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Gary Johnson can fix the America the two party system has broken.

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
In regards to gun rights they have.

I was not aware that gun rights is the only thing that matters, or even the most important thing that matters.

Explain what votes you didnt like where Kagan and Sotomayor voted better.

You persist in this myopia. I don't like either of them either. We have you and your kind to thank that these are the Supreme Court justices we get. Good work, citizen.
 

PistolPackingMomma

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
Messages
1,884
Location
SC
Again, Republicans seem to think they get to lay claim to the votes of people who give a crap about liberty. The reality is that they would be just as justified in claiming that a vote for a write-in, independent, or third-party candidate is a vote for Romney.

Dear Republicans,
You have never had my vote. You have never been my fall-back. You're equally as detestable as the "other" guys.
Love,
Me

My sentiments exactly.
 

georg jetson

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
2,416
Location
Slidell, Louisiana
SNIP
In regards to Romney vs Obama and the SCOTUS, just remember that Ruth Ginsbgerg is 90 yrs old and has cancer. She will die or leave the bench in the next 4 years. That means we have a HUGE opportunity to take a seat back IF.........IF.........IF.....and ONLY IF we have a conservative president to nominate the next justice.

I'm sorry... you're saying Romney is a conservative? Really?! Romney isn't even saying that! What he does say, of course, doesn't matter because he changes his position so often...

Romney needs to be that person, not Obama.

A vote for Johnson for symbolic purposes at this time would be a monumental waste and missed opportunity to get a conservative justice for the next 40 years.

Romney conservative... now that's funny!! LOL!!!!
 

Ca Patriot

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Feb 25, 2010
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I was not aware that gun rights is the only thing that matters, or even the most important thing that matters.



You persist in this myopia. I don't like either of them either. We have you and your kind to thank that these are the Supreme Court justices we get. Good work, citizen.

Well you are welcome.

Do you have any justices now or in the past that you can show as examples of what you consider as acceptable ?

I dont know much about you so I am just trying to get an idea of how the current justices like Roberts or Alito are bad and give me an example of a good justice.
 

Chris 45LC

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Joined
Aug 25, 2012
Messages
41
Location
Ohio
Can you please give some evidence that this is so? It's not like the incumbent automagically wins if there's no clear majority. If you agree that the majority of Americans don't want Obama, then why shouldn't they vote third party? The majority of Americans also don't want Romney. What's the point of voting for someone that most of us don't want in office, just to keep out someone else that most of us don't want in office?

Yes, I can or maybe I should say history can. No third party candidate has won a US presidential election since Abraham Lincoln in 1864. The closest in the past 100 years was Teddy Roosevelt in 1912, won by Wilson.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/03/10/how-third-party-candidates-affect-elections
 

Brimstone Baritone

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2010
Messages
786
Location
Leeds, Alabama, USA
And in the 1912 election, it was clear where the voter split occurred. Maybe I'm just being obtuse, but I see a lot of 2008 Obama supporters who aren't impressed with the last 4 years. I also personally know people who normally vote third party who took a chance with Obama in 2008 and learned their lesson. I see Johnson picking up a lot of former Obama supporters. I don't see Obama keeping the support he had, because he didn't live up to a lot of "special interest" expectations. For instance, the Libertarian party probably looks pretty attractive to a 2008 supporter disgusted by Obama's lackluster, Johnny-come-lately stance on Gay and Lesbian rights.

Then, on the other side of the coin, the Republicans themselves claimed for much of the primary season that the Paul supporters weren't "real" Republicans. Supposedly they were all Libertarians who had "infiltrated" "legitimate" GOP events to support their "radical" candidate. That's a lot of third party support that the Republicans never really had to begin with.

What I'm saying is, this time the "voter split" is going to happen on both sides of the aisle. I could easily see the general election splitting roughly into thirds. (Well, realistically more like 40/40/10, but the point still stands.)

Edit: And if the popular vote did split into thirds, what would the electoral college do? If they can't determine a clear winner, doesn't it go to the (Majority Republican) House of Representatives to decide? If they can't decide, wouldn't that put Biden into office? Seems like it could be a very interesting election, if people allow themselves to break from their self-imposed servitude. Or we could have the same old same, and continue the slow march along the path the Romans laid out for us.
 
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Chris 45LC

Regular Member
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Aug 25, 2012
Messages
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Location
Ohio
I agree, a lot of Democrats are not happy with Obama and many Republicans are not happy with their party. However, I believe that only a president that changes to a third party for his second term and is well liked and trusted by the majority of Americans (such as Lincoln in 1864 and Roosevelt in 1912) would have a chance of winning on a third party ticket. History has proven this to be the case.
 

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
History has proven this to be the case.

You need to understand history better. It would have been more accurate to say

Historically, this has been the case.

The distinction is tremendous, and has a huge impact on the way you think. In any case, I do agree that, historically, there have been too few people with principles and spines willing to buck their riders.
 

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
Do you have any justices now or in the past that you can show as examples of what you consider as acceptable ?

Here's the root of the problem, and why your adherence to the lesser-of-two-evils canard is so destructive. With increased government (and, thus, government power) comes increased injustice due to increased government behavior. The less government does, the fewer laws there are for the Supreme Court to review. The less government does, the less special interest-subservient the President is, and the less special interest-subservient and pro-government the Supreme Court justices are. Unfortunately, you and yours have decided it's better to pick someone who seems infinitesimally less horrible to you who will still grow the size and power of government, which continually makes Presidents and Congressmen and Justices more and more powerful and unjust. I could identify Justices who were at least decent, but none in the last century, and we will never have even a decent Justice nominated by a Republican or Democrat, because the people those parties nominate are not interested in appointing decent Justices. You are perpetuating the continual destruction of liberty at the hands of the Executive, Judicial, and Legislative branches with your "I'd rather you raped me in the mouth than the ass" mentality.

I dont know much about you so I am just trying to get an idea of how the current justices like Roberts or Alito are bad and give me an example of a good justice.

One example of both Roberts and Alito being atrocious: their willing and servile support for qualified immunity for police and total immunity for prosecutors, legal "principles" that were invented of whole cloth by the Supreme Court, under "conservative" court makeups. This travesty is monumentally more significant than any 2A concerns we might talk about.
 

Ca Patriot

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One example of both Roberts and Alito being atrocious: their willing and servile support for qualified immunity for police and total immunity for prosecutors, legal "principles" that were invented of whole cloth by the Supreme Court, under "conservative" court makeups. This travesty is monumentally more significant than any 2A concerns we might talk about.

Can you cite a case ?
 

Beretta92FSLady

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
5,264
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In My Coffee
Can you cite a case ?

Here's a bone:

The unanimous ruling, authored by Justice Samuel Alito, says police and everyone else who testifies before a grand jury have "absolute immunity" from any civil-rights claims stemming from their testimony.
Moreover, Alito said, "this rule may not be circumvented by claiming that a grand jury witness conspired to present false testimony or by using evidence of the witness' testimony to support any other [civil rights] claim concerning the initiation or maintenance of a prosecution." http://www.news-record.com/content/...court_decision_may_help_city_in_lacrosse_case
 

twoskinsonemanns

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Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Messages
2,326
Location
WV
I agree, a lot of Democrats are not happy with Obama and many Republicans are not happy with their party. However, I believe that only a president that changes to a third party for his second term and is well liked and trusted by the majority of Americans (such as Lincoln in 1864 and Roosevelt in 1912) would have a chance of winning on a third party ticket. History has proven this to be the case.

Ah yes. Nothing that has not been done before can be done. Naturally. :rolleyes:
 

()pen(arry

Regular Member
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Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
haha.

you lost.

try again.

Wait, did you not see Beretta's reply? Are you so incapable of some basic case law searching? How do you not already know how Roberts and Alito have ruled, and yet feel free to run your mouth about them? Kids these days are hopeless. You need to stop getting your education from the bottom of the barrel on reddit and 4chan. Your "witty", "gotcha" one-liners may go over well on the playground of the internet, but they carry no water with anyone worth talking to.

Here, for your interitalin-addled convenience, just some basic search results:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13047151/
http://usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2006-01-09-troubling-times_x.htm
http://www.theagitator.com/2006/01/09/no-alito/
http://www.ca3.uscourts.gov/opinarch/95a0997p.txt
http://www.theagitator.com/2008/05/07/about-them-judges/
http://apublicdefender.com/2009/10/20/drunk-driving-is-different/

I didn't even go past the first few search results for each Justice.

So, umm...

haha.

you lost.

try again.
 

EMNofSeattle

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
3,670
Location
S. Kitsap, Washington state
Qualified immunity is a well established legal principle, Alito and Roberts would be voting against the rule of law and system of justice if they voted to end QI. QI is a nessecary part of the criminal justice system.

Grand jury testimony immunity is given to anyone who testifies to the grand jury. not just police.

That's one of the weakest arguments possible against a justice.
 

ATM

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
360
Location
Indiana, USA
I am a libertarian but many libertarians are very short sighted and immature. They want instant gratification and cant see beyond tomorrow.

They believe electing Ron Paul or Gary Johnson will instantly bring about massive and radical change to the politics of America. Its just not a reality...

I don't know too many that believe what you're suggesting.

Most that I talk to and have read are far more interested in the fact that simply breaching into this closed contest of national control, wholly owned and guarded in modern history by the two current establishment parties, would lead to the realization that better choices are not only viable, but that no party ever deserves loyalty based solely on the false notion that there are only 2 choices (of which they are the 2nd worst).

That is in fact, radical change, but hardly similar to the "short sighted" or "instant gratification" you were attempting to refute.
 
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