Why such paranioa over law enforcment?

I dunno, maybe its where i'm from a small town and know most of the police and few others in other counties. but the encounters i have had from ones i did not know have never been bad. it seems like the mentality of this forum as well as other firearm forums as a whole is the cops are out to get you. i just do not see it. can someone tell me why?

None of us think that cops are out to get us. Most recognize that the majority of law enforcement officers are just trying to do their job. But we are realists, we recognize that there is always a bad apple in a barrel. Someone who either is on a power kick or just does not know the law. Look at the average citizen, they think that you need a permit to carry a firearm. Law enforcement officers were once just an average citizen. So it is natural that we will run into a few bad ones. We always prepare for those.

Also, it does not matter if you know the cops by name and have had past (favorable) dealings with them. Look at all my stories, the only favorable encounter I had was with a deputy from a neighboring county. All the rest I knew, I played paintball a deputy for a while, worked wrecks beside the sheriff and have talked to all the other deputies for various things. Then I started carrying a firearm and they changed.

Just as Isaac said..tons of good LEO's but always the hand full of bad one that don't care to sh!t on your rights. I myself have rode along with LE from my city and even thought about switching jobs to become a LEO. Keep in mind that we don't just talk about how to handle a bad encounter with LEO but we also discuss ways to handle a bad encounter with Joe Blow citizen. If an LEO isn't giving me a hard time I will go out of my way to be polite. But if he starts to stomp on my right I will very politly defend them. That gun on your hip doesn't always make you right but also keep in mind that the badge on his chest doesn't always make him right.

We are never looking for trouble when we OC but we don't like to have our balls busted by LEO (or anyone) if we are legal in what we are doing. It kinda goes back to what you see everytime you log onto this site.."A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost"

Curtis C said:

I dunno, maybe its where i'm from a small town and know most of the police and few others in other counties. but the encounters i have had from ones i did not know have never been bad. it seems like the mentality of this forum as well as other firearm forums as a whole is the cops are out to get you. i just do not see it. can someone tell me why?

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Go on Youtube and search for police misconduct, opencarry detainment, etc. These videos will blow your mind, and this is what happens everyday here in the good old United States. I agree with the rest that the majority of small town "peace officers" are good guys, but in the bigger cities law enforcement officers are being militarized and trained to act like soldiers in a war zone and not the peace officers they are supposed to be. Watch the videos, they will make you extremely mad if you are a freedom loving American.

we do respect LEOs on this site. that a basic in the term law abiding citizen.

it said better in this phrase, "we are not anti cop, just pro rights"

just remember absolute power corrupts, absolutely. we are Leary of people with absolute powers

Why do police have the stereotype of being @$$holes? I don't know if it is the type of person that is attracted to the position of power or if it is a police tactic. Perhaps more the latter. I asked an acquaintance that was a cop and he said that in dealing with the public during many stressful/friction prone situations, it's better to come off as strong and in control.

Personally, my experiences have been 90% negative in IN and almost 90% positive in KY. We have to remember that when we deal with the police in confrontation/detainment (rather than the casual encounter), we have almost nothing to gain and everything to lose. When I'm pulled over for a traffic violation--especially when I know I'm guilty, I'll be very courteous and professional (not that I would consent to searches). If I'm being detained for a BS reason--say OCing--I have no incentive for cooperating with police. There's a very good YouTube video posted in various places around this forum where a professor explains why talking to the police is a bad idea.

As with any stereotype, there are trends that happen with certain people groups. The majority of those in a people group may not act in that manner, but nevertheless--there are common characteristics that present themselves. Unfortunately, with LEOs, many of these are negative.

most of the you tube videos i've seen people are delibritly doing something to provoke the officer for a reaction, and some should have been arrested.

Curtis C said:

most of the you tube videos i've seen people are delibritly doing something to provoke the officer for a reaction, and some should have been arrested.

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Holding dear their rights. Yea, it pisses the government off too. I think most of the time they are needlessly doing what they do, but I support their right to do it. "Randomly" video taping a cop, should they be arrested for that? No. Refusing to give ID where it is not warranted, should they be arrested for that? No.

I have to problem producing ID. I do have problems with "Law-enforcement" demanding ID where I do not have any obligations to though.

Plenty would say that all of us, as OC'ers are "provoking" an officer. It is a dangerous road to go down to start enforcing opinions. You will find no support for that view here.

09jisaac said:

Holding dear their rights. Yea, it pisses the government off too. I think most of the time they are needlessly doing what they do, but I support their right to do it. "Randomly" video taping a cop, should they be arrested for that? No. Refusing to give ID where it is not warranted, should they be arrested for that? No.

I have to problem producing ID. I do have problems with "Law-enforcement" demanding ID where I do not have any obligations to though.

Plenty would say that all of us, as OC'ers are "provoking" an officer. It is a dangerous road to go down to start enforcing opinions. You will find no support for that view here.

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I am almost scared to get involved with this conversation.. i said "almost"..

I have wondered the same thing at times.. it isnt the community as a whole.. but some people do go a bit paranoid when it comes to OC...

I do not watch for a LEO reaction.. i do not carry a recording device... even when OC.. I feel like if I need to carry a recording device when OC then I should carry one 24/7 when I am doing other legal activities.. just in case a LEO feels a reason to hassle me for driving my car legally..

