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Thread: TAke a look at Sid Miller response to my question on Open Carry. Looks like a way.

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    Regular Member texastransplant's Avatar
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    TAke a look at Sid Miller response to my question on Open Carry. Looks like a way.

    I am new to this forum; this is my first posting. I moved to Texas 2 years ago and was active in Illinoiscarry and the Rockford Tea Party. I am retired; a Vietnam era vet also married to an Army veteran. I am in Sid Miller’s 59th district and as you know he is the Chairman of the Homeland and Public Safety in the state. I have him on my facebook page and messaged the following to him, and he followed with this response.

    Sir, your opinion on open carry? 6 states have it, Ok just passed theirs. Some allow it with CHL others as our Constitution says "shall not be in fringed" not may and others just plain follow the Constitution. As a former Illinois resident I know what it's like to live without any ccw/chl or even barely allow to have firearms. I know what it's like to hide behind your window with a .45 in hand as druggies and gangbangers fight it out in your yard. I have seen drug deals daily, gun shots daily and bodies dumped in my neighborhood. That's what happens when citizens are not allowed their rights. In state where there is open carry/constitutional carry, crime drops even lower. With Texas being a "open" border with Mexico don't you think we should have these rights? I have my chl and do carry sometimes it's harder in the heat to dress for it and not have a firearm print. I know 15000 other gun owners on Texas Gun Talk dot com would be for it. If it did pass I doubt you'd even see 10% of us with licenses carry but we should have that option. This is important to us that value our 2nd amendment rights. My 6th removed Grandfather "Francis Lewis" put his name on the Declaration of Independence and I am sure he didn't do it have these rights taken. He lost almost everything fighting for our freedom and it is up to us as Americans to hold on to them. Thank you for your response.



    SID MILLER: As chairman of Homeland Security and Public Safety, all gun laws come before my committe, only if I decide to give them a hearing. I gave the open carry bill a hearing last session and will be glad to give it another one this session. The bill was filed by Representative George Lavender. George couldn't get the votes to pass it out of committee. We do have a large turnover on the committee this session, so I will give it a second chance.
    The NRA and Texas Sate Rifle Association were neutral on the bill. I would suggest that you come to Austin and speak on the bill your self and engage in the process. I am glad to help out.

    Notice his last line. Come to Austin an speak yourself and engage in the process.

    I can tell you in Illinois every year for the past 5 years Illinois carry and ISRA Illinois State Rifle Associate marched on the capitol to try and fight for our chl rights. Over 5000 show up in shirts printed with our feelings and go into the capitol and talk to our representatives. We would have a few speakers some pretty well known. Mr. Washington from Washington vs. Chicago on having a handgun in the city of Chicago.

    Anyway what are your thoughts on this. Sid Miller is the one that would get this to the floor. I think with a thousand or so showing up with support it would go a long ways toward having our 2nd amendment rights.

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    Regular Member texastransplant's Avatar
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    I am a Vietnam era Army veteran and my wife is also a Army veteran. Retired moved here 2 years ago, I am a former ffl, NRA member and political in nature. Enjoying country things, old mopars, shooting, hunting and fishing. I have been active in the Rockford Tea Party and Illinois carry effort. I know this was my first posting but I thought since Sid Miller is in a run off election I would like to see him re-elected because it's my belief he will help us. Then thing is from his note was the fact that "we the people" need to speak up for our rights. I think a show of force by gun owners would be a great thing to do. Words without action is basically nothing. "Shall not be in fringed" is what our 2nd amendment right states. Texas is a great place, I don't want it to see it go like where I lived in Illinois. Having open carry would be one more right they would have to fight to take away. Having constitutional carry would be even better.

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    Welcome, to Texas, and welcome to OCDO!

    Please also check out http://www.lonestarcdl.org/ Not a lot of activity there lately, but there's a good framework of a Texas-based organization.

