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Gun Owner not welcome at Tobacco Company

richarcm

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
1,182
Location
Richmond, VA
Unfortunately I am currently enjoying good food and music here. When I stepped outside to get fresh air I noticed this at the front door. Doesn't look like I will be coming here again.

4362e894.jpg
 

The Airframer

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2012
Messages
171
Location
Virginia Beach
It should read:

"We prefer to provide our patrons with a self-defense free zone. Please feel free to pray in the event of something happening that we are not prepared, insured, or armed to control. Call 911 if bullets start flying and please enjoy your stay!"
 
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peter nap

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Messages
13,551
Location
Valhalla
Consider the city's pressure on the businesses in the bottom, I'm surprised everything isn't posted.

But what the hell, they do allow active LE to carry so they aren't 100% anti.

I know, I know, you don't understand, but some readers do:rolleyes:
 

The Airframer

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2012
Messages
171
Location
Virginia Beach
Really? Tobacco company that had killed millions with their smokes? Worried about a couple of people? What a lark.

Before you go asking for cites, just ask yourself how many people have died as a result of lung cancer vs gun shot wounds. I know the numbers will consume you.

Smoking cigarettes is legal and so is carrying a firearm.

Apples and oranges my friend.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
Before you go asking for cites, just ask yourself how many people have died as a result of lung cancer vs gun shot wounds. I know the numbers will consume you.

Smoking cigarettes is legal and so is carrying a firearm.

Apples and oranges my friend.

Its call hypocrisy. thats all
 

richarcm

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
1,182
Location
Richmond, VA
Email to General Manager Rick Poole (rickpoole@dinetcr.com)

Good Evening Mr. Poole.

I just got home from enjoying a nice relaxing evening at your establishment. The tenderloin sliders were amazing and the music made for a very relaxing way to mentally prepare for the work week. I always enjoy the service and classy atmosphere of your restaurant. However tonight when I walked outside to have a cigarette I was very disappointed to see the no gun sign by your front door. I do not feel safe in places that share the same no gun policies as those places that recently had shootings. Obviously the only people that will adhere to your policy will be people who respect rules. If, God forbid, something similar were to happen in your restaurant there would be nobody with the tools to stop it. People who have evil intent in mind truly couldn't care less about what you post on your door. They will not take the time to read everything at the entrance of your restaurant before rushing in, will never notice that extremely small sign, and if they do notice it they will not then think to themselves 'Aw shucks. I gotta shoot up somewhere else now'.

I will say that I completely respect your right to ban the lawful carry of firearms in your establishment. I support that right 100% and will always fight tooth and nail for your right to put that sign on that front door. However I am disappointed in the danger that your restaurant now poses. For the sake of preventing potential misunderstandings in the future I will be happy to warn gun owners throughout the city and the state that you prefer that they not dine in your restaurant.

I hope that you are able to reconsider your dangerous policy and once again welcome the growing number of Virginia gun owners back in your restaurant to enjoy your great menu.

Thank you for your time and take care.

Sincerely,

Chris Richardson
 

The Airframer

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2012
Messages
171
Location
Virginia Beach
People who have evil intent in mind truly couldn't care less about what you post on your door. They will not take the time to read everything at the entrance of your restaurant before rushing in, will never notice that extremely small sign, and if they do notice it they will not then think to themselves 'Aw shucks. I gotta shoot up somewhere else now'.


I truly believe this type of sign is read clearly by and attracts the mass murderer.

Would a mass murderer chose a pro-OC event to open fire on where citizens are allowed and encouraged to exercise their God given right to self defense? i.e. NRA event/OC meet and greet? I DARE THEM! :banana:

They hunt for unarmed fish in a barrel-- this sign is honey in a camp ground where campers expect no bears.
 

DrMark

Lone Star Veteran
Joined
Jan 13, 2007
Messages
1,559
Location
Hampton Roads, Virginia, USA
Good Evening Mr. Poole.

