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Thread: OC, SPECIFICALLY in South KC

  1. #1
    Regular Member SylntSleepr's Avatar
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    OC, SPECIFICALLY in South KC

    Hi,
    I live in Grandview and am curious if anyone has info regarding where is OK to OC out that way. I am VERY new to OCing, picked up my firearm 21 July so new, and would really like to know more or where I can find up to date info. I have searched specifically for info in Grandview and Belton and have had not much luck thus far. Thanks for anything anyone might be able to provide! - SylntSleepr





    "I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery." Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Here ya go.
    Sec. 17-41. - Unlawful use of weapons.

    (a) A person commits the ordinance violation of unlawful use of weapons if he or she knowingly:

    (1) Carries concealed upon or about his or her person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use;

    (2) Sets a spring gun;

    (3) Discharges or shoots a firearm into a dwelling house, a railroad train, boat, aircraft, or motor vehicle as defined in Section 302.010, RSMo, or any building or structure used for the assembling of people;

    (4) Exhibits, in the presence of one (1) or more persons, any weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner;

    (5) Possesses or discharges a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated;

    (6) Discharges a firearm within one hundred (100) yards of any occupied schoolhouse, courthouse, or church building;

    (7) Discharges or shoots a firearm at a mark, at any object, or at random, on, along or across a public highway or discharges or shoots a firearm into any outbuilding;

    (8) Carries a firearm or other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the federal government, state government, or political subdivision thereof;

    (9) Discharges or shoots a firearm at or from a motor vehicle, as defined in Section 301.010, RSMo, while within the city, or discharges or shoots a firearm at any person, or at any other motor vehicle, or at any building or habitable structure, unless the person was lawfully acting in self-defense;

    (10) Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.


    (b) Subsections (a)(1), (3), (4), (6), (7), (8), (9), and (10) of this section shall not apply to or affect any of the following:

    (1) All state, county and municipal law enforcement officers who have completed the training required by the police officers standards and training commission pursuant to Sections 590.030 to 590.050, RSMo, and possessing the duty and power of arrest for violation of the general criminal laws of the state or for violation of ordinances of counties or municipalities of the state, whether such officers are on or off duty, and whether such officers are within or outside of the law enforcement agency's jurisdiction, or any person summoned by such officers to assist in making arrest or preserving the peace while actually engaged in assisting such officer;

    (2) Wardens, superintendents and keepers of prisons, penitentiaries, jails and other institutions for the detention of persons accused or convicted of crime;

    (3) Members of the armed forces or National Guard while performing their official duties;

    (4) Those persons vested by Article V, Section 1, of the constitution of the state with the judicial power of the state and those persons vested by Article III of the Constitution of the United States with the judicial power of the United States, the members of the federal judiciary; or

    (5) Any person whose bona fide duty is to execute process, civil or criminal;

    (6) Any federal probation officer;

    (7) Any state probation or parole officer, including supervisors and members of the board of probation and parole;

    (8) Any corporate security advisory meeting the definition and fulfilling the requirements of the regulations established by the board of police commissioners under section 84.340, RSMo.

    (9) Any coroner, deputy coroner, medical examiner, or assistant medical examiner.


    (c) Subsections (a)(1), (5), (8) and (10) of this section do not apply when the actor is transporting such weapons in a nonfunctioning state or in an unloaded state properly cased when ammunition is not readily accessible or when such weapons are not readily accessible. Subsection (a)(1) of this section does not apply to any person twenty-one (21) years of age or older transporting a concealable firearm in the passenger compartment of a motor vehicle so long as such concealable firearm is otherwise lawfully possessed, nor when the actor is also in possession of an exposed firearm or projectile weapon for the lawful pursuit of game, or is in his dwelling unit or upon business premises over which the actor has possession, authority or control, or is traveling in a continuous journey peaceable through this state. Subsection (a)(10) of this section does not apply if the firearm is otherwise lawfully possessed by a person while traversing school premises for the purposes of transporting a student to or from school, or possessed by an adult for the purposes of facilitation of a school-sanctioned firearm-related event.


    (d) Subsections (a)(1), (8), and (10) shall not apply to any person who has a valid concealed carry endorsement issued pursuant to Sections 571.101 to 571.121 RSMo, or a valid permit or endorsement to carry concealed firearms issued by another state or political subdivision of another state.


    (e) Subsections (a)(3), (4), (5), (6), (7), (8), (9), and (10) shall not apply to persons who are engaged in a lawful act of defense pursuant to Section 563.031, RSMo.


