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Thread: two arrested in plot to overthrow US government and kill obama

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    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    two arrested in plot to overthrow US government and kill obama

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/28...est=latestnews


    they were wrong in killing those two people...but what were to happen if we NEEDED to rise up and revolt against our government? are we going to get arrested?

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    I suppose you have a Right to rise-up against any form of Government you feel is Despotic. Is our Government that degree of Despotic?; not even close.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I suppose you have a Right to rise-up against any form of Government you feel is Despotic. Is our Government that degree of Despotic?; not even close.
    Not the Gov. as a whole, but certain individuals, YES. And getting worse by the minute. The bigger the Gov. The less liberties we have,and this Gov. is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too big, and F%$K face wants to keep on growing it until he is declared king.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wethepeople View Post
    Not the Gov. as a whole, but certain individuals, YES. And getting worse by the minute. The bigger the Gov. The less liberties we have,and this Gov. is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too big, and F%$K face wants to keep on growing it until he is declared king.
    Government is a necessary evil. You can reject that assertion, but I dare you to take a stroll through the typical State that has a weak Central Government, and get back to me.

    Your so-called Freedom, and your so-called Liberty is nothing more than self-indulging soap-boxery of the Autonomous Man struggling to break free of the inherent chains of the Natural state of Man, which is as a Social Creature. Autonomous Man is in perpetual chains at best, and at worse, dead.

    I am not sure who F*ckface is? You're being a bit too emotive, my friend. You don't have to have respect for The President, or the Office, but try having some self-respect, and containing your hot-heated tone.
    Last edited by Beretta92FSLady; 08-28-2012 at 02:39 PM.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    One of the Fort Stewart soldiers charged in the case, Pfc. Michael Burnett, also gave testimony that backed up many of the assertions made by prosecutors.
    I find it interesting that the prosecutors were able to correctly allege so many things about the group, but has no idea how many 'members' there may be.

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wethepeople View Post
    Not the Gov. as a whole, but certain individuals, YES. And getting worse by the minute. The bigger the Gov. The less liberties we have,and this Gov. is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too big, and F%$K face wants to keep on growing it until he is declared king.
    It's not just Obama, it's both parties. Don't play their game, you're only going to lose.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I suppose you have a Right to rise-up against any form of Government you feel is Despotic. Is our Government that degree of Despotic?; not even close.
    I disagree. I think the government is that despotic. Fortunately we have a way to fight back without using violence. But that ability is severely limited and eroding quickly.

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    Assertion? Lady, with all due respect, the government is not to be assertive. The government's power is derived from the people. It is the people who need to be assertive over its government, which is a practice long ago forgotten. As for the OP, yes, when people have finally had enough and begin to take action, they will be arrested, martial law will be declared, the US military will police the people, and everything our founding fathers strove for will have been for nothing. GG America, it's been fun.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PistolPackingMomma View Post
    I find it interesting that the prosecutors were able to correctly allege so many things about the group, but has no idea how many 'members' there may be.
    I imagine they know most of the individuals involved, and are keeping it close until they get hold of them--save a fight.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    Only $500,000 needed ... and why kill obamalama ... want biden in office?

    of course, we are hearing only one side of the story .... their mothers' say they are good boys, so who am I to argue at this point in time.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shastadude17 View Post
    Assertion? Lady, with all due respect, the government is not to be assertive. The government's power is derived from the people. It is the people who need to be assertive over its government, which is a practice long ago forgotten. As for the OP, yes, when people have finally had enough and begin to take action, they will be arrested, martial law will be declared, the US military will police the people, and everything our founding fathers strove for will have been for nothing. GG America, it's been fun.
    The Government Power originate from A people, not The people. The people legitimize the Governments Power by engaging in the process of electing individuals to Govern by that Power.

    Government, as it is today, is not by The people, People are merely an expendable means to an end. I know, I'm a downer, big time!
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    Quote Originally Posted by wethepeople View Post
    Not the Gov. as a whole, but certain individuals, YES. And getting worse by the minute. The bigger the Gov. The less liberties we have,and this Gov. is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too big, and F%$K face wants to keep on growing it until he is declared king.

    Then vote those people out of office.

    That's what elections are for. The problem with too many people in the gun community is that they talk a good fight, but when push comes to shove, a lot of us aren't even registered to vote, or refuse to vote out of some stubborn rejection for the popular challenger, or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support...

    And if that's not good enough...then run for office.

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    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Then vote those people out of office.

    That's what elections are for. The problem with too many people in the gun community is that they talk a good fight, but when push comes to shove, a lot of us aren't even registered to vote, or refuse to vote out of some stubborn rejection for the popular challenger, or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support...