I just got home from enjoying a nice relaxing evening at your establishment. The tenderloin sliders were amazing and the music made for a very relaxing way to mentally prepare for the work week. I always enjoy the service and classy atmosphere of your restaurant. However tonight when I walked outside to have a cigarette I was very disappointed to see the no gun sign by your front door. I do not feel safe in places that share the same no gun policies as those places that recently had shootings. Obviously the only people that will adhere to your policy will be people who respect rules. If, God forbid, something similar were to happen in your restaurant there would be nobody with the tools to stop it. People who have evil intent in mind truly couldn't care less about what you post on your door. They will not take the time to read everything at the entrance of your restaurant before rushing in, will never notice that extremely small sign, and if they do notice it they will not then think to themselves 'Aw shucks. I gotta shoot up somewhere else now'.

I will say that I completely respect your right to ban the lawful carry of firearms in your establishment. I support that right 100% and will always fight tooth and nail for your right to put that sign on that front door. However I am disappointed in the danger that your restaurant now poses. For the sake of preventing potential misunderstandings in the future I will be happy to warn gun owners throughout the city and the state that you prefer that they not dine in your restaurant.

I hope that you are able to reconsider your dangerous policy and once again welcome the growing number of Virginia gun owners back in your restaurant to enjoy your great menu.

Thank you for your time and take care.

Sincerely,

Chris Richardson
Nice. I like it.

I don't know this restaurant personally, but if there's a direct competitor nearby, a copy of a receipt showing money spent with the competitor could be included with any follow-up correspondence. I think it helps emphasize the point that his decision, which we all agree is his to make, may not be the ideal business case.
 

TFred

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
7,750
Location
Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
Good Evening Mr. Poole.

I just got home from enjoying a nice relaxing evening at your establishment. The tenderloin sliders were amazing and the music made for a very relaxing way to mentally prepare for the work week. I always enjoy the service and classy atmosphere of your restaurant. However tonight when I walked outside to have a cigarette I was very disappointed to see the no gun sign by your front door. I do not feel safe in places that share the same no gun policies as those places that recently had shootings. Obviously the only people that will adhere to your policy will be people who respect rules. If, God forbid, something similar were to happen in your restaurant there would be nobody with the tools to stop it. People who have evil intent in mind truly couldn't care less about what you post on your door. They will not take the time to read everything at the entrance of your restaurant before rushing in, will never notice that extremely small sign, and if they do notice it they will not then think to themselves 'Aw shucks. I gotta shoot up somewhere else now'.

I will say that I completely respect your right to ban the lawful carry of firearms in your establishment. I support that right 100% and will always fight tooth and nail for your right to put that sign on that front door. However I am disappointed in the danger that your restaurant now poses. For the sake of preventing potential misunderstandings in the future I will be happy to warn gun owners throughout the city and the state that you prefer that they not dine in your restaurant.

I hope that you are able to reconsider your dangerous policy and once again welcome the growing number of Virginia gun owners back in your restaurant to enjoy your great menu.

Thank you for your time and take care.

Sincerely,

Chris Richardson
Good to write, not criticizing you at all for that. By far, most do not take the time.

My preference would be a bit more direct:

"Please explain to me how your sign does anything, ANY thing at ALL, to accomplish the stated goal of providing a gun-free environment? Quite to the contrary, as the study of virtually all mass shootings has taught us, such signs literally invite mass murderers into your business, since they are assured that they will encounter no resistance."

TFred
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
Good to write, not criticizing you at all for that. By far, most do not take the time.

My preference would be a bit more direct:

"Please explain to me how your sign does anything, ANY thing at ALL, to accomplish the stated goal of providing a gun-free environment? Quite to the contrary, as the study of virtually all mass shootings has taught us, such signs literally invite mass murderers into your business, since they are assured that they will encounter no resistance."

