Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Help me understand this

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    59

    Help me understand this

    I've been reading a lot about local laws and past cases.

    I stumbled upon this


    Now, If I understand this correctly, Denver has single handedly taken away my (imaginary) friends (from Utah, say) 2A rights. He cannot open carry, he cannot CC as a legal CCW permit holder of Utah, exercising the reciprocity Colorado and Utah share.

    Is this correct? Is the author of that letter in need of some education on this matter? I know I do, that's why I'm asking.

    Or this this old news that has been addressed/ reversed somewhere?

    Discuss.............

    Mike
    Last edited by Shadetreezj; 07-27-2012 at 01:34 PM.

  2. #2
    Regular Member PikesPeakMtnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    426
    Colorado recognizes resident permits from states who recognize our permits. Any non-resident permit is not valid in CO. http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellite.../1251622200175...CBI's reciprocity page
    One day your life is going to flash before your eyes, make it worth watching.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Posts
    12
    TITLE 18. CRIMINAL CODE
    ARTICLE 12. OFFENSES RELATING TO FIREARMS AND WEAPONS
    PART 2. PERMITS TO CARRY CONCEALED HANDGUNS

    C.R.S. 18-12-213 (2011)

    18-12-213. Reciprocity



    (1) A permit to carry a concealed handgun or a concealed weapon that is issued by a state that recognizes the validity of permits issued pursuant to this part 2 shall be valid in this state in all respects as a permit issued pursuant to this part 2 if the permit is issued to a person who is:


    (a) Twenty-one years of age or older; and

    (b) (I) A resident of the state that issued the permit, as demonstrated by the address stated on a valid picture identification that is issued by the state that issued the permit and is carried by the permit holder; or

    (II) A resident of Colorado for no more than ninety days, as determined by the date of issuance on a valid picture identification issued by Colorado and carried by the permit holder.

    (2) For purposes of this section, a "valid picture identification" means a driver's license or a state identification issued in lieu of a driver's license.
    I remember reading that each sheriff could determine reciporcity for their own county... But I can't find that at the moment.


    As I read the above statute, any CCW, CHP, CHL, etc issued by a state that recognizes our CHP shall be as valid as our Colorado permit. Provided that, two conditions are met: the individual be 21 years or older AND be a resident of the state that issued the CCW, CHP, CHL or whatever.

    IANAL

  4. #4
    Campaign Veteran
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    59
    So, is that just a blaring mis-worded letter written by Denver?

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Posts
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadetreezj View Post
    So, is that just a blaring mis-worded letter written by Denver?
    I'm still looking around for that older reference about sheriffs determine reciprocity but I did find this on Denver's CWP website. The permit information package found on that page has an out dated PDF from our CCW days. But the information at the top of 17 is still valid and is, exactly what I referenced. See for yourself: http://www.denvergov.org/Portals/720...infopacket.pdf

    Oh.....

    Wow.... I just looked at the date from that letter. That letter is 12 years old. It is no longer valid.

  6. #6
    Regular Member M-Taliesin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Aurora, Colorado
    Posts
    1,504
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadetreezj View Post
    Now, If I understand this correctly, Denver has single handedly taken away my (imaginary) friends (from Utah, say) 2A rights. He cannot open carry, he cannot CC as a legal CCW permit holder of Utah, exercising the reciprocity Colorado and Utah share.
    Mike
    Howdy Amigo!
    It is the basis of a case now pending a decision in the courts:
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...Appeals-Thread

    That is precisely why the city/county of Denver is facing what (we hope) will be a trouncing in the 10th!
    We've been waiting for that decision to come down from 'on high' for quite awhile, and it is months overdue.
    The belief is that the 10th circuit is holding to see what the 7th does in Illinois.

    But yeah... if the 7th rules against Illinois, it will settle the problem for Denver, and they'll end up with a huge problem in Colorado.

    Still, I think the 10th ought to give a verdict. Maybe the 7th is waiting on them. If both courts wait for one another, we're more apt to see another ice age come and go before the matter is settled!

    Blessings,
    M-Taliesin

  7. #7
    Campaign Veteran
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    59
    Wow! That's was a long read.

    Another example of multi headed government entities weaving a tangled web of authorities. Never really knowing what the other department is doing, and needing a lot of courts time to unravel the mess down to a basic decision.

    Interesting to learn that CCW is not a 2a consideration.

  8. #8
    Regular Member JamesB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Lakewood, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    703
    Yes, this is a twelve year old letter. It is real, just old. That date also puts it back before '03 when our CCW preemption went it, and we became a 'shall issue' state.

    This continued to be the policy of the Denver PD untill about '06 and that policy subjected them to several lawsuits as well.

    For the last five or six years they have actually decided to follow the law as much as I can figure. Does not mean they want to, but they have been.

  9. #9
    Regular Member M-Taliesin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Aurora, Colorado
    Posts
    1,504
    Quote Originally Posted by JamesB View Post
    This continued to be the policy of the Denver PD untill about '06 and that policy subjected them to several lawsuits as well.

    For the last five or six years they have actually decided to follow the law as much as I can figure. Does not mean they want to, but they have been.
    Howdy Pardner!
    Whichever court hands down a ruling, whether it be the 10th circuit or the 7th, the handwriting is on the wall. I believe the courts will come down on the side of the Constitution, and Denver's OC ban will be busted. Same with Illinois. Their ban on carry simply isn't constitutional, and I'd think after Heller, they'd have figured things out and moved on to provide citizens with the respect they serve for the rights guaranteed by the 2nd amendment.

    That is one reason people are so anxious for the courts to move on this. How much longer will people be denied their rights under the Constitution? How much longer will the people of Illinois not have the same rights as Americans across this nation enjoy? How long will the people of Illinois be subjected to tyrannical discrimination against their citizens?

    I believe the courts will knock down the kangaroo limitations on 2a in Denver or the entire state of Illinois. The handwriting has been on the wall since Heller. The cops know it in Denver, and may explain why they don't much bother people who dare OC in their jurisdiction. I've done so myself, but I've always been on private property. I once visited a Bellco on the wrong side of the street, which was Denver's territory. They had a Denver cop sitting in the lobby at a desk evidently as bank security guard type of deal. He didn't like that I was OC, but he wasn't working for the City of Denver, he was working for the bank at the time. And since I was on bank property (private) his authority was limited. Since the bank had no problems with my OC, he really had no authority to act because he was working for the bank!

    I've carried open in Denver territory, but always on private property, and no private property owner has ever evidenced a problem with my OC'ing at their locations.

    Even if a DPD officer was sitting in the parking lot in his car, he really couldn't do much about it. After all, he cannot write a ticket to somebody in that parking lot either, unless contacted by the property owner to do so.

    Blessings,
    M-Taliesin

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •