Alright this is a question that I have been trying to solve for quite a while. I am 16 years old, and live in Arizona. I have been shooting since I was 10 and I have had a passion for guns since I was 6. I have gone to the Scottsdale Gun Club and received proper training by staff on hand and learned and memorized every single firearm safety rule in existence. My dad still doesn't understand how it is possible for such a young mind to know so much about the subject of guns but he is a proud father. In the recent events that have been going on my family has been very concerned with the safety of everyone in the family. They want from now on everyone to always be carrying including me (besides at school of coarse). I have an 1851 Navy .44 revolver (yes we all know that they were actually on produced as .36 navies not .44) that I bought with my own money only my dad of coarse had to actually make the purchase himself. So my question is can an unaccompanied minor with an "antique firearm" open carry? Thank you to all answers.
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Unaccompanied Minor open carrying a black powder revolver?
- Thread starter amorse1
- Start date
Maine Expat
Regular Member
You'll have to check with applicable AZ law.
In Maine there is no minimum OC age Statute, oddly enough. Its 18 to get a CCP.
I'm sure some folks will chime in soon, but you can get a jump on the thing by checking the Arizona board and looking through the Law thread there.
In Maine there is no minimum OC age Statute, oddly enough. Its 18 to get a CCP.
I'm sure some folks will chime in soon, but you can get a jump on the thing by checking the Arizona board and looking through the Law thread there.
Dang I wish I lived in Maine haha! If only if only........ From what I have read from my research antique firearms are exempt from the law but then other places say they are treated as regular firearms. Also I am looking for the law in AZ not other states because they do not apply to me in this situation. Not meaning to be rude at all, I am just interested in AZ law at this moment but information on laws in other states will be very helpful in future reference.
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Nascar24Glock
Regular Member
Short answer = 21
but....................(see exceptions, definitions, et al. Wanna be a test case? Could happen
http://www.opencarry.org/wa.html
9.36.010 Weapons and dangerous exhibitions.
A. It is unlawful for any person to carry, exhibit, display or draw any firearm, dagger, sword, knife or other cutting or stabbing instrument, club or weapon apparently capable of producing bodily harm, in a manner, under circumstances, at a time that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons, unless [highlight]otherwise authorized by law.[/highlight]
IMHO - you would need a specific exemption authorizing a minor to carry in public......I find none.
Note: Moved this to the Arizona sub-forum
Suggest you contact a good firearms attorney in your state - initial consultation is normally w/o charge.
Note what I underlined. Everything you just listed is prohibited IF the person is carrying "in a manner, under circumstances, at a time that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons." To me, this sounds like Vermont's law, which makes it illegal for anyone to carry a firearm "with the intent or avowed purpose of injuring a fellow man." If just open carrying counted as intimidation, then I would think it's illegal all-around for anyone of any age.
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. None of the above is, or should be construed as, legal advice.
Nascar beat me to it. I don't know if there are other laws, but the one cited by Grapeshot does not seem to be one against it. I didn't even see a reference to age in it. It also appeared to me that Grapeshot was saying you must be 21 to open carry in AZ. Please correct me if I misread you, Grapeshot.
I am an AZ property owner, but a NV resident. I only know the AZ laws that affect me, so I cannot answer the OP with any certainty, but I was definitely under the impression that you could OC a real sidearm at at least as young as 18.
EDIT @ Grapeshot: Your link was for WA laws. Was your quoted law from WA or AZ?
I am an AZ property owner, but a NV resident. I only know the AZ laws that affect me, so I cannot answer the OP with any certainty, but I was definitely under the impression that you could OC a real sidearm at at least as young as 18.
EDIT @ Grapeshot: Your link was for WA laws. Was your quoted law from WA or AZ?
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Glock9mmOldStyle
Campaign Veteran
Everyone makes mistakes & the young man caught grapesnots. So no harm no foul. Maybe one of the experts from AzCDL can offer a answer? Fred, Rebel ....
Thanks in advance.
Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both!
Thanks in advance.
Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both!
Completely blew that one - my bad.
The law quoted was incorrectly for WA. Followed a long winding path and missed a turn somewhere.
I'll back off and wait for AzCDL people to respond.
Glock9mmOldStyle
Campaign Veteran
Speaking of mistakes - sorry grapeshot - not grapesnot - man this getting old thing sucks ...cannot make my old fingers work the tiny tiny keyboard on my tablet very well
Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both!
Giving up civil rights for security is a certain way to lose both!
WalkingWolf
Regular Member
If the laws in AZ allow it, considering your age, it might not be a bad idea to keep copies of the gun laws on your person. So when a LEO does stop you can show him there is nothing in the law that forbids carry at your age. Don't forget your recorder.
Speaking of mistakes - sorry grapeshot - not grapesnot - man this getting old thing sucks ...cannot make my old fingers work the tiny tiny keyboard on my tablet very well
--snip--
No offense taken. The old saw about you can call be anything as long as you call me to dinner still applies :lol:
Thanks everyone for all the answers (event though my question is still unasnwered haha )
What's funny is I actually do carry around in my wallet all of the gun laws on sticky notes but I still need to find the law gives me permission to my question stated in the beginning.
