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Thread: Another "New to OC" Question

  1. #1
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    Another "New to OC" Question

    I have been doing my research and looking at the Municiple Codes supplied by both Parkville and Riverside, MO. And they both state the same codes (different numbers)
    (Parkville) SECTION 215.460: UNLAWFUL USE OF WEAPONS http://codes.sullivanpublications.com/parkville-slp/ http://z2codes.sullivanpublications....t=riversideset

    A. A person commits the crime of unlawful use of weapons if he knowingly:

    1. Carries concealed upon or about his person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use; or

    2. Sets a spring gun; or

    3. Discharges or shoots a firearm, arrow, quarrel or bolt; or

    4. Exhibits, in the presence of one (1) or more persons, any weapon readily capable of lethal use, in any angry or threatening manner; or

    5. Possesses or discharges a firearm or projectile weapon while intoxicated; or

    6. Carries a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any school, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the Federal Government, State Government, or political subdivision thereof, or into any public assemblage of persons met for any lawful purpose.

    Now, I have read in this forum that it is illegal in Parkville, but couldn't find anything for Riverside. So in my research, finding the exact same wording, am I correct that it is legal (according to the cities' own published municipal codes?
    Should I contact the City Clerk's offices to get copys of thier codes to ensure they are up to date?

  2. #2
    Regular Member xdmcompact's Avatar
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    Yes go to each municipality and ask to see their weapons offenses ordinance, that is the only way to make sure it is legal. Do not ask at the police station, do not ask any police officers, they will not tell you the truth. Also ask if there has been any recent changes to any of the weapons offenses ordinances, that will tell you if they have jumped on the OC ban wagon.

  3. #3
    Regular Member xdmcompact's Avatar
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    Direct from the link you provided for Parkville: SECTION 215.460: UNLAWFUL USE OF WEAPONS

    A. A person commits the crime of unlawful use of weapons if he knowingly:

    1. Carries concealed upon or about his person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use; or

    Subparagraph (1) of Subsection (A) of this Section does not apply when the actor is also in possession of an exposed firearm or projectile weapon for the lawful pursuit of game, or in his dwelling unit or upon business premises over which the actor has possession, authority or control,

    This is an old hunting law St. Louis County tries to use to keep you off of any private property without permission, they have been known to try and use it on public property also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xdmcompact View Post
    Direct from the link you provided for Parkville: SECTION 215.460: UNLAWFUL USE OF WEAPONS

    A. A person commits the crime of unlawful use of weapons if he knowingly:

    1. Carries concealed upon or about his person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use; or

    Subparagraph (1) of Subsection (A) of this Section does not apply when the actor is also in possession of an exposed firearm or projectile weapon for the lawful pursuit of game, or in his dwelling unit or upon business premises over which the actor has possession, authority or control,

    This is an old hunting law St. Louis County tries to use to keep you off of any private property without permission, they have been known to try and use it on public property also.
    But doesn't that state that it is not a crime to have an exposed firearm on your own property? Or hunting?
    Last edited by nogoals; 08-11-2012 at 11:59 AM.

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    Regular Member xdmcompact's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nogoals View Post
    But doesn't that state that it is not a crime to have an exposed firearm on your own property? Or hunting?
    Yes you are free to carry how you see fit on your own property openly or concealed.

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    Private property is awesome. Just saying. lol

    I'm concealing my new pocket pistol right now just cause I can.
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    Quote Originally Posted by xdmcompact View Post
    Yes you are free to carry how you see fit on your own property openly or concealed.
    But nothing in that municliple code states that openly carrying a firearm openly in public is illegal. Or in the one you quoted. I definately will be going to city hall this week.

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    I just returned from the Riverside and Parkville, Mo City Halls. After speaking with the clerk (a very sweet old lady that didn't understand why I didn't want to go downstairs and ask the Police Department) The open carrying of a firearm is legal in Parkville, except City Parks. Interesting factoid I learned on my visit, Parkville does not have a prosecuter, the city outsources that position.
    Riverside was a bit different, the clerk was not available and as I was speaking to the receptionist, another woman approached and tried to help me. This woman was the Police Chief's assistant, (oh great!) She was very friendly and helpful. She said she would find out the information and get back to me. I gave her my first name and number and about an hour later I got my answer.
    A detective called and informed me that I was correct and it was not illegal to openly carry a firearm inside city limits. He went on to tell me that he wouldn't recommend it, as it might frighten citizens. I told him the dogs frighten me but I don't call the cops everytime I see someone walking a dog. He was less than amused.

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    Be careful with Parkville, I seem to remember 2 different ordinances one of which was specific to parks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nogoals View Post
    I just returned from the Riverside and Parkville, Mo City Halls. After speaking with the clerk (a very sweet old lady that didn't understand why I didn't want to go downstairs and ask the Police Department) The open carrying of a firearm is legal in Parkville, except City Parks. Interesting factoid I learned on my visit, Parkville does not have a prosecuter, the city outsources that position.
    I would recommend you discontinue asking them or anyone. You need to ask for their book or log of city ordinances instead and then look it up yourself.

    You are asking them a legal question, they are not your lawyer and "but the little old lady in city hall said it was not illegal" or even "the detective said it is ok" neither one will serve you as a defense in court. They really should not even answer it for you to be honest as it is"legal advice" and they need a bar number to give that actually.