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    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by texastransplant View Post
    I am new to this forum; this is my first posting. I moved to Texas 2 years ago and was active in Illinoiscarry and the Rockford Tea Party. I am retired; a Vietnam era vet also married to an Army veteran. I am in Sid Miller’s 59th district and as you know he is the Chairman of the Homeland and Public Safety in the state. I have him on my facebook page and messaged the following to him, and he followed with this response.

    Sir, your opinion on open carry? 6 states have it, Ok just passed theirs. Some allow it with CHL others as our Constitution says "shall not be in fringed" not may and others just plain follow the Constitution. As a former Illinois resident I know what it's like to live without any ccw/chl or even barely allow to have firearms. I know what it's like to hide behind your window with a .45 in hand as druggies and gangbangers fight it out in your yard. I have seen drug deals daily, gun shots daily and bodies dumped in my neighborhood. That's what happens when citizens are not allowed their rights. In state where there is open carry/constitutional carry, crime drops even lower. With Texas being a "open" border with Mexico don't you think we should have these rights? I have my chl and do carry sometimes it's harder in the heat to dress for it and not have a firearm print. I know 15000 other gun owners on Texas Gun Talk dot com would be for it. If it did pass I doubt you'd even see 10% of us with licenses carry but we should have that option. This is important to us that value our 2nd amendment rights. My 6th removed Grandfather "Francis Lewis" put his name on the Declaration of Independence and I am sure he didn't do it have these rights taken. He lost almost everything fighting for our freedom and it is up to us as Americans to hold on to them. Thank you for your response.



    SID MILLER: As chairman of Homeland Security and Public Safety, all gun laws come before my committe, only if I decide to give them a hearing. I gave the open carry bill a hearing last session and will be glad to give it another one this session. The bill was filed by Representative George Lavender. George couldn't get the votes to pass it out of committee. We do have a large turnover on the committee this session, so I will give it a second chance.
    The NRA and Texas Sate Rifle Association were neutral on the bill. I would suggest that you come to Austin and speak on the bill your self and engage in the process. I am glad to help out.

    Notice his last line. Come to Austin an speak yourself and engage in the process.

    I can tell you in Illinois every year for the past 5 years Illinois carry and ISRA Illinois State Rifle Associate marched on the capitol to try and fight for our chl rights. Over 5000 show up in shirts printed with our feelings and go into the capitol and talk to our representatives. We would have a few speakers some pretty well known. Mr. Washington from Washington vs. Chicago on having a handgun in the city of Chicago.

    Anyway what are your thoughts on this. Sid Miller is the one that would get this to the floor. I think with a thousand or so showing up with support it would go a long ways toward having our 2nd amendment rights.
    Well written! I think you are off a bit on the number of states with open carry. I believe the number is closer to 43 with something like 28 not requiring a license of any kind and the others requiring a license. I lived in Waukegan, IL in the late 70's and could see that times were changing. I moved out of Illinois and never looked back. I don't blame you for moving to the Lone Star State!

    Going to Austin to speak is an excellent idea. I hope you take a lot of support people with you to show them you guys want ALL your rights. Take those 15,000 Texans with you!

    Finally, thank you and your wife for your service!
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    Regular Member texastransplant's Avatar
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    Yes Illlinois is a mess, glad to be here. I can tell you in Illinois folks are fired up that's why it is easy to get 5000 to march to the capitol. Here in Texas were you pretty much have our freedoms and govement is not near as corrupt it's harder to get folks fired up. It's easy with the fingers typing but when it comes to putting the leather to the ground it's more difficult. I wish I was great at public speaking but I panic at our cowboy church when I ask for more food donations to a pantry I help out with.

    I have a feeling that if we could get 1000 to show and a few speakers that they might see the light. I sure can and feel sorry for those living closer to the border then I do. I know they are at risk. Back in Illinois they are being overun with illegals and all the laws protect them, free healthcare, housing, schools teach in spanish, it's a mess and one in three on food stamps. This is the resault of open borders. Imgaine lving in a city of 150k and having 25 murders a years. Ranked 3rd worst behind Detroit and St Louis.. I am not saying guns are the cure but they will cut crime down. Do criminals normally do a crime in front of a LEO? No, I doubt they would infront of a armed citizen.

