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‘Gun symbol of freedom and liberty’ Front page of Lapeer County Press

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
I had no idea this would be the front page of the county press! I have been working on getting the signs removed from the Sheriff's department. Looks like i could use a little more help!

http://thecountypress.mihomepaper.com/

A North Branch man is standing up for what he believes is his right bear arms, even inside the building that houses the Lapeer County Sheriff’s Department and Lapeer County Jail.
Jason Harrison came to a Lapeer County Commission meeting last month, expressing his concerns that the signs on the doors of the Sheriff’s Department prohibiting concealed weapons as unlawful. After the meeting, he was told by Commissioner Cheryl Clark that to her understanding the signs had been changed or removed. Harrison said he was thrilled when he heard that.
“I drove immediately when I left there to the sheriff’s department,” he said.
It all started, Harrison said, when he went into the sheriff’s department to drop off the required registration paperwork for a new pistol he had purchased. He said he was wearing the gun, and after he saw the sign, he unconcealed it before entering the lobby. He said the person he spoke to was not happy to see him with the gun. He spoke to a sergeant who said the sign was legal, and he was asked to leave the building and come in without a firearm in the future if he wanted to do business there.
Harrison is loosely associated with a group called Michigan Open Carry, and said the issue of firearm rights has been “kind of a hobby” of his for a few years.
“I think the gun is the symbol of freedom and liberty,” he said, saying that every totalitarian government in history has taken away citizens rights to bear arms, citing Russia and Nazi Germany as examples. “If you’re in America, we’re a free society.”
On Thursday, he came in front of the county commissioners again to tell them that the sign has not, in fact, been removed, and that he still believes it is illegal. He asked them to “compel the sheriff” to remove the sign.
Commissioners responded that they did not have the authority to make the sheriff remove the sign, however, Commissioner Ian Kempf did promise to contact Prosecutor Byron Konschuh to get his opinion on the issue.
“Byron has looked at it before and is looking at it again.” Kempf said, adding that he plant to have konschuh’s firm opinion on the matter by this Thursdays County Commission meeting.
Kempf added that the tentative opinion is that the sheriff’s department is connected to the jail and therefore falls under the exemption to the law that applies to prisons.
“I think that the other thing that is going to come up is that the magistrates go to the jail to hold trials there, so it’s acting also as a working courthouse and courthouses are clearly covered.” Kempf said.
Kempf said he is fine with addressing Harrison’s concerns as a citizen.
“he clearly has a passion.” Kempf said. “He’s been very polite and respectful and I think he deserves an answer and we’re more than happy to get it for him.”
 

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
The Lapeer County Commissioners have requested an opinion from the prosecutor on the legality of the no gun signs on the doors of the lobby of the Sheriff's department.

according to this article , the opinion is likely that the signs ARE lawful because of one or two reasons:

either the jail is covered under the mcl that outlaws weapons at state correctional facilities under the jurisdiction of the Michigan department of corrections.

or

since magistrates occasionally come to the jail to hold court sessions the building is a courthouse giving them the authority to ban firearms.

I am asking for people to please attend the next commissioner meeting.

Thursday, July 26, 2012 8:30 a.m.

I am also asking for help, as i do not know what the next step is if the prosecutor decides that the signs are lawful.
 

bruiser 160

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
48
Location
Lapeer, Michigan, USA
Sounds to me like they are looking at two possible loop holes to validate the sign. I always thought it was an illegal sign and that they really didn`t care what anyone thought. Hopefully Byron Konschuh finds the sign illegal and that this issue comes to an end.
 

PDinDetroit

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2009
Messages
2,328
Location
SE, Michigan, USA
The Lapeer County Commissioners have requested an opinion from the prosecutor on the legality of the no gun signs on the doors of the lobby of the Sheriff's department.

according to this article , the opinion is likely that the signs ARE lawful because of one or two reasons:

either the jail is covered under the mcl that outlaws weapons at state correctional facilities under the jurisdiction of the Michigan department of corrections.

or

since magistrates occasionally come to the jail to hold court sessions the building is a courthouse giving them the authority to ban firearms.

