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WA: When am I required to provide ID / name / age / address, etc?

slapmonkay

slapmonkay

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NavyLCDR said:
You provide ID in a traffic stop in order to comply with the Revised Code of Washington:

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.020

RCW 46.61.020
Refusal to give information to or cooperate with officer — Penalty.

(1) It is unlawful for any person while operating or in charge of any vehicle to refuse when requested by a police officer to give his or her name and address and the name and address of the owner of such vehicle, or for such person to give a false name and address, and it is likewise unlawful for any such person to refuse or neglect to stop when signaled to stop by any police officer or to refuse upon demand of such police officer to produce his or her certificate of license registration of such vehicle, his or her insurance identification card, or his or her vehicle driver's license or to refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof or to refuse to permit the examination of any equipment of such vehicle or the weighing of such vehicle or to refuse or neglect to produce the certificate of license registration of such vehicle, insurance card, or his or her vehicle driver's license when requested by any court. Any police officer shall on request produce evidence of his or her authorization as such.

(2) A violation of this section is a misdemeanor.
Click to expand...

Actually, I think RCW 46.61.020 only applies when the officer or agent has authority of the court and is more broad then RCW 46.61.021 which is the RCW which requires you to identify yourself when operating a vehicle and your pulled over for a traffic infraction.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.021
 
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slapmonkay

slapmonkay

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NavyLCDR said:
I'm afraid you are mistaken. Notice that producing driver's license is mentioned twice in the statute. The first time is your requirement to show it to a cop. The second time is your requirement to show it to a court.

(1) It is unlawful for any person while operating or in charge of any vehicle to refuse when requested by a police officer to give his or her name and address and the name and address of the owner of such vehicle, or for such person to give a false name and address, and it is likewise unlawful for any such person to refuse or neglect to stop when signaled to stop by any police officer or to refuse upon demand of such police officer to produce his or her certificate of license registration of such vehicle, his or her insurance identification card, or his or her vehicle driver's license or to refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof or to refuse to permit the examination of any equipment of such vehicle or the weighing of such vehicle or to refuse or neglect to produce the certificate of license registration of such vehicle, insurance card, or his or her vehicle driver's license when requested by any court. Any police officer shall on request produce evidence of his or her authorization as such.
Click to expand...

Your right. Sorry for any confusion.

Either way, under both 020 and 021 you are:
a) Required to stop when signaled
b) Required to identify yourself when requested
 
hermannr

hermannr

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Citizen said:
Wait a second. You provide ID in a traffic stop because the cop has PC prior to the stop? Or, you provide a license during a traffic stop because you are engaged in a licensed activity and the state requires display of the license?
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An officer MUST have a ticketable REASON to stop you when you are driving a vehicle...there are no random stops for license checks in WA. That is why you are required to provide ID at a traffic stop, there has been an infraction/crime. There are even things like seatbelts that they can ticket you for if they stop you, but they cannot stop you to check if you have your seat belt on...like with my old 73 Pickup...it only has lap belts...you cannot observe from outside whether the occupant has it on or not, but they cannot stop you to check.
 
C

Citizen

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hermannr said:
An officer MUST have a ticketable REASON to stop you when you are driving a vehicle...there are no random stops for license checks in WA. That is why you are required to provide ID at a traffic stop, there has been an infraction/crime. There are even things like seatbelts that they can ticket you for if they stop you, but they cannot stop you to check if you have your seat belt on...like with my old 73 Pickup...it only has lap belts...you cannot observe from outside whether the occupant has it on or not, but they cannot stop you to check.
Click to expand...

Thanks guys. My point here was not RAS or PC, but whether one was providing identity or proof of licensing for a licensed activity.

It seems the WA statute covers both scenarios. Which, if you think about it, makes sense. If the traffic-stopee forgot his wallet, it might be handy (from a government point of view) to compel him to give his name and address. Also, avoids the whole issue of probable cause for a search for a license in case he lies and says he forgot his license when it was actually suspended.
 
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hermannr

hermannr

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Citizen said:
Thanks guys. My point here was not RAS or PC, but whether one was providing identity or proof of licensing for a licensed activity.

It seems the WA statute covers both scenarios. Which, if you think about it, makes sense. If the traffic-stopee forgot his wallet, it might be handy (from a government point of view) to compel him to give his name and address. Also, avoids the whole issue of probable cause for a search for a license in case he lies and says he forgot his license when it was actually suspended.
Click to expand...

There was a case in which the person did have her license suspended, did have contraband,,,,etc...and gave the officer a false ID, there was a search in this case, other contraband was found,,,and that did stand up in court. However, if you are, who you say you are, it usually doesn't go any father... I have lived and carried in WA since 1970 and have never been asked to ID myself, been disarmed, or even asked for my CPL, even when the officer could plainly see the weapon on my hip. Yes, I have had traffic tickets, and yes I have given ID then, and yes, WA your CPL is tied to your DL, so the officer already knew I had a CPL, why ask.

I have left my ID at home before, but now I normally just leave it in the car, even when shopping. You don't need any ID when on foot. (I always OC)
 
Vitaeus

Vitaeus

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hermannr said:
There was a case in which the person did have her license suspended, did have contraband,,,,etc...and gave the officer a false ID, there was a search in this case, other contraband was found,,,and that did stand up in court. However, if you are, who you say you are, it usually doesn't go any father... I have lived and carried in WA since 1970 and have never been asked to ID myself, been disarmed, or even asked for my CPL, even when the officer could plainly see the weapon on my hip. Yes, I have had traffic tickets, and yes I have given ID then, and yes, WA your CPL is tied to your DL, so the officer already knew I had a CPL, why ask.