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    Regular Member rushcreek2's Avatar
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    HB2756 WAS voted out of committee during the last legislative session. I testified in favor of the bill -as a former Texas resident who still holds a non-resident Texas CHL- before the Public Safety Subcommittee that voted HB 2756 out of committee. It was also voted out of the HS & PS Committee, but "stalled-out" in calendars when the session adjourned. The HB2756 version of licensed OC did not have the support of TSRA. It is my understanding that TSRA may introduce a modified version of of HB2756 in 2013, but my information is soley based on rumors at this point.

    I believe some version of licensed OC will pass the legislature in 2013, but TSRA support is critical.

    But you are right - Texans need to get proactive beginning NOW and let their voices be heard in every ear.

    I keep harping about writing letters to Attorney General Greg Abbott. Maybe I'm naively mistaken - but I think if enough mail arrives at his office - he will apply his good offices to the cause.

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    Quote Originally Posted by texastransplant View Post
    I sure can and feel sorry for those living closer to the border then I do. I know they are at risk.
    El Paso is the safest large city in America. The border zone, on the American side, is safer than Houston, DFW, or SA.

    On the south side, of course, is an entirely different matter.

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    Regular Member texastransplant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    El Paso is the safest large city in America. The border zone, on the American side, is safer than Houston, DFW, or SA.

    On the south side, of course, is an entirely different matter.
    I have to agree with you on that, those larger cities have a whole nother problem but should the whole of Texas suffer because of them? It's the same in Illinois, Chicago holds up the whole state. Thanks for that the information on your testifying, I think that needs to be done by a bunch of us and also a march or large group there to support the idea. As far as the TSRA, being new here I can't understand why they wouldn't want it. I know in Illinois the IRSA is a major push behind conceal carry. I think sometimes the mindset of hunting, sporting use of long guns and handguns seem more protected then the right of personal protection.

    Until you have lived ini an area where criminals carrying is the norm you don't realize what a problem it is. CHL is fine however freedom to do as our Constitution is better. Again, I'd not carry openly all the time, but sure there would be times I would. You have to look at it from the mind of a criminal, if they see someone carrying a firearm there is going to be a hesitation to commit the crime. The fear that someone will jump you and disarm you taking your firearm is unfounded.

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    I don't know why people feel compelled to state that they are vets ... it does not matter ... everyone (vet or not) has the rights the 2nd amendment provides us.

    And people in IL do carry in certain parts and the local police look the other way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by texastransplant View Post
    I have to agree with you on that, those larger cities have a whole nother problem but should the whole of Texas suffer because of them?
    (emphasis added) "Them"?

    Crime in Texas, like everywhere else, is mostly driven by native-born American citizens, usually several generations removed from immigrant ancestors. The vast majority of illegals are doing their best to stay below the radar, and avoid any police attention, because they want to stay here and work, not go to jail and then get deported.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    (emphasis added) "Them"?

    Crime in Texas, like everywhere else, is mostly driven by native-born American citizens, usually several generations removed from immigrant ancestors. The vast majority of illegals are doing their best to stay below the radar, and avoid any police attention, because they want to stay here and work, not go to jail and then get deported.
    I'm an example of it. See it from the converse perspective. I make it my daily purpose to violate every law I can that outlines a victimless crime passed by 'representatives' who aren't representing any interest but their own. Or worse, transforming a right into a crime. Any REAL American would. Those who are too afraid of the consequences aren't Americans because they're not TAKING ACTION against their corrupt government. Stuff another Big Mac in your face while watching Jersey Shore... Losers ARE Traitors.

    Got too much too lose? What will you have when this road leads to it's final stupidity? Your Stuff isn't worth much compared to the Bill of Rights you've thrown away. Your precious Money is being devalued to the point that it doesn't matter how much you have...