Bottom line.. OC is legal.. it is no different than walking down the street... eating pizza.. drinking a coke.. or talking to your neighbor

We as a whole do catch a little extra attention when OC because it isn't normal.. and the recording devices have come in handy in situations.. it is a matter of personal opinion and choice that I respect just as I respect someone's personal choice to carry or to not carry.

If I wanted to color my hair blue I wouldn't feel the need to carry one, so I don't when OC or CC.. just my personal choice

Disclaimer: no offense meant to anyone and my spelling sucks right now (I think I corrected typo's)

Curtis C said:

most of the you tube videos i've seen people are delibritly doing something to provoke the officer for a reaction, and some should have been arrested.

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And this is the real problem with our current situation. What should these people be arrested for? Attempting to document illegal detainments? Like the vast majority of the country you've been indoctrinated from birth with school and TV that cops have absolute power. They don't. We've been taught that "public safety" is a cause that gives cops a blanket power to inflict any sort of "temporary" denial of all rights. Freedom is a antiquated ideal....

Most of my family is or has been LEO's, so I've grown up around them. I'm not paranoid during a traffic stop. I am however acutely aware that the vast majority of LEO's who have any number of years oh say above...one on the force are incredibly paranoid. With good reason, unless stats have changed traffic stops are considered one of the most dangerous encounters a LEO faces. The worst nightmare scenario ontop of that is a man with a gun during a traffic stop. So yes, when I do get pulled over and I am carrying the stress level does ratchet up for me.

twoskinsonemanns said:

And this is the real problem with our current situation. What should these people be arrested for? Attempting to document illegal detainments? Like the vast majority of the country you've been indoctrinated from birth with school and TV that cops have absolute power. They don't. We've been taught that "public safety" is a cause that gives cops a blanket power to inflict any sort of "temporary" denial of all rights. Freedom is a antiquated ideal....

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well for one, there is several, nearly the same senerio a person with a camera engages an officer who is doing a traffic stop, just comes up and harasses the cop, then walks away, then it picks up when the cop stops the guy with the camera. I'm sorry that is just idiotic they are asking for trouble.

I support the forum rules:

(15) WE ADVOCATE FOR THE 'LAW-ABIDING' ONLY

And that includes police. We have seen far too many instances of police violating the Constitution and the law, trampling citizens' rights as well as their faces.

Are there cops who are't bad? Of course. Probably the majority aren't bad. But, just being "not bad" doesn't make them good. Being a good cop means stopping the bad cops, and that's extremely rare, and understandably so: Regina Tasca tried being a good cop, and look what it got her.

Even the most anarchist-leaning among us here has no problem with peace officers. The problem is, there are so few of them.

The danger of professional law enforcement is by making them a select group of people with special powers, you've created an in-group and an out-group. This situation almost always leads to abuse and discrimination.

Curtis C said:

well for one, there is several, nearly the same senerio a person with a camera engages an officer who is doing a traffic stop, just comes up and harasses the cop, then walks away, then it picks up when the cop stops the guy with the camera. I'm sorry that is just idiotic they are asking for trouble.

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I have seen a video just like the one you described. Just because someone is being annoying/an a-hole/nuisance or "harassing" doesn't mean that they shouldn't be allowed to do what they want to do. I think Obama supporters are annoying, many people on this forum will agree with that claim, should that give us the authority to "punish" them how we see fit? As I stated before, it is dangerous to allow opinions to be enforced. It is already this way and look at the mess we are in, I doubt more opinions will do anything to help.

Curtis C said:

well for one, there is several, nearly the same senerio a person with a camera engages an officer who is doing a traffic stop, just comes up and harasses the cop, then walks away, then it picks up when the cop stops the guy with the camera. I'm sorry that is just idiotic they are asking for trouble.

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I believe I've seen this video. The guy decided to record the police stop from across the street. Again what crime should the person with the camera be arrested for? Actions congruent with being a idiot in the opinion of Curtis?

Curtis C said:

I dunno, maybe its where i'm from a small town and know most of the police and few others in other counties. but the encounters i have had from ones i did not know have never been bad. it seems like the mentality of this forum as well as other firearm forums as a whole is the cops are out to get you. i just do not see it. can someone tell me why?

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COMMENTS REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR: Totally Inappropriate

09jisaac said:

I have seen a video just like the one you described. Just because someone is being annoying/an a-hole/nuisance or "harassing" doesn't mean that they shouldn't be allowed to do what they want to do. I think Obama supporters are annoying, many people on this forum will agree with that claim, should that give us the authority to "punish" them how we see fit? As I stated before, it is dangerous to allow opinions to be enforced. It is already this way and look at the mess we are in, I doubt more opinions will do anything to help.

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Wow! Youve gotten really off-topic.

Better stock up on meds for November, when Romney goes down in flames, as he should.

ComradeV said:

The danger of professional law enforcement is by making them a select group of people with special powers, you've created an in-group and an out-group. This situation almost always leads to abuse and discrimination.

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Not "always" just sometimes.

Get involved in your local police board, if that's what you are really worried about.

Shoobee said:

Wow! Youve gotten really off-topic.

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Shoobee said:

...the Jewish-run production companies have blasted the tv screens with a lot of N a z i SS and Gestapo shows...

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Ya. People do get of topic times.