I have left my ID at home before, but now I normally just leave it in the car, even when shopping. You don't need any ID when on foot. (I always OC)
Click to expand...

I think the case you are citing is the one from this thread:

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?105698-The-Winnebago-citation State v. Vrieling
 
Freedom1Man

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NavyLCDR said:
I'm afraid you are mistaken. Notice that producing driver's license is mentioned twice in the statute. The first time is your requirement to show it to a cop. The second time is your requirement to show it to a court.

(1) It is unlawful for any person while operating or in charge of any vehicle to refuse when requested by a police officer to give his or her name and address and the name and address of the owner of such vehicle, or for such person to give a false name and address, and it is likewise unlawful for any such person to refuse or neglect to stop when signaled to stop by any police officer or to refuse upon demand of such police officer to produce his or her certificate of license registration of such vehicle, his or her insurance identification card, or his or her vehicle driver's license or to refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof or to refuse to permit the examination of any equipment of such vehicle or the weighing of such vehicle or to refuse or neglect to produce the certificate of license registration of such vehicle, insurance card, or his or her vehicle driver's license when requested by any court. Any police officer shall on request produce evidence of his or her authorization as such.
Click to expand...

or his or her vehicle driver's license

Look in your wallet.... You don't have a DRIVER'S LICENSE

Learn the words and then how to apply them.

I want to see "YOUR DRIVER'S LICENSE" Your is ownership and the apostrophe s is also ownership. That sentence has a double ownership where it's showing that you have ownership of a DRIVER. You can have driver, can you not? Now read the card in your wallet and tell us what is says. The request is for the license of your driver. If you don't have a driver then how can you comply?

I want to see your dog's collar.

I am not asking for your dog collar.

Remember words have meaning, but I think this idea has been covered before.
 
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gogodawgs

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theaero said:
I can't find any information on this, but want to be prepared in case of a stop.

I open carry a SA 1911 loaded SS everyday in Bellevue, WA. I carry it legally, and also have my CPL, but no good CC holsters at the moment. Waiting for my Crossbreed, and will likely conceal from there on out.

I do not like providing police with information. There's nothing on my record, but something about it makes me feel like a criminal. Can anyone provide some insight on when I have to provide police with my information if I am open carrying?

Thank you!
Click to expand...

Well.... to move back to the OP's question and to answer to the limit...

You really only need to show identity to be released from custody.

There are two interpretations of this:

1) You are receiving a ticket (infraction or criminal) you must identify yourself to the officers satisfaction. You may get away with doing so verbally, i.e. Name, address and date of birth or the officer may insist upon seeing picture ID. If the officer is not satisfied then you may fall into #2.

2) If you refused to speak to the officer in the field you may be arrested and processed and then would need to produce identity to the court to be released. Your attorney can do that for you.


However, OC is legal in WA. No ID or CPL is required while on foot. Many here carry 'sterile' (No ID/CPL on their person) while on foot.
 
Freedom1Man

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NavyLCDR said:
Really? If I am driving a vehicle, that makes me a vehicle driver. If I possess a license to do so, the license is a vehicle driver's license since that is exactly what I am, a licensed vehicle driver and the license belongs to me. Thus vehicle driver's license means the license belonging to the vehicle driver. Not to be confused with the video and audio drivers on my computer.
Click to expand...

Read the card in you wallet.

It does not say DRIVER'S LICENSE.

If the law was meant to apply to you, when you are the user of the motor vehicle, then it would say you must hand over your DRIVER LICENSE which is what is on that little card that has your mug on it.
 
Difdi

Difdi

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Location
Seattle, Washington, USA
Fallschirmjäger said:
Now, the question is, does Washington require you to carry a firearms license and other identifying documents when you are carrying a firearm and does Washington require you to produce them upon demand?
Click to expand...

Generally no. But be aware that there are restricted areas where open carry is only legal if you have a license to conceal, and not having your papers on you when carrying in those areas can lead to trouble. Probably not actual conviction trouble, given the way the law is written, but you may have to show the license to get the charges dropped.

sudden valley gunner said:
Don't carry your papers unless required by law.
Click to expand...

Yup. Just remember, if you left your papers home, you also need to stay out of all vehicles and away from elementary schools, middle schools and high schools.

EMNofSeattle said:
Actually state v Boland was the garbage case, not greenwood. my mistake
Click to expand...

Now why did you reply to your own post to make a correction, instead of hitting the edit button? :p
 
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Freedom1Man

Freedom1Man

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NavyLCDR said:
Cool. So go out and get yourself stopped while driving. When the officer ask you for your driver's license, tell him you don't have one and you aren't required by law to show him one, even if you did happen. After your court date, come back and let us know how it worked out for you.
Click to expand...

http://piratenews-tv.blogspot.com/2009/03/constitutional-right-to-travel-without.html
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/travel.htm
http://www.freebooter.com/articles/travel-without-a-licence.html

Law is words.
 
Difdi

Difdi

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EMNofSeattle said:
I thought I "owned my words" once they were posted? Is how I read the terms of service. Didn't want to get in trouble with mods...
Click to expand...

Ownership implies authority to edit. If I make a typo, I always edit. If I make an actual factual error and discover I did, I'll add text to the post. I usually try to combine multiple responses into one post to reduce the text barrage factor, but some people object to large posts. You can't win with everybody all the time, after all.
 
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