    Your two party system is nothing but a conspiracy against the Constitution. Wake up while you still can. Pathetic!
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    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I don't know why people feel compelled to state that they are vets ... it does not matter ... everyone (vet or not) has the rights the 2nd amendment provides us.

    And people in IL do carry in certain parts and the local police look the other way.
    When people state they are Veterans it means a lot to me. Why? Because usually those folks joined on their own to support and defend this great country and suffered through financial hardships and family separations that most will never undergo. Many "Veterans" have died over the years to preserve this country and our freedoms fighting in lands most of us will never visit in our lifetimes and never want to visit. But they go anyway and do as they are asked. Many die, others are maimed for life.

    The 2nd Amendment was paid for with the blood of Veterans. It sure didn't happen just because people wished for it.
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcawdor57 View Post
    When people state they are Veterans it means a lot to me. Why? Because usually those folks joined on their own to support and defend this great country and suffered through financial hardships and family separations that most will never undergo. Many "Veterans" have died over the years to preserve this country and our freedoms fighting in lands most of us will never visit in our lifetimes and never want to visit. But they go anyway and do as they are asked. Many die, others are maimed for life.

    The 2nd Amendment was paid for with the blood of Veterans. It sure didn't happen just because people wished for it.
    I throw this in with the Cop who put in his 4 years in the militaryand is now violating my Rights.

    What you did then means nothing; what are you doing now? Wiping your ass with what you say you fought for?
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
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    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Regular Member ()pen(arry's Avatar
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    It's great that a politician expresses willingness to support an open carry bill. Governor Perry and countless state Congressmen have done as much. We still don't have any movement.

    Hermod rode to Hel's hall on Sleipnir's back. Seeing Baldr in chains in Hel's honor seat, he pleaded with Hel to give Baldr back his breath, as the whole world wept for Baldr. Hel replied that he would give Baldr back his life, if every living creature wept for his death.

    Laud we Hel?

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    Regular Member texastransplant's Avatar
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    I guess then as the say to get opencarry through in Texas would mean putting rubber to the road. People showing up and offering support rather then having the lawmakers do it. The old saying "actions speak louder then words."

    As far as a saying the word "veteran" it's just part of who veterans are. It's not ment as to say if you are not you are un American. I volunteered during Vietnam, it was something our family did. Same with the wife, she grew up in a military family. I think it really boils down to taking an oath. No, didn't retire from there just went and did what we felt we had to do that's all.

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    "Governor Perry and countless state Congressmen have done as much. We still don't have any movement." -- ()pen(arry

    Nor do we have (or had had) any Republican governor who has done any LEADING re: the issue, just talk about it and only when asked, and isn't TALK what politicians do best? It's the rule, not the exception. That sorry Democrat Governor Texas had some years back (Ann Richards) was a good "excuse" to explain nothing getting done, but not for a Republican Governor since then.

    A couple of years ago, I even wrote Perry and asked him to LEAD...not FOLLOW like he tends to do in following other states/governors (such as Gov. Brewer of AZ -- after siding against her stance on immigration -- and currently, following FL in resisting ObamaCare), but demonstrate some LEADERSHIP (good old-fashioned initiative).

    He never responded.

    IMO, Pansy Perry is a disgrace, not just on the gun issue but re: immigration also. Glad he had no chance to be Da Prez.
    Last edited by cloudcroft; 07-10-2012 at 12:49 AM.

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    where Pooley he seem to have some good advice I would like to here his opinion and thoughts for the year 2013 open carry law

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    I live in Ft.Worth. But if anyone organizes any such "March on Austin" for the cause of open-carry, count me in. I'll drive down there and join the march.

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    Regular Member Evil Creamsicle's Avatar
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    I'm too far away to do much for you here, but I certainly support the cause. Anything I can do from MI, let me know.

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    I respectfully disagree about Perry

    Quote Originally Posted by cloudcroft View Post
    "Governor Perry and countless state Congressmen have done as much. We still don't have any movement." -- ()pen(arry

    Nor do we have (or had had) any Republican governor who has done any LEADING re: the issue, just talk about it and only when asked, and isn't TALK what politicians do best? It's the rule, not the exception. That sorry Democrat Governor Texas had some years back (Ann Richards) was a good "excuse" to explain nothing getting done, but not for a Republican Governor since then.