TFred

I agree ... I would not discuss his right to disallow ... after all, that puts YOU at risk, not him.
 

skidmark

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
10,444
Location
Valhalla
Read that sign again. It talks about preferences and rights. Nowhere does it state that you CAN'T carry there.

The intent is clear. Nothing will be served by parsing words to seek some imagined loophole. In fact, getting caught playing that game will probably just make it harder everywhere else when the word goes around that someone tried to play word games. And word will get around.

No doubt taking the high road puts us behind the proverbial eitht ball. That sucks. But it's either that or deal with an even harder stance against us. Obviously, your mileage varies.

stay safe.
 

fjpro2a

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2010
Messages
280
Location
North Carolina
Done with class, as every OC'er is expected to do

To richarcm - You have done it with class. Your statement that - I will respect and fight for your right to put up a sign - shows tremendous patriotism. If many, many people (OC'ers and non gun owners) stop going there, I honestly believe that the store will change its policy. It may take time, but that is the best way. Kudos! Drmark's suggestion is excellent. TFred's suggestion is a little harsh (however, it's how most of us think.) Skidmark's point about intent is, as usual, right on the money.
 

peter nap

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Messages
13,551
Location
Valhalla
To richarcm - You have done it with class. Your statement that - I will respect and fight for your right to put up a sign - shows tremendous patriotism. If many, many people (OC'ers and non gun owners) stop going there, I honestly believe that the store will change its policy. It may take time, but that is the best way. Kudos! Drmark's suggestion is excellent. TFred's suggestion is a little harsh (however, it's how most of us think.) Skidmark's point about intent is, as usual, right on the money.

It was a nice, well written letter, but it was like a shiny new car without an engine. It ain't going anywhere. They will ignore it except for possibly a canned response, BUT.....at least Richarm did something!

The problem is a lot deeper than the Tobacco Company. More on that on Thursday.

I agree 90% with Skidmark. Word games, which we are famous for, are meaningless.

TFred isn't being harsh, he's actually being a little mild.

Right now there are bigger fish to fry.
 
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davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
It was a nice, well written letter, but it was like a shiny new car without an engine.

I agree because Rick is the GM (who is the owner? beats me!).. oddly enough their name is not registered as a business under that name....


Registrant:
The Tobacco Company Restaurant
1201 E. Cary Street
Richmond, Virginia 23219
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, LLC (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: THETOBACCOCOMPANY.COM
Created on: 30-Nov-98
Expires on: 29-Nov-16
Last Updated on: 26-May-11

Administrative Contact:
Jackson, Chris cjackson@webdreamsdesigns.com
WebDreams Designs
6933 Turnage Lane
Mechanicsville, Virginia 23111
United States
8044276096 Fax -- 8044276096

Technical Contact:
Jackson, Chris cjackson@webdreamsdesigns.com
WebDreams Designs, LLC
6933 Turnage Lane
Mechanicsville, Virginia 23111
United States
8044276096 Fax -- 8044276096

Domain servers in listed order:
NS9.PSEKHOSTING.COM
NS10.PSEKHOSTING.COM


A whois search revealed the information above .. not much ... webdreams designs is actually a registered LLC

It could be that the tobacco company restaurant is a private company ... no LLC/S/or Corp. designation ... this would lead one to consider threatening a lawsuit to force them to allow carry. The company could win, they may lose .. either way a lawsuit will cost them $$$. So, how much are they opposed to carry? How much really, in dollars and cents?

I can see a case moving forward (or hopeful) in respect to this aspect. The 2nd amendment is different than the first as the second relates to your self preservation ... if companies wish to remove your ability to defend yourself then they should be obligated to provide and equal level of protection.
 
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Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
In a land before the sign maybe - didn't see any sign.

During the last GA session, 7 or 8 of us went to the Tobacco Company for a late lunch, walked in the main doors, sat at the round table at the end of the bar, ate and talked for well over an hour w/o any problems. All of us were very visibly OCing, even talked with one of the servers about the visual deterrent and educational value thereof.
 
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