CrackerJax
New member
[video=youtube_share;jfdEbe7e9GE]http://youtu.be/jfdEbe7e9GE[/video]
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Great Video of Student Schooling Officer on OC
- Thread starter CrackerJax
- Start date
davidmcbeth
Banned
Common practice ... of course it is .. to intimidate us into not carrying, duh.
porterhouse83
Regular Member
I really dislike cops who act like that 
:banghead:
:banghead:
mobiushky
Regular Member
Further, we in CO can point to the recent case Miller V Loveland that was settled out of court for $15,000 where the officers took his gun away. If the officer takes your gun in CO, we have precedent that could result in a payout from the city. Make sure you do not consent to search or seizure though. If you consent, you're out of luck.
zach
Regular Member
He's on the board
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?103248-My-yearly-detainment-in-Portland
Great thread!
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?103248-My-yearly-detainment-in-Portland
Great thread!
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
Ok I'm about to get flamed to hell and back..
I HATE these videos.. this does NOTHING to help our cause.. people running around baiting LEO's and preaching at them is a great way to make all of us look like lunatics..
I have NEVER in 10 years had a negative LEO encounter.. hell , i've never had one at all.. but i've had a lot of VERY positive 'people' encounters..
Flame me if you want..
--Rob
I HATE these videos.. this does NOTHING to help our cause.. people running around baiting LEO's and preaching at them is a great way to make all of us look like lunatics..
I have NEVER in 10 years had a negative LEO encounter.. hell , i've never had one at all.. but i've had a lot of VERY positive 'people' encounters..
Flame me if you want..
--Rob
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mobiushky
Regular Member
Ok I'm about to get flamed to hell and back..
I HATE these videos.. this does NOTHING to help our cause.. people running around baiting LEO's and preaching at them is a great way to make all of us look like lunatics..
I have NEVER in 10 years had a negative LEO encounter.. hell , i've never had one at all.. but i've had a lot of VERY positive 'people' encounters..
Flame me if you want..
--Rob
I'll step up... LOL! just kidding. I agree mostly with you. If you are intentionally baiting people into calling the police or like that one guy who would call the police just to video the interactions, that's just stupid on a monumental level. The only thing I will say is, if I'm stopped for no reason, I would have a little trouble completely acquiescing to all their demands. I would have no problem asking them why I'm being stopped and refusing to provide ID for a lawful act. However, I would not be belligerent like some of the videos are. I would so people. Kind and respectful and very level headed. I hope that makes sense. It's tough to really explain these complicated ideas on a forum.
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Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
The thing most of these people who 'video' LEO's don't understand .. If PD gets a MWAG call.. they are required (at least in Colorado) to make contact..
I always tell people to just give the man your license and get on your way.. its RARE that a LEO will just walk up and harass you..
If you want to bait and vid... you're just.. begging for charges.. even if you can beat them all.. it'll cost you a ton in atty's..
If you (anyone) are 'advocating' just to bait a LEO into a lawsuit.. please just put me on your ignore list now ...
I lied.. I have LEO encounters all the time here in county.. it's usually .. "hey".. [LEO] "how are ya" ... "good ty" ... yep...
--Rob
cch10000
Regular Member
Rob
I hope nobody flames ya. from what little I have known of you are a stand up guy
I'm just gonna say,, one bad encounter with leo can trash a thousand good ones
Just like one bad encounter with An OC can trash a thousand good ones for us
So far I've had many good educatioonal encounters with people who didn't know the law and only one questionable that I hope to difuse very soon
just from my limited experience
CH
I hope nobody flames ya. from what little I have known of you are a stand up guy
I'm just gonna say,, one bad encounter with leo can trash a thousand good ones
Just like one bad encounter with An OC can trash a thousand good ones for us
So far I've had many good educatioonal encounters with people who didn't know the law and only one questionable that I hope to difuse very soon
just from my limited experience
CH
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
Very true, however, there are ways to deal with that.. Cooperate (to keep yourself out of jail) .. don't argue .. you aren't going to 'win' .. you'll end up arrested , even if the charges are dropped.. it's a pain to sit at CJC for any period of time.. Anyway.. cooperate, then file a formal complaint..
THEN, if you want to post the results.. go for it..
BUT.. the majority of the videos i've seen on YT are NOT good for our cause.. they look like lunatics...
--Rob
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mobiushky
Regular Member
That I TOTALLY agree with.
There is one video I saw in from Cali that I might not totally object to. A guy was stopped and arrested for openly carrying a shotgun in a park. He later said that he tried to sue the state to get the OC ban overturned but the judge told him he had no reason to sue because he had not been arrested yet. So he went out and got himself arrested to start the process. But then, things in Cali are different from here. Or most places honestly.
Oh, and I don't blame the PD for making contact. It's their job. But I will politely decline to provide my ID unless they intend to arrest me. Don't really want my name splashed all over the report.
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zach
Regular Member
I seem to remember a certain outspoken member hear go off on such a statement, we'll see if he speaks up.
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
JamesB
Regular Member
I'm not going to flame ya Rob. (at least not intentionally)
But I will disagree with you.