I am asking for people to please attend the next commissioner meeting.

Thursday, July 26, 2012 8:30 a.m.

I am also asking for help, as i do not know what the next step is if the prosecutor decides that the signs are lawful.

The above in BOLD MUST BE PART OF THE COURT SECURITY PLAN FOR IT TO BE LEGAL.
 

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
It takes a little searching but the rules are contained in supreme court order 2001-1

On my phone now so don't have link handy.

They are grasping at straws. Even if their argument is that it is a court, how can they explain that people were required until recently to bring firearms into this "court" building?
 
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lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
Wow! Made the front pAge again!

This time, according to the article, the prosecutor told the sheriff that the weapon prohibition is lawful according to mcl 801.262 (which prohibits bringing weapons to a jail for the use or benefit of a prisoner.

Grasping at straws are we?

801.262 Prohibited acts; weapons.
Sec. 2.

(1) Unless authorized by the chief administrator of the jail, a person shall not do either of the following:

(a) Bring into a jail or a building appurtenant to a jail, or onto the grounds used for jail purposes, for the use or benefit of a prisoner, any weapon or other item that may be used to injure a prisoner or other person, or used to assist a prisoner in escaping from jail.
 

Glock9mmOldStyle

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Apr 21, 2010
Messages
2,038
Location
Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
Kempf said. “He’s been very polite and respectful and I think he deserves an answer and we’re more than happy to get it for him.”

I'm glad to hear it put this way.

It's just code speak for: passion = "this nut has been well behaved up to this point..." The prosecutor works FOR the police, not the other way around. Mr. Harrison has been asking nicely since last fall if I recall correctly? I wonder what their prosecutor will decide..NOT, it was decided long ago, without a court battle they will not remove the signs and they will twist & bend the law to suit them as usual.

Sorry I do not mean to be negative, but it's the same old song & dance here from "our" leaders. Okay since a magistrate is there on occasions the public lobby magically becomes a court house??? Okay by that logic whenever any official from the court is in transit to and from a facility to conduct court business they should be covered by a 1,000 foot PFZ right?

Edit To Add - Maybe all court officials should be issued special "royal purple" flashers and a siren that screams "make way for the King's men!" Just saying... :rolleyes:
 
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Evil Creamsicle

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Joined
Sep 11, 2009
Messages
1,264
Location
Police State, USA
Wow! Made the front pAge again!

This time, according to the article, the prosecutor told the sheriff that the weapon prohibition is lawful according to mcl 801.262 (which prohibits bringing weapons to a jail for the use or benefit of a prisoner.

Grasping at straws are we?

As written, that law requires intent to provide the weapon to a prisoner, does it not?
 

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
As written, that law requires intent to provide the weapon to a prisoner, does it not?

My interpretation is the same as yours.

Not to mention the lobby is secured from the rest of the building, and the jail is presumably further secured from the rest of the building. One would need intent, and access in order to provide a weapon for the use or benefit of a prisoner.

A law abiding citizen conducting business inside the secure lobby has neither intent or access.
 

Glock9mmOldStyle

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Apr 21, 2010
Messages
2,038
Location
Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
As stated above this is just more gibberish from them. And it proves the prosecutor is a mere puppet of the powers in charge of that building, which we the tax payers own! :mad:

Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both! :eek:
 

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
There have been at least two more articles in the paper about this issue.

The reporter just emailed me saying the sheriff just told her the signs have come down, almost.

I guess they moved the signs to the part of the building that is secure and not accessible to the general public.

The lobby is no longer posted.

Yay!
 

sasha601

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
338
Location
Rochester Hills, Michigan, USA
I feel really proud reading this. It is not a small victory. It goes a long way to help upholding freedom and to keep our government honest and free of corruption. It shows what one person can do with patience, respect and persistence. Thank you, lapeer20m.
 
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