    (f) Nothing in this section shall make it unlawful for a student to actually participate in school-sanctioned gun safety courses, student military or ROTC courses, or other school-sponsored firearm-related events, provided the student does not carry a firearm or other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.


    http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=10089
    The bold above seems to indicate that OC is verboten even with a endorsement.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    (e) Subsections (a)(3), (4), (5), (6), (7), (8), (9), and (10) shall not apply to persons who are engaged in a lawful act of defense pursuant to Section 563.031, RSMo.
    What about 563.041? Defend you and yours but not your stuff.....folks down that way need to make a few phone calls at a minimum.

    http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/c563.htm
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member SylntSleepr's Avatar
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    Thank you very much. I will delve deeper and see what else I can come up with. Seems like a play on words so a phone call WILL be made. That line in bold above reads 'Exhibits....., in an angry or threatening manner.' So if my firearm is holstered, I should be OK, is this correct? Thanks again!
    Last edited by SylntSleepr; 07-23-2012 at 12:34 PM.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    The logical, rational, thinking individual would draw that conclusion. Unfortunately you, as the lawfully OCing citizen do not always get to define in a angry or threatening manner for our fellow citizens. It is our fellow citizens and their perspective, related to LE, that will prompt the type of LE response to you. Fortunately most LEAs have their officers up to speed on OC whether it is lawful or unlawful. I would not talk to a cop though. Talk to a lawyer, that is the fella that will keep you out of the Big House.

    Good luck.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  6. #6
    Regular Member SylntSleepr's Avatar
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    OK, so I have compared the Ordinances written for Grandview, Belton, and Raymore to those written for Lees Summit. I know it is very common for folks to OC in LS and is why I chose it for comparison. They read exactly the same

    Lees Summit; Sec. 17-162. - Unlawful use of weapons; exceptions.

    A.
    A person commits the offense of unlawful use of weapons if he knowingly:
    1.
    Carries concealed upon or about his person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use; or
    2.
    Sets a spring gun; or
    3.
    Discharges or shoots a firearm into a dwelling house, a railroad train, boat, aircraft, or motor vehicle as defined in Section 302.010, RSMo, or any building or structure used for the assembling of people; or
    4.
    Exhibits in the presence of one (1) or more persons, any weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner; or
    5.
    Possesses a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated; or
    6.
    Discharges a firearm within one hundred yards of any occupied schoolhouse, courthouse, or church building; or
    7.
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at a mark, at any object, or at random, on, along or across a public highway or discharges or shoots a firearm into any outbuilding; or
    8.
    Carries a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the Federal government, State government, or political subdivision thereof; or
    9.
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at or from a motor vehicle, as defined in Section 301.010, RSMo, discharges or shoots a firearm at any person, or at any other motor vehicle, or at any building or habitable structure, unless the person was lawfully acting in self-defense; or
    10.
    Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.

    Grandview; Sec. 17-41. - Unlawful use of weapons.

    (a)
    A person commits the ordinance violation of unlawful use of weapons if he or she knowingly:
    (1)
    Carries concealed upon or about his or her person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use;
    (2)
    Sets a spring gun;
    (3)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm into a dwelling house, a railroad train, boat, aircraft, or motor vehicle as defined in Section 302.010, RSMo, or any building or structure used for the assembling of people;
    (4)
    Exhibits, in the presence of one (1) or more persons, any weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner;
    (5)
    Possesses or discharges a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated;
    (6)
    Discharges a firearm within one hundred (100) yards of any occupied schoolhouse, courthouse, or church building;
    (7)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at a mark, at any object, or at random, on, along or across a public highway or discharges or shoots a firearm into any outbuilding;
    (8)
    Carries a firearm or other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the federal government, state government, or political subdivision thereof;
    (9)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at or from a motor vehicle, as defined in Section 301.010, RSMo, while within the city, or discharges or shoots a firearm at any person, or at any other motor vehicle, or at any building or habitable structure, unless the person was lawfully acting in self-defense;
    (10)
    Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.

    Belton; Sec. 15-108. - Unlawful use of weapons; exceptions generally.

    (a)
    A person commits the offense of unlawful use of weapons if he or she knowingly:
    (1)
    Carries concealed upon or about his or her person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use;
    (2)
    Sets a spring gun;
    (3)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm into a dwelling house, a railroad train, boat, aircraft, or motor vehicle, as defined in RSMo 302.010, or any building or structure used for the assembling of people;
    (4)
    Exhibits in the presence of one or more persons any weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner;
    (5)
    Possesses a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated;
    (6)
    Discharges a firearm within 100 yards of any occupied schoolhouse, courthouse, or church building;
    (7)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at a mark, at any object, or at random, on, along or across a public highway or discharges or shoots a firearm into any outbuilding;
    (8)
    Carries a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the federal government, state government, or political subdivision thereof;
    (9)
    Discharges or shoots a firearm at or from a motor vehicle, as defined in RSMo 301.010, discharges or shoots a firearm at any person, or at any other motor vehicle, or at any building or habitable structure, unless the person is lawfully acting in self-defense; or
    (10)
    Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.