    Trust YOUR lawyer and YOURSELF, everyone else is suspect and YOUR freedom may depend upon it.

    Note, if they happen to contract with Paul Martin, a well known contract city atty, he either does not know it is not legal, or they have no updated the ordinance book yet.

    Not knocking your story, but the theme of not asking police should really extend to not asking ANYONE but your own lawyer or reading the book yourself.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    RSMo 562.031. Ignorance and mistake.

    (2) He acts in reasonable reliance upon an official statement of the law, afterward determined to be invalid or erroneous, contained in

    (a) A statute;

    (b) An opinion or order of an appellate court;

    (c) An official interpretation of the statute, regulation or order defining the offense made by a public official or agency legally authorized to interpret such statute, regulation or order.

    http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C500-599/5620000031.HTM
    Get the bureaucrat to put their "information" into writing on official letterhead. Let me know when they do.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Let me clear some things up, I did get Parkville's book. I looked it up myself, no law against open carrying where it is legal everywhere else in the state, except city parks. The point with the City Clerk was that she didn't understand why I wouldn't just ask the cops. As for Riverside, I just wanted to share the anecdote about the detective. I have heard from the Clerk and what is on Sullivan Publications is 100% up to date.
    I was just trying to share some of the humor in my adventure and I guess no one here has a sense of humor. I am not thinned skinned but you people are cynical and seem to want to jump on people at the drop of a hat. 2nd Amendment rights are very important to me and something I firmly stand for. If you have an OC gathering, I will be the one armed, not hanging out with you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nogoals View Post
    I have heard from the Clerk and what is on Sullivan Publications is 100% up to date.
    If you have an OC gathering, I will be the one armed, not hanging out with you.
    What you "heard" is not accurate. Sullivan can only be as good as the information they are provided by the cities they service and those cities have no obligation what so ever to update and some do not, there are more than one city restricting OC yet a review of Sullivan would indicate differently.

    Not sure why you chose to get offended but if you are looking for it to have a deep and long lasting impact upon me, you are mistaken. Whenever I hold an event any and all are welcome, no one is forced and anyone may leave at any point they see fit. Last i checked I have always been quite clear that i respect all other persons freedom to do as they see fit, no reason to believe you are different, hang where ever you like.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Quote Originally Posted by nogoals View Post
    <snip> I am not thinned skinned but you people are cynical and seem to want to jump on people at the drop of a hat. 2nd Amendment rights are very important to me and something I firmly stand for. If you have an OC gathering, I will be the one armed, not hanging out with you.
    Thin-skinned? Uh, yes, you do appear to be thin-skinned. And, you will go to a OC shindig but not actually go to the OC shindig. Else how would we see you not hanging out with us.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Thin-skinned? Uh, yes, you do appear to be thin-skinned. And, you will go to a OC shindig but not actually go to the OC shindig. Else how would we see you not hanging out with us.
    Dont worry I got your joke...

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    Regular Member xdmcompact's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cody1820 View Post
    Dont worry I got your joke...
    You going to attend the OC event on Sept. 9th? http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...n-Carry-Dinner

    Come on out introduce yourself, this should be one of our bigger turn outs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xdmcompact View Post
    You going to attend the OC event on Sept. 9th? http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...n-Carry-Dinner

    Come on out introduce yourself, this should be one of our bigger turn outs.
    I've meta few "new" OCers in th elast couple of months on line, here and on Facebook. The get togethers are a great source of information and a good way to get used to OCing.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
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    Another "New to OC" Question

    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    I've meta few "new" OCers in th elast couple of months on line, here and on Facebook. The get togethers are a great source of information and a good way to get used to OCing.
    I'd like to. I assume it's up towards st.louis? Anyone know if I can carry my pistol in my motorcycle saddle bag or does it have to be on me openly?
    I don't have a ccw and I honestly don't think I should have to but that's a whole nother ball of political wax. Lol

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    Re: Another "New to OC" Question

    Error haven't given us quite enough info. First, are you 21 or over? Secondly, can you legally possess the firearm in question?

    To tell you the truth, I don't know how RSMo treats motorcycles, but I am curious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cody1820 View Post
    I'd like to. I assume it's up towards st.louis? Anyone know if I can carry my pistol in my motorcycle saddle bag or does it have to be on me openly?
    I don't have a ccw and I honestly don't think I should have to but that's a whole nother ball of political wax. Lol


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  20. #20
    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cody1820 View Post
    I'd like to. I assume it's up towards st.louis? Anyone know if I can carry my pistol in my motorcycle saddle bag or does it have to be on me openly?
    I don't have a ccw and I honestly don't think I should have to but that's a whole nother ball of political wax. Lol
    I'm not sure how this works either. The question has been asked on http://www.missourisportshooting.org/ as well with no definate answer (IMHO).
    Big problem is no OC cities and cities that require a CCW for OC. You might make the case of peaceable journey for OC on a bike, but you may have to argue before a judge and pay for an attorney as well.

    My guess is (what I would do) is don't OC on a motorcycle. I know one very pro and active OC fella in the STL area who says he won't risk it!
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
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  21. #21
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    Another "New to OC" Question

    I was thinking as bad as I hate to... Put gun in one bag ammo and clips in the other. Covered all the bases

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