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Thread: Fair Season

  1. #1
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    Fair Season

    Very soon Counties around Wisconsin will be planning their county fairs. From past experiences we know that the once deserted fairgrounds will become a beehive, full of fairgoers. The reason I write this is that recently we had an issue with public 'special events' criteria as a way to clamp down on our second amendment. Polling places are currently an issue. My polling place is a township truck shed. However the powers that be were going to decide as a previous post had suggested or have decided if we can or cannot OC/CC in the premises.
    Now my question is Do counties set up their own rules weather we can carry or not in the fair grounds or is it regulated by the state or will this public 'special events' rule be applied to county fairs to further restrict our right to OC?CC. If so then may as well be the local parade, fireworks display etc...

    Has anyone got any answers to these issues?

  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    They can't just say something is a special event. The law is quite clear what is designated a special event:

    943.13 (1e) (h) “Special event” means an event that is open to the public, is for a duration of not more than 3 weeks, and either has designated entrances to and from the event that are locked when the event is closed or requires an admission.

    So as long as they don't charge and it is an open venue (no locking gate), they can't do anything to prohibit the law abiding from exercising their right to bear arms.

    Edit: They also have to post the entrance(s). So even if the event is less than 3 weeks, has locked gates, and requires admission, does not automatically mean it is off limits to carry. It must be posted.
    Last edited by protias; 06-21-2012 at 09:07 AM.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  3. #3
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    [QUOTE=protias;1775329]They can't just say something is a special event. The law is quite clear what is designated a special event:

    943.13 (1e) (h) “Special event” means an event that is open to the public, is for a duration of not more than 3 weeks, and either has designated entrances to and from the event that are locked when the event is closed or requires an admission.

    Sounds like the Pierce County Fair to me. Our entrances are manned/locked and we have to pay to enter. But I remember seeing Gregg Miller there with his handgun. There goes my OC/CC.
    Last edited by Law abider; 06-20-2012 at 05:31 PM.

  4. #4
    Herr Heckler Koch
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    Is it private property? 414 W. Main St. is the village hall?

    Available Reports

    Feature Information
    Parcels.FID 4868
    PIN 121010990700
    Parcels.Comp_Num 121226171843P105103000
    TaxYear 2011
    Acres 0
    AlternateParcelNumber 121226171843P105103000
    MunicipalityDescription VILLAGE OF ELLSWORTH
    PlatType PLAT
    PlatDescription ASSESSORS PLAT
    Block
    Lot 103
    Section 18
    Township 26
    Range 17
    PhysAdd1 364 N MAPLE ST
    PhysAdd2 ELLSWORTH, WI 54011
    Attention
    OwnerName PIERCE COUNTY FAIR GROUNDS
    OwnerAdd1 414 W MAIN ST
    OwnerAdd2 ELLSWORTH, WI 54011
    OwnershipInterest

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    Wonder what's going to happen at the State Fair, as far as carry........

  6. #6
    Herr Heckler Koch
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    Quote Originally Posted by berettabone View Post
    Wonder what's going to happen at the State Fair, as far as carry........
    http://www.wistatefair.com/general_info/services.html
    PLEASE BE ADVISED
    Persons entering the facility assume all risks incidental to the event. State Fair reserves the right to refuse admission or eject any person violating any law, rule or policy. Patrons, bags and carry-ins are subject to search upon entry. Certain items may not be brought onto the premises including without limitation: alcohol, contraband, weapons, illegal drugs and controlled substances.

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    Gee, guess I won't be attending....and after what happened last year, I may not be the only one.......

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    Regular Member Lurchiron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berettabone View Post
    Wonder what's going to happen at the State Fair, as far as carry........
    Well...there's always bananas & tire-irons

    Attachment 8658
    Last edited by Lurchiron; 06-20-2012 at 08:37 PM.
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    (Fully warily let him watch,)
    Full long let him look about him;
    For little he knows where a foe may lurk,
    And sit in the seats within.

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  9. #9
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Law abider View Post

    Sounds like the Pierce County Fair to me. Our entrances are manned/locked and we have to pay to enter. But I remember seeing Gregg Miller there with his handgun. There goes my OC/CC.
    I made an addition to my post. Just because that Fair follows 943.13(1e)(h), it also has to be posted.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herr Heckler Koch View Post
    Available Reports

    Feature Information
    Parcels.FID 4868
    PIN 121010990700
    Parcels.Comp_Num 121226171843P105103000
    TaxYear 2011
    Acres 0
    AlternateParcelNumber 121226171843P105103000
    MunicipalityDescription VILLAGE OF ELLSWORTH
    PlatType PLAT
    PlatDescription ASSESSORS PLAT
    Block
    Lot 103
    Section 18
    Township 26
    Range 17
    PhysAdd1 364 N MAPLE ST
    PhysAdd2 ELLSWORTH, WI 54011
    Attention
    OwnerName PIERCE COUNTY FAIR GROUNDS
    OwnerAdd1 414 W MAIN ST
    OwnerAdd2 ELLSWORTH, WI 54011
    OwnershipInterest
    I called the fair office. It belongs to the county. They said no CC but were not sure about OC. They'll be calling me back with the info I'll have to talk to the DOJ. I am not taking their word. Protias I hope they will let me OC. I know I can't CC. Will look for postings
    Last edited by Law abider; 06-21-2012 at 06:05 PM.