    And if that's not good enough...then run for office.
    +1. and I can't even get people to come with me to watch the county commisioners meetings. why gripe about government when you don't even care enough to keep tabs on them?
    they love our milk and honey, but they preach about some other way of living, when they're running down my country man they're walkin' on the fightin side of me

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    +1. and I can't even get people to come with me to watch the county commissioners meetings. why gripe about government when you don't even care enough to keep tabs on them?
    My county and city gov. are "televised" on "public access" TV.....I DVR them. If a subject or issue arises that I take issue with due to their actions, proposed actions, or lack of action I then start making calls, sending e-mails, and gathering the villagers.....pitchforks and torches, metaphorically speaking, if need be.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  14. #14
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Then vote those people out of office.

    That's what elections are for. The problem with too many people in the gun community is that they talk a good fight, but when push comes to shove, a lot of us aren't even registered to vote, or refuse to vote out of some stubborn rejection for the popular challenger, or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support...

    And if that's not good enough...then run for office.
    Didn't you just contradict your very point?

    "then vote these people out of office."

    "or refuse to vote out of some stubborn rejection for the popular challenger, or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support..."


    How can you argue to vote these people out of office, yet succumb to voting for the lesser of two evils? Obama and Romney are black and white versions of each other. I think those who really want to make a change are putting their support behind Ron Paul or Gary Johnson. Those who say they want change but vote for Romney because he is the only one who can beat Obama, and he is the "other" major candidate, are only adding fuel to the fire that is burning our Constitution to the ground. Freedom is not what we should be fighting for- we already are free. We will remain free. It's liberty that is slowly fading away..from gun rights to gay rights to property rights to drug rights...those are all choices and decisions that shouldn't be made by the government, but by The People.

    As Beretta92FSLady said, the power right now lies in A People. Because The People have fallen for the same rhetoric that you promote..don't vote for the liberty and Constitution loving third party or lesser known candidate, but place your trust in the major party big government candidate. The People didn't choose their republican candidate for president, the media and establishment did. If there was nothing to fear with Ron Paul, then why cheat and change the rules before the RNC? They know where the solution lies, and it isn't in their major candidate.

    A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson is not a "throw away" vote as you suggest, but it is evidence for those future generations that there are other People out there just like them- disgusted with big government, unhappy with the trampling of the Constitution, and the slow destruction of personal liberty. A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson is proof that people are fed up, and give others a place to go for support. What's that saying, "Rome wasn't built in a day"? I'm sure our Republic wasn't built in a day either...

    So say what you will- but I won't fall for the trap. A vote for Romney is a vote to stay on the current path. A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson just shows that there's one more person who won't conform to the rhetoric and really wants a change.




    sorry for all the caps and coherent sentences...it's not really my style...i was just taking some advice that Beretta92FSLady was giving to another poster- "You're being a bit too emotive, my friend. You don't have to have respect for The President, or the Office, but try having some self-respect, and containing your hot-heated tone."

    i think it helped convey my point a lil better...so thx
    Last edited by hammer6; 08-29-2012 at 02:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hammer6 View Post
    Didn't you just contradict your very point?
    succumb to voting for the lesser of two evils? Obama and Romney are black and white versions of each other. I think those who really want to make a change are putting their support behind Ron Paul or Gary Johnson. Those who say they want change but vote for Romney because he is the only one who can beat Obama, and he is the "other" major candidate, are only adding fuel to the fire that is burning our Constitution to the ground.

    ...

    The People didn't choose their republican candidate for president, the media and establishment did. If there was nothing to fear with Ron Paul, then why cheat and change the rules before the RNC? They know where the solution lies, and it isn't in their major candidate.

    A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson is not a "throw away" vote as you suggest, but it is evidence for those future generations that there are other People out there just like them- disgusted with big government, unhappy with the trampling of the Constitution, and the slow destruction of personal liberty. A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson is proof that people are fed up, and give others a place to go for support. What's that saying, "Rome wasn't built in a day"? I'm sure our Republic wasn't built in a day either...

    So say what you will- but I won't fall for the trap. A vote for Romney is a vote to stay on the current path. A vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson just shows that there's one more person who won't conform to the rhetoric and really wants a change.
    This. Sadly whenever I try to talk politics with people, even within my own family, and I talk about the importance and beauty of personal liberties and getting America back on track by non-interventionism and focusing on our own problems, people think I'm crazy. Truly, this country is brainwashed into Republican vs. Democrat. It's a sad day when people get visibly angry when you speak of minding your own business and personal liberties...and sadly, I see so many of these hypocrites every day on OC. We talk about gun rights like they are the most important thing ever, and then we vote for people who will butcher the rest of the constitution. We tell people "I'll respect your right to not own a gun if you respect my right to own one"....but then we get mad when people exercise the 1st to disagree with us. Any time a news article comes out where someone is accused of a crime or something terrible, read the comments...everyone is gathering in the proverbial town square and burning that person at the stake, when the person hasn't even had his first appearance with a judge yet.