    Raymore; SECTION 210.330: - WEAPONS CARRYING CONCEALED OTHER UNLAWFUL USE

    A.
    A person commits the offense of unlawful use of weapons if he/she knowingly:
    1.
    Carries concealed upon or about his/her person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use;
    2.
    Discharges or shoots a firearm within the City limits;
    3.
    Possesses a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated;
    4.
    Exhibits, in the presence of one (1) or more persons a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner; or
    5.
    Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.


    So, from what I gather, if it is legal to OC in Lees Summit as reflected by many OCers and the Ordinance itself, then South KC should be good to go based on the EXACT wording in like Ordinances.
    If this information is incorrect, please set me straight. Thanks to all who reply.

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    I live in Raymore and haven't OD'd anywhere out here really..I just CC.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RSKtakR View Post
    I live in Raymore and haven't OD'd anywhere out here really..I just CC.
    Hopefully you don't OD anywhere. That is a bad way to go.

    Sorry just had to say it
    Last edited by NG19; 07-26-2012 at 01:42 PM.

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    Regular Member SylntSleepr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RSKtakR View Post
    I live in Raymore and haven't OD'd anywhere out here really..I just CC.
    Is there any particular reason why you haven't? It is legal according to the city's Ordinance in Belton and Raymore. It's not like you'd REALLY be 'takn a rsk' doing so

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    Regular Member HighFlyingA380's Avatar
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    Don't listen to OC for ME. The first post with the bold line prohibits displaying it in a threatening manner. That is not the same as OCing, since you would be threatening. I don't know specifically the areas you're in, but I know for a fact that Lee's Summit is OC legal. So if your areas' laws read the same, then it's legal. Just get information from people who actually know what their talking about, meaning those from the area.

    In the laws that the OP quoted, the key line is (a)(1). It only states is is illegal to carry concealed, without the state permit. If open carry were illegal, it would read something like, "(1)Carries concealed or openly upon themselves..." Again, line (4) would only pertain to you if you take it out of your holster and wave it around in anger, except in a self-defense situation.

    Remember, IANAL (I Am Not A Lawyer) and you are responsible for ensuring you conduct yourself legally.
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  11. #11
    Regular Member SylntSleepr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HighFlyingA380 View Post
    Don't listen to OC for ME. The first post with the bold line prohibits displaying it in a threatening manner. That is not the same as OCing, since you would be threatening. I don't know specifically the areas you're in, but I know for a fact that Lee's Summit is OC legal. So if your areas' laws read the same, then it's legal. Just get information from people who actually know what their talking about, meaning those from the area.

    In the laws that the OP quoted, the key line is (a)(1). It only states is is illegal to carry concealed, without the state permit. If open carry were illegal, it would read something like, "(1)Carries concealed or openly upon themselves..." Again, line (4) would only pertain to you if you take it out of your holster and wave it around in anger, except in a self-defense situation.

    Remember, IANAL (I Am Not A Lawyer) and you are responsible for ensuring you conduct yourself legally.


    My point was exactly that. The emphasis was on a4 because in each city the ordinance states "in a threatening manner", nothing about OCing or having a holstered firearm. Therefore, to me means OC is legal. Maybe I should have worded it your way
    Last edited by SylntSleepr; 07-27-2012 at 08:52 AM.

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    O.C. Being Legal in Missouri

    Well, the consensus being that O.C. is legal in Kansas City, Missouri only because there aren't any city ordinances banning it, and the State Law while not being specific on O.C. It doesn't endorse it, then again there's nothing against it either. So, in the meantime, O.C. is legal in Missouri..supposedly.
    Last edited by SixGunCowboy; 08-04-2012 at 03:05 PM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member HighFlyingA380's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixGunCowboy View Post
    Well, the consensus being that O.C. is legal in Kansas City, Missouri only because there aren't any city ordinances banning it, and the State Law while not being specific on O.C. It doesn't endorse it, then again there's nothing against it either. So, in the meantime, O.C. is legal in Missouri..supposedly.
    Not sure why you're saying it's "supposedly" legal... It's not up for debate; it's legal. The issue is that it's not preempted, so you have to look at local laws, as they have the authority to regulate it.
    The United States Constitution 1791. All Rights Reserved.
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