    A couple of years ago, I even wrote Perry and asked him to LEAD...not FOLLOW like he tends to do in following other states/governors (such as Gov. Brewer of AZ -- after siding against her stance on immigration -- and currently, following FL in resisting ObamaCare), but demonstrate some LEADERSHIP (good old-fashioned initiative).

    He never responded.

    IMO, Pansy Perry is a disgrace, not just on the gun issue but re: immigration also. Glad he had no chance to be Da Prez.
    Cloudcroft, I think people lead in different ways. Governor Perry has been preaching about the loss of state soverignty for several years now including in his book Fed Up. I believe he has done a good job in raising awareness of its importance and that is now paying off in the actions you are seeing from governors all across the country. Similarly his work with the Repubican Governors Association almost certainly helped to elect a great crop of new governors, including Rick Scott of FL. While I applaud Gov. Scott's action on Medicare, even he wasn't the first. I believe others beat him to the punch.

    I think Governor Perry and top officials in our state have been leaders on important issues. Regarding firearms, AG Abbott, with Perry's support I'm sure, was the lead state & drafted the amicus brief joined by 38 states (https://www.oag.state.tx.us/oagnews/release.php?id=3233) before the U.S. Supreme Court in the Heller decision (getting the 2A declared to be a fundamental right). Similarly he submitted one in the McDonald v. Chicago case )incorporating the 2A via the 14A to the States). Similarly Texas has been on the forefront of fighting the EPA on their increasingly ridiculous air and water quality demands. Of course, we've been the leader in capital punishment for quite some time. Redistricting & the misuse of the Civil Rights Act led Texas the the USSC early this year and we prevailed.

    Governor Perry isn't perfect and I don't know that I'll support him for a 4th term but he seems to be on TV defending our constitutional system and individual liberty far more than most. Who else is doing this work? Govs. Jindal and Haley for sure. Who else? I'd say I'm much more familiar with sitting governors than most voters so I tested myself (source = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ates_governors) to see which ones I could recognize thanks to their high-profile work & dealing with the media. The result:

    Aside from Perry, these governors have done enough to make my radar screen:

    Brewer, AZ
    Scott, FL
    Jindal, LA
    Haley, SC
    McDonald, VA

    Honorable mentions go to these for being active & fighters in budget/finance/union matters:
    Daniels, IN
    Snyder, MI
    Kasich, OH
    Walker, WI
    Christie, NJ

    That makes Perry one of 6 (of 29 Republican governors) who are truly leading the way. In conclusion, I disagree that Perry is a passive follower just happy to be a governor and trying to enjoy the ride.

    SA-TX

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    Yes and let's work to make it happen

    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    HB2756 WAS voted out of committee during the last legislative session. I testified in favor of the bill -as a former Texas resident who still holds a non-resident Texas CHL- before the Public Safety Subcommittee that voted HB 2756 out of committee. It was also voted out of the HS & PS Committee, but "stalled-out" in calendars when the session adjourned. The HB2756 version of licensed OC did not have the support of TSRA. It is my understanding that TSRA may introduce a modified version of of HB2756 in 2013, but my information is soley based on rumors at this point.

    I believe some version of licensed OC will pass the legislature in 2013, but TSRA support is critical.

    But you are right - Texans need to get proactive beginning NOW and let their voices be heard in every ear.

    I keep harping about writing letters to Attorney General Greg Abbott. Maybe I'm naively mistaken - but I think if enough mail arrives at his office - he will apply his good offices to the cause.
    I think the AG's office isn't the right avenue but making your feelings known can't hurt.

    I agree completely that people joining TSRA and working with that group and its leaders is the single most effective thing you can do to get OC passed in TX this session. Forget the past because the objective is within our sights. TSRA will not be neutral on bills that they craft or are crafted to their liking. This IS the way to get it done.