  11. #11
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Law abider View Post
    I called the fair office. It belongs to the county. They said no CC but were not sure about OC. They'll be calling me back with the info I'll have to talk to the DOJ. I am not taking their word. Protias I hope they will let me OC. I know I can't CC. Will look for postings
    How could they restrict one method but not another? I'm sure they'll worm their way out of it.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  12. #12
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berettabone
    Wonder what's going to happen at the State Fair, as far as carry...
    They'll continue to pretend that their signs stop criminals from having weapons,
    while knowing that they're endangering the good people by preventing them the means to defend themselves from said criminals,
    and being completely unable to do anything to stop the criminals from harming the good people, inside or outside the Fair.

    Oh and by the way... something I figured out thanks to a FB discussion:
    There's no way for them to prevent someone from buying a kitchen knife (or a set) at one of those booths where they demonstrate products, tucking it in their bag (probably illegally, 'cause most people do not have carry licenses), & carrying it all over the fair.

    2 'solutions' occured to me:
    1) have LEO nearby, watching to see who conceals their new-bought weapon, checking for a cc license, & arresting everyone who doesn't have one (makes money for Milwaukee County)

    2) have 2A advocates nearby with informational fliers to hand to those same customers, advising them that they're committing a crime & how to get a cc license so they're legal in the future

    Actually there is a #3 - have those 2A activists taking hidden camera video showing people committing crimes & not being arrested/charged.
    And maybe #4 - make a few bucks walking purchases to the car for people w/o a license.
    Last edited by MKEgal; 06-24-2012 at 05:34 PM.

  13. #13
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    Here is a citation of the portions of the trespassing law that deal with special events.

    https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/sta...utes/943/II/13

    943.13(1e)(h) “Special event” means an event that is open to the public, is for a duration of not more than 3 weeks, and either has designated entrances to and from the event that are locked when the event is closed or requires an admission.

    ...

    943.13(1m)(c)3. While carrying a firearm, enters or remains at a special event if the organizers of the special event have notified the actor not to enter or remain at the special event while carrying a firearm or with that type of firearm. This subdivision does not apply, if the firearm is in a vehicle driven or parked in the parking facility, to any part of the special event grounds or building used as a parking facility.
    If they post the fair with a no guns sign or a No concealed handguns sign. you will only be able to possess that firearm in a vehicle driven or parked in the parking facility. These particular statutes regulate firearms.
    Last edited by E6chevron; 07-01-2012 at 10:30 PM.
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    Regular Member BROKENSPROKET's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Law abider;1775357]
    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    They can't just say something is a special event. The law is quite clear what is designated a special event:

    943.13 (1e) (h) “Special event” means an event that is open to the public, is for a duration of not more than 3 weeks, and either has designated entrances to and from the event that are locked when the event is closed or requires an admission.

    Sounds like the Pierce County Fair to me. Our entrances are manned/locked and we have to pay to enter. But I remember seeing Gregg Miller there with his handgun. There goes my OC/CC.
    Greg here. That was last year before Act 35 of 2011went into effect on 11-01-2011.

    Kerry Hilton was carrying aswell.

  15. #15
    Regular Member NoTolerance's Avatar
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    From the Waukesha County Fair website:

    Concealed weapons are not allowed on the Fairgrounds as they are County Grounds.


  16. #16
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoTolerance View Post
    From the Waukesha County Fair website:

    Concealed weapons are not allowed on the Fairgrounds as they are County Grounds.

    That makes no sense. Nothing in the law prohibits carrying on public property. Even so, by their own admission, OC is allowed?
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  17. #17
    Regular Member NoTolerance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    That makes no sense. Nothing in the law prohibits carrying on public property. Even so, by their own admission, OC is allowed?
    QFT

    So pretty much: if they're not posted, I'm carrying.

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    Anyone know if the Dane County Fair is posted? I'm assuming it is because of the county... hoping otherwise.

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    the Green county fair is not posted , but then that isn't a big surprise Monroe decided both to not post city building and also said they saw no reason to prohibit city employees from carrying concealed , as they don't restrict the general public from doing so , so long as the employee is properly licensed carry on.


    I wasn't planning on going to state fair this year , but one of my daughters 4H projects is going to state, so she wants to go now.

  20. #20
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berettabone
    Wonder what's going to happen at the State Fair, as far as carry...
    People will still be able to bring in the same weapons they used to start & continue the riot last summer - fists, elbows, knees, feet, etc.
    They'll try to prevent the more useful ones.

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    I was at the Sawyer county Fair grounds today for a fund raiser sale saw no signs.

  22. #22
    Regular Member AaronS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenCountyPete View Post


    I wasn't planning on going to state fair this year , but one of my daughters 4H projects is going to state, so she wants to go now.
    Good luck with that. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you and yours.

    I live in Milwaukee, and I will not see the fair grounds this year, for sure.

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    Older thread, but Racine County Fair had signs for their beer tents only. Last minute went to Ted Nugent show the Thursday night after flying into Milwaukee after a trip.

    Good to read elsewhere Walworth County Fair is making a good decision.

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    Yup Pierce county fair is posted. I was there today and they have a no weapons sign at the gate. When are people going to realize that pubic gatherings are a haven for crime?? Especially ones that are posted!!! They are so sure that guns are the problem and posting it will fix it.
    Last edited by samsam; 08-09-2012 at 08:50 PM.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by samsam View Post
    Yup Pierce county fair is posted. I was there today and they have a no weapons sign at the gate. When are people going to realize that pubic gatherings are a haven for crime?? Especially ones that are posted!!! They are so sure that guns are the problem and posting it will fix it.
    Was there too. stopped at the republican booth told no OC or CC!!! Will complain to supervisors
    samsam you live in Pierce county?
    Last edited by Law abider; 08-09-2012 at 11:39 PM.

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