I think that many pollice officers, not all of them i grant, are trained so much that they must control every aspect of an encounter that they have absolutely no idea how to back down, even when it is the right thing to do and they know it. They will continue to push forward simply because they are not allowed to have even the appearance of hesitation.
Yes, if they get a call they have to respond. What is wrong with responding as you suggest, with a "hey, how are ya?" "Good, and you?" There is NO requirement that they detain, search, seize, demand id, or interrogate anyone.
But I will disagree with you.
I think that many pollice officers, not all of them i grant, are trained so much that they must control every aspect of an encounter that they have absolutely no idea how to back down, even when it is the right thing to do and they know it. They will continue to push forward simply because they are not allowed to have even the appearance of hesitation.
Yes, if they get a call they have to respond. What is wrong with responding as you suggest, with a "hey, how are ya?" "Good, and you?" There is NO requirement that they detain, search, seize, demand id, or interrogate anyone.
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
I don't totally disagree with you.. my beef is when people video the encounter, or.. more likely, INSTIGATE the encounter by carrying M1 Garrand rifles on their backs in crowded cities (there's NO reason for this other than 'shock' value) , baiting LEO's, etc..
Like I said, I prefer to stay out of jail, even if i'm right, I'll complain when I get home.. in 5 minutes as opposed to 3 days later when i'm finally released..
--Rob
JamesB
Regular Member
When the car is broke down, how else do i get to the range? Walk.
When hard times come, i would much rather part with my car than my rifle.
If my car breaks down on the way home from the range, I'm packin the rifle home on my back since the car doors don't lock. (not that I would trust the locks with a nice rifle in the car)
Most of the people here recommend having a voice recorder with you just in case of something just like this were to happen. Lets face it, video is better.
There ARE legitamate reasons for packing a rifle on my back, even through town. Not all of them are simply to bait the leo.
Funny, but when I submit a formal complaint it is ALWAYS found to be completely justified. Even the command structure of the PD is not allowed to show hesitation. Have they EVER admitted they were wrong without a congressional investigation? Then what good is my complaint?
I will comply, I will not cooperate.
When hard times come, i would much rather part with my car than my rifle.
If my car breaks down on the way home from the range, I'm packin the rifle home on my back since the car doors don't lock. (not that I would trust the locks with a nice rifle in the car)
Most of the people here recommend having a voice recorder with you just in case of something just like this were to happen. Lets face it, video is better.
There ARE legitamate reasons for packing a rifle on my back, even through town. Not all of them are simply to bait the leo.
Funny, but when I submit a formal complaint it is ALWAYS found to be completely justified. Even the command structure of the PD is not allowed to show hesitation. Have they EVER admitted they were wrong without a congressional investigation? Then what good is my complaint?
I will comply, I will not cooperate.
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
The M1 incident was a bait / shock..
Almost ALL of the videos on YT are bait / shock ..
There are ways to advocate and educate without baiting cops...At our meet and greet for example, I had a 20 minute conversation with a couple ppl outside the restaurant before I even got in to eat..
I don't need to pack my tricked out Mini 14 to advocate.. I don't need to intentially seek out an LEO in florida, park in front of him while saying "there's a cop, let me pull in front of him" ... etc etc etc...
THAT's the point i'm trying to make.. I PERSONALLY will cooperate with LEO's.. I do not support, nor do I feel bad for anyone who promotes... "oo there's PD.. let me get my camera out and walk in front of their car!".. nor will I argue with a customer in a McDonalds attracting PD.. nor will I argue with a Walmart flunkie and get shot....
--Rob
cch10000
Regular Member
Don't know the entire details of the stop on the video But"
I belive the OC handled it well and the leo was totally in the wrong ie . had no right to take the firearm or ask any questions after the OC stated he did not consent to either search or detention,, as was substantiated by the Seargent letting him go
I also would not consent without threat of force to a detention and seizure nor a demand for ID unless there is the "Reasonable Articulate Suspicion" of crime,, if you do you just gave up another Constitutional right besides 2a
Its a fine line and one to be tread delicatly but one that must be tread to defend OUR rights
CH
I belive the OC handled it well and the leo was totally in the wrong ie . had no right to take the firearm or ask any questions after the OC stated he did not consent to either search or detention,, as was substantiated by the Seargent letting him go
I also would not consent without threat of force to a detention and seizure nor a demand for ID unless there is the "Reasonable Articulate Suspicion" of crime,, if you do you just gave up another Constitutional right besides 2a
Its a fine line and one to be tread delicatly but one that must be tread to defend OUR rights
CH
Bellum_Intus
Regular Member
Did he need to video this and post it on YT? .... The outcome would have been the same either way.. when the Brady bunch see's these types of videos, it's not HELPFUL to our cause.. trust me.. I know a few of those.. (they ARE NOT my friends..
)--Rob
porterhouse83
Regular Member
I feel LEO must be put in their place every now and then. Especially in situations like in the video. It is not ok for any LEO to think they are bigger than the constitution/law. They are there to serve us. It is that simple.