) What's funny is I actually do carry around in my wallet all of the gun laws on sticky notes but I still need to find the law gives me permission to my question stated in the beginning.
Nascar24Glock
Regular Member
Thanks everyone for all the answers (event though my question is still unasnwered haha
What's funny is I actually do carry around in my wallet all of the gun laws on sticky notes but I still need to find the law gives me permission to my question stated in the beginning.
I won't have time to research this tonight. But, I do want to take a couple of minutes to correct a small misconception. You do NOT need to look for a law that gives you permission to carry. You need only look for one that makes it illegal. If there is none, then it is legal by default.
I will note that, with certain exceptions (such as using the firearm in certain activities with parental permission), Federal law prohibts "firearm" possession by those under 18. However, as I understand it, "firearm" at the Federal level excludes pre-1898 weapons (that's why felons can, as I understand it, legally own black powder muskets if the state is ok with it). You need to check to see if Arizona does the same thing. If you see an AZ law that says "no firearm/handgun possession by those under 18" (or similar), check the definitions of "firearm" and "handgun" to see if they are all-encompasing or if pre-1898 "antique" weapons are excluded.
Now, I will note that AZ requires you to be 21 to carry concealed. So, whether it's legal to carry now or whether you have to wait until you're 18, don't conceal until you're 21.
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. None of the above is, or should be construed as, legal advice.
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Alright so here's what I found,
Under AZ law
ANTIQUES/REPLICAS
Arizona statutes are silent on antique and replica firearms
except that firearms in a permanently inoperable condition are
not included within the definition of firearms and are therefore
exempt for the weapon laws of Arizona. All other categories of
antique or replica firearms are treated as ordinary firearms for
possession and carrying purposes.
So from what I get from that it is legal for me to carry an antique revolver because under ATF law the model was done before 1898 and it uses "obsolete" ammo.
Under AZ law
ANTIQUES/REPLICAS
Arizona statutes are silent on antique and replica firearms
except that firearms in a permanently inoperable condition are
not included within the definition of firearms and are therefore
exempt for the weapon laws of Arizona. All other categories of
antique or replica firearms are treated as ordinary firearms for
possession and carrying purposes.
So from what I get from that it is legal for me to carry an antique revolver because under ATF law the model was done before 1898 and it uses "obsolete" ammo.
Surely you are not suggesting carrying an "permanently inoperable" replica - BTW cite needed.
Question still remains - do you want to be a test case? Are there enough discretionary funds available to buck what will likely prove to be an unpopular cause? Consider that you could loose you RKBA permanently if worst case rule applies.
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Of coarse I was not implying carrying an inoperable firearm there would be no use to that whatsoever and in fact is a silly thought in my opinion. But right before that it says EXCEPT THAT of....... so I concluded that inoperable firearms aren't even considered antiques and are just for collectors. Sorry if I misunderstood. The thing is if the law DOES permit it I WOULD carry. But only under the law. So why would my right to carry ever be taken away if it was legal (not trying to be confrontational at all). This is exactly why I would carry the law itself in my wallet. I have met a lot of LEO's here in AZ and they all respect someone who can not only cite the law in which it makes them legal to do something but also show them and what they are doing the respect in which it deserves.
WalkingWolf
Regular Member
Another question because I do not know AZ laws. If you do get arrested, considering it is just a misdemeanor would you go to juvenile court, or adult court? And would your record be cleared at 18?
The reason I ask is that judges in family court can adjudicate on what they believe is in your best interest, and that is not always in your best interest.
Thanks for the information, I know that isn't legal information, but it does give me some advice on different ways to go about researching certain laws. I also didn't know that if something wasn't illegal then it is legal by default, gosh you gotta love America! :banana: Also I would never carry conceal until 21, like I said stay within the boundaries of the law.
Well it looks like I will have to wait till I'm 18....
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/03101.htm
4."Firearm" means any loaded or unloaded handgun, pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun or other weapon that will expel, is designed to expel or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive. Firearm does not include a firearm in permanently inoperable condition.
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/03111.htm
Thanks everyone for the replies, but I guess two more years is what I am going to have to wait till, at least then I can carry instead the 1911 my dad and I always ooh and aww over every time we pass by it in the local gun shop. :banghead:
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/03101.htm
4."Firearm" means any loaded or unloaded handgun, pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun or other weapon that will expel, is designed to expel or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive. Firearm does not include a firearm in permanently inoperable condition.
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/03111.htm
Thanks everyone for the replies, but I guess two more years is what I am going to have to wait till, at least then I can carry instead the 1911 my dad and I always ooh and aww over every time we pass by it in the local gun shop. :banghead:
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WalkingWolf
Regular Member
Check your states knife laws there is no reason to be completely unarmed.