    Looking forward to working with you,

    SA-TX

  22. #22
    Regular Member rushcreek2's Avatar
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    The consensus of the citizens of Texas in 1875 was that the delegates tasked with adopting a post-Reconstruction constitution should essentially reinstate the universally respected, and readily available 1845 Texas Constitution, while modifying it only as necessity might require rather than attempting to start from scratch, or rely upon the 1861, 1866, or 1869 Texas Constitutions as models. This is a CRUCIAL element - in any effort to honestly interpret the intent of "...but the Legislature shall have power to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime".


    The 1845 Texas Constitution provided absolutely NO means for the Texas Legislature to regulate the right to keep and bear arms. The only discussion during the 1845 Constitution Convention relating to the question of whether the right should be subject to some restriction concerned the practice of CRIMINALS carrying CONCEALED deadly weapons- primarily Bowie Knives by the way - not handguns. Bowie Knives were much more lethal, and not limited to only ONE "shot" as pistols were.

    Efforts to adopt some restriction upon CONCEALED carry of deadly weapons during the 1845 Convention FAILED due to the overriding concern that such restrictions would also render the LAW-ABIDING citizens helpless in the face of assassins, and robbers. In other words the consensus of the convention delegates was that it was preferable to suffer the spurious practice of potential criminals carrying concealed deadly weapons, than to prevent law-abiding citizens from being able to defend themselves against such criminals by also carrying concealed deadly weapons.

    Arguments were put forth during the 1875-76 Constitution Convention that the Legislature should be empowered to PROHIBIT the wearing of arms - AGAIN - a term used to describe the CONCEALMENT of arms. The proposed power to "PROHIBIT the wearing of arms" was not adopted. Instead the wording "power to REGULATE the wearing of arms , WITH A VIEW TO PREVENT CRIME" was adopted. In other words this power to regulate the wearing of arms was INTENDED to address the wearing of arms FOR CRIMINAL PURPOSES.

    The entire legal premise that handgun carry is somehow excepted from the right to keep and bear arms that every citizen shall have under the present 1876 Texas Constitution is preposterous. Handgun carry for CRIMINAL purposes may be regulated. The Texas CHL is constitutional to the extent that such licensing serves to preclude known criminals from carrying handguns, but there is no basis for the premise that the 1876 Texas Constitution somehow provides the Legislature with the power to mandate that law-abiding citizens who are issued the CHL must carry their handguns concealed at all times.

    I know - Texas case laws still stubbornly adheres to the April 12, 1871 Disarmament Act that essentially banned habitual handgun carry except when traveling. This aspect of Texas case law is an utter embarrassment to the Lone Star State in that it amounts to nothing less than 141 years of voluntary submission to federal Reconstruction rule well into the 21st Century.

    Now - if my feeble, and simple mind can navigate through a few pages of documented Texas history, and reason out this obvious conclusion - don't you think the Texas Attorney General can do the same ? And isn't that the job he was hired to do - provide wise counsel to the State regarding the Texas Constitution ?
    Last edited by rushcreek2; 07-14-2012 at 06:27 PM.

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    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SA-TX View Post

    Aside from Perry, these governors have done enough to make my radar screen:

    Brewer, AZ
    Scott, FL
    Jindal, LA
    Haley, SC
    McDonald, VA

    Honorable mentions go to these for being active & fighters in budget/finance/union matters:
    Daniels, IN
    Snyder, MI
    Kasich, OH
    Walker, WI
    Christie, NJ

    That makes Perry one of 6 (of 29 Republican governors) who are truly leading the way. In conclusion, I disagree that Perry is a passive follower just happy to be a governor and trying to enjoy the ride.

    SA-TX

    Not Christi on 2nd Amendment rights.

    He has stated that he thinks NJ's Draconian firearms laws are "about right".
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them.

    Politicians should serve two terms, one in office and one in prison.(borrowed from RioKid)

  24. #24
    Centurion
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    I agree with your recitation of history, but ...