    In my personal opinion, the measure of a free society is based on whether or not you fear voicing opposition to the status quo, and it's gotten to the point where I do question whether or not I should voice my opinion. I've already got weatherproofed ammo, 2 weeks of food, guns, and I'm a veteran of OIF. To be a libertarian on top of it is a DHS wet dream in today's day and age, because God forbid you talk about freedom or liberty. Our founding fathers would be ashamed of what we've become. Just my $0.02

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    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    My county and city gov. are "televised" on "public access" TV.....I DVR them. If a subject or issue arises that I take issue with due to their actions, proposed actions, or lack of action I then start making calls, sending e-mails, and gathering the villagers.....pitchforks and torches, metaphorically speaking, if need be.
    Our public access TV likes to broadcast county commission meetings at 1 in the morning. Your method is great too, but the majority of people in my county probably don't watch the board meetings at all, live or over TV. And that's a shame, it's like so many people were pissed off when the county put a roundabout in THR middle of nowhere while claiming due to budget cuts they would have to release sex offenders. And people were so angry, and yet no one ever came to the meetings to oppose the roundabout. No one came to the meetings to complain, no one even knows who their commissioners are in some cases.
    they love our milk and honey, but they preach about some other way of living, when they're running down my country man they're walkin' on the fightin side of me

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Then vote those people out of office.

    That's what elections are for. The problem with too many people in the gun community is that they talk a good fight, but when push comes to shove, a lot of us aren't even registered to vote, or refuse to vote out of some stubborn rejection for the popular challenger, or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support...

    And if that's not good enough...then run for office.
    *facepalm*

    So we should all vote either Republican or Democrat and any other vote is a pointless exorcise in futility that's going to damage the nation more than it will help the nation. If we don't like the candidates, then we should run ourselves. Yet, whenever a candidate pops up that is going to really try and mend the country, they are railroaded into the ground by the big parties, meaning you will only ever be able to run a third party or independent candidate. However, once again, you say we should never vote for a third party/independent candidate. So we've come full circle.

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    One of the biggest problems with politics, at least in this country, is the presence of political parties. If people were required to run strictly on their beliefs and personal platform, without a D or R or I after their name, the voters would likely be more engaged, rather than dismissing the party they don't like simply because they aren't a Republican or Democrat. They would at least not be able to just vote party line and be done with it, they would either vote at random (probably not any worse than what we get now, maybe an improvement) or search the randomized ballot for the ones they recognize.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    *facepalm*

    So we should all vote either Republican or Democrat and any other vote is a pointless exorcise in futility that's going to damage the nation more than it will help the nation. If we don't like the candidates, then we should run ourselves. Yet, whenever a candidate pops up that is going to really try and mend the country, they are railroaded into the ground by the big parties, meaning you will only ever be able to run a third party or independent candidate. However, once again, you say we should never vote for a third party/independent candidate. So we've come full circle.
    This.

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    Regular Member twoskinsonemanns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    or they actually do throw away their votes on some no-hope third or fourth party candidate who can't raise enough public support...
    .
    I love it.

    "I support the ban on assault weapons" - Donald Trump

    We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission - Ayn Rand

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    Regular Member GoatSenator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    The Government Power originate from A people, not The people. The people legitimize the Governments Power
    Wait, didn't you just say it's 'A people', not 'The people'? What kind of semantic trickery is this?
    Clarify what you mean by that please! I think it says "We The People..." not "We A People..."

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoatSenator View Post
    Wait, didn't you just say it's 'A people', not 'The people'? What kind of semantic trickery is this?
    Clarify what you mean by that please! I think it says "We The People..." not "We A People..."
    It's a roundabout way of saying the politicians have given themselves power, thus a select group of people(a people), whereas the people legitimize that power they have seized by continuing to vote the very same people into office.

    I think.

  23. #23
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    Our public access TV likes to broadcast county commission meetings at 1 in the morning. Your method is great too, but the majority of people in my county probably don't watch the board meetings at all, live or over TV. And that's a shame, it's like so many people were pissed off when the county put a roundabout in THR middle of nowhere while claiming due to budget cuts they would have to release sex offenders. And people were so angry, and yet no one ever came to the meetings to oppose the roundabout. No one came to the meetings to complain, no one even knows who their commissioners are in some cases.
    I hear ya. I monitor the city and county web sites so I don't miss anything. It is difficult at times due to our often busy schedule after the kids get home from school.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  24. #24
    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    It's a roundabout way of saying the politicians have given themselves power, thus a select group of people(a people), whereas the people legitimize that power they have seized by continuing to vote the very same people into office.

    I think.
    No that's what she meant- you're right.

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    "Two arrested in plot to overthrow US government..."

    2 people...probably not quite enough manpower to accomplish that goal. ;-)

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