2012 at 11:15 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Law is a funny thing is it not?

    This is like a clean shoot. Killing someone is murder in the eyes of the law, but the SDA gives an affirmative defense for it.

    Wrong, Murder is the illegal killing of a human. The killing of a human is a homicide. All murders are homicides, but not all homicides are murder.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Ok, you're right.

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