    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    The consensus of the citizens of Texas in 1875 was that the delegates tasked with adopting a post-Reconstruction constitution should essentially reinstate the universally respected, and readily available 1845 Texas Constitution, while modifying it only as necessity might require rather than attempting to start from scratch, or rely upon the 1861, 1866, or 1869 Texas Constitutions as models. This is a CRUCIAL element - in any effort to honestly interpret the intent of "...but the Legislature shall have power to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime".

    I agree
    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    Arguments were put forth during the 1875-76 Constitution Convention that the Legislature should be empowered to PROHIBIT the wearing of arms - AGAIN - a term used to describe the CONCEALMENT of arms. The proposed power to "PROHIBIT the wearing of arms" was not adopted. Instead the wording "power to REGULATE the wearing of arms , WITH A VIEW TO PREVENT CRIME" was adopted. In other words this power to regulate the wearing of arms was INTENDED to address the wearing of arms FOR CRIMINAL PURPOSES.
    Agreed. Unfortunately long, long ago a Democratic legislature (this is post-Reconstruction) passed, a Democratic governor signed into law, and a Democratic Supreme Court/Court of Criminal Appeals ruled that the 1876 wording DID provide the Legislature with that power. That's why no past AG has sought to change it, nor is it likely that AG Abbott will do so.

    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    Now - if my feeble, and simple mind can navigate through a few pages of documented Texas history, and reason out this obvious conclusion - don't you think the Texas Attorney General can do the same ? And isn't that the job he was hired to do - provide wise counsel to the State regarding the Texas Constitution ?
    I think you are missing the bigger picture. WE THE PEOPLE haven't demanded that our legislators change the law. As sad as it is, Texans have accepted the current state of affairs. Therefore no AG or governor or any other elected official is to spend his political capital on something that a large segment of Texans apparently don't care about particularly where there is 140 some years of unbroken precedent. Even today, among gun owners and CHL holders, we have a lively debate over what carry restrictions there ought to be. If that group of 2A activists can't agree on what changes to propose, the general populace is much less likely to raise the issue to the level necessary for those in Austin to care.

    Bottom line -- the history, the Constitution, our tradition of liberty, etc. sadly don't matter in this case because it is a very anomolous exception to the rule that Texans guard their freedom jealously and will fight anyone to retain it. We somehow gave in on this one and so much time as passed that it just doesn't register on people's radar. For this reason, strategies that "fly under the radar" -- such as eliminating the penalty for CHL holder not concealing -- should be successful. Every state has their positives and negatives. Texas is blessed with many, many positive qualities and only a few negatives. Regretably this is one of them.

    SA-TX

  25. #25
    Regular Member rushcreek2's Avatar
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    I used to live in Tom Green County during the '60's & '70's. During that time there was no handgun carry illegality issue unless you used one to menace, rob, or shoot someone. I was closely aqcuainted with several San Angelo LEO's during those years, and the subject never came up. During those years the criminal carry of a handgun was correctly associated with CRIMINAL CONDUCT. I recall that the handgun issue only started becoming a problem affecting law-abiding citizens around 1990 and really got traction in 1993 when Clinton took office- and that was primarily in Harris County (Houston).

    My point is that although the April 12, 1871 Disarmament Act has been around for 141 years- it didn't become a serious issue affecting law-abiding Texans until about 20 years ago. The 46.035a "crime" of intentional failure to conceal by a CHL license holder has only been around for 16 years.

    So the two main issues affecting handgun carry by Texans, and people visiting Texas have presented themselves only within the last 2 decades - a far cry from qualifying for 141 years of public acceptance status.

    The handgun license is here to stay - I believe - but 46.035a definitely is not. There is considerable support among Republicans in the Legislature to repeal that onerous section in 2013.

    This is an issue that is presently experiencing rejection by the body politic of the extremism of the past 2 decades. The trend is definitely leaning towards relaxation of such restrictions.
    Last edited by rushcreek2; 07-17-2012 at 05:58 PM.

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