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Thread: Open carry still legal with CCW permit?

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    Open carry still legal with CCW permit?

    Hi all, I have a west virginia CCW permit. West Virginia is an open carry state. My question is, does having the CCW permit cause me to waive my right to open carry or do I now have the option to choose my method? If I am OC could I be accused of improper concealment?

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    Regular Member Fuller Malarkey's Avatar
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    I recently posted this in the West By God state forum. Hope it helps.

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...=1#post1801794

    Lots of local information and support from other carry folks here:

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/fo...-West-Virginia
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    Thank you, but I did not see a an answer to my specific question

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cten85 View Post
    Thank you, but I did not see a an answer to my specific question
    I believe the polite way to answer your plaint is to remind you that laws only prohibit - they do not grant permissions. If you do not see anything in the laws regarding concealed carry that says once you have a CCW permit you may no longer OC then you may safely presume that you can in fact OC even if you hold a CCW permit. Just to be sure you can research the laws that govern OC to see if there is one that says once you have a CCW permit you cannot OC. Again, if it is not there you can safely presume you can in fact OC even if you hold a CCW permit. (I know - the problem is that WV does not have laws about OC, so how can you look them up?)

    This is probably as close to a "Yes, you can OC even if you have a CCW permit" as you are likely to get while not putting the author (me or anybody else who tells you that) in jeopardy. It puts the responsibility on you to perform due diligence and then determine your course of action without coersion.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Like I told Deputy chief Flo Simmon when she tried to tell me because I have a CPL I must conceal or leave it in my vehicle......." If I have a driver's license does that mean I can't walk anymore?"
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    Bingo!
    The license is license to perform an action, in this case to carry concealed, it does not automatically invalidate any other permitted/licensed action.

    If you have a driving license, does that mean you can't bike, swim, walk, skate, skip, crawl, or fly?
    Last edited by Fallschirmjäger; 08-16-2012 at 09:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cten85 View Post
    Hi all, I have a west virginia CCW permit. West Virginia is an open carry state. My question is, does having the CCW permit cause me to waive my right to open carry or do I now have the option to choose my method? If I am OC could I be accused of improper concealment?
    It may vary from county to county, I recall a post a while back that cabel county sherrif took issue with it, saying just that, if you have CC permit, no open carry.

    I have had my CC permit for almost 2 years now, but have not directly asked that question of the local sherrif, I CC anyway, due to work issues.

    If you find anything pertianing to this, I also would like to know...
    Greg

    Semper Paratus -- latin, Always Prepaired

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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    God, I hope not. I've crawled out of a couple of Navy Officer's clubs a couple of times in different locations....
    Oh, those were the good times!
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    NO you do not waive your right to open carry when you get your CC
    I am not a gun nut, nor am I a nut with a gun
    I simply rufuse to be a helpless victim, I may be unable to stop myself from being a victim but at least I wont be helpless

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    I asked a deputy sheriff this question just last week at a gun shop during the mad rush for AR's. He told me you forfeit your right to OC once you obtain a CCW permit. He demonstrated to me (he was off duty and in plain clothes) with his sidearm and a sweater covering it that if it becomes exposed, in the eyes of the law that would be considered brandishing. I disagreed with his statement and went about my business. A few days later I asked a chief of police from another town and his reply was you can still legally OC even though you have a CCW.
    After reading quite a few posts on here I tend to believe the chief of police. It does not make sense that you give up one right just because you obtain another. I will OC my weapon now. I'm sure somewhere down the line I will be harassed for it, but after finding this site and reading the informative posts I will be better prepared for the situation when it arises.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    If someone harasses you, feel free to harass them right back. I don't know why, but for some reason I equate deputies as being more professional than the average officer. But that deputy sheriff should probably stick to giving advice about traffic regulations and what the menu is at the local jail.

  12. #12
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    first off, quit calling it a CCW. SKIDMARK you should know better

    second; never, never, never, ask a LEO about the law ask a competent lawyer, DA, Judge or AG


    now to the question. the WV CHP, allows you to conceal your handgun, if you want to. they are right when they pointed out that a drivers license doesn't mean you can't walk anymore.
    the rule of the land is that OC is legal. concealing is illegal unless you have a permission slip from you gov.

    now if any body tells you different, then ask for the law that says you must conceal if you have a permission slip. if there is i would like to know it too
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
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    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  13. #13
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IcarryXDS
    if it becomes exposed, in the eyes of the law that would be considered brandishing.

    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/brandish
    1) to shake or wave (as a weapon) menacingly
    2) to exhibit in an ostentatious or aggressive manner
    [I guess BBQ guns are out, as are cowboy action getups.]

    Here's the WV code about brandishing (I'm a little surprised there is one):
    http://www.legis.state.wv.us/legisdo...2011%20%20.htm
    (Or you can use the search box here: http://www.legis.state.wv.us/WvCoDe/Code.cfm)

    §61-7-11. Brandishing deadly weapons; threatening or causing breach of the peace; criminal penalties.
    It shall be unlawful for any person armed with a firearm or other deadly weapon, whether licensed to carry the same or not, to carry, brandish or use such weapon in a way or manner to cause, or threaten, a breach of the peace.
    Any person violating this section shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and, upon conviction thereof, shall be fined not less than fifty nor more than one thousand dollars, or shall be confined in the county jail not less than ninety days nor more than one year, or both.

    Use the search box again on "breach of peace", & you'll find reference to riot & shoplifting.
    There are plenty of videos on YouTube showing OC get-togethers, shopping trips, etc. where Absolutely Nothing Happens. Would be great to show in court to demonstrate that OC is not a breach of peace.

    Quote Originally Posted by papa bear
    first off, quit calling it a CCW.
    +1. CCW is a crime. Having a license is a defense to persecution.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dieselcrawler
    I have had my CC permit for almost 2 years now, but have not directly asked that question of the local sherrif, I CC anyway, due to work issues.
    second; never, never, never, ask a LEO about the law. Ask a competent lawyer, DA, Judge or AG
    +1.

    if any body tells you different, then ask for the law that says you must conceal if you have a permission slip.
    Bingo.
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