Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Arrested for Open Carrying in Wichita

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Wichita,KS
    Posts
    2

    Arrested for Open Carrying in Wichita

    I have never had a situation like this occur before, and thought I would do some of my own research. When I engaged in my research, I stumbled upon this site and thought I would see if anyone else in Wichita had any quams open carrying. Once the case is finalized, then I will disclose all the details of the incident. I have an excellent attorney that is a friend of mine, and I am sure he would agree that I shouldn't be discussing the issue publicly. In that regard, thanks Grapeshot for the advice. This whole situation just caught me off guard.
    Last edited by Freedom316; 09-09-2012 at 08:51 PM.

  2. #2
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North Chesterfield, Va.
    Posts
    34,616
    Wow, out of the gate fast w/o verifiable facts and with an attorney who should be the one to advise you.

    The Kansas Attorney General did issue an opinion in July of this year regarding open carry and state preemption which addressed the legality of open carrying in Wichita.
    http://www.ksn.com/news/local/story/...XMTO45UJA.cspx

    If you do want to engage in public conversation, please consider that the prosecutor will likely see the exchange here and that any good defense attorney would suggest is not in your best interests.

    That information that is otherwise publicly available (copy of the arrest documents w/personal information redacted) will dispel any doubt as to the validity of your story. Without such substantiation, there is not much response that anyone can make.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Quarryville, PA
    Posts
    3,543

    Arrested for Open Carrying in Wichita

    Since this is your first and only post, I'm just going to ask for a police report and leave it at that.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Topeka, Kansas, USA
    Posts
    367

    Open Carry is legal in Wichita

    Open carry was just passed in Wichita so I am confused why you would be arrested. I know you can’t talk about it yet no problem but it does make me wonder what you were doing and why you’re making a post about it?

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    96
    Quote Originally Posted by marine0300 View Post
    Open carry was just passed in Wichita so I am confused why you would be arrested. I know you can’t talk about it yet no problem but it does make me wonder what you were doing and why you’re making a post about it?
    I am with Marine here, this is indeed odd. Give us a holler& we will do what we can to provide good material for your attorney to use.

  6. #6
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North Chesterfield, Va.
    Posts
    34,616
    Quote Originally Posted by sha-ul View Post
    I am with Marine here, this is indeed odd. Give us a holler& we will do what we can to provide good material for your attorney to use.
    Few if any will w/o some solid verification.

    Quoting from post #2:

    "That information that is otherwise publicly available (copy of the arrest documents w/personal information redacted) will dispel any doubt as to the validity of your story. Without such substantiation, there is not much response that anyone can make"
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    96
    I may have heard from a local source on this case, From the same source that told me of Don C's arrest.
    If, and this is a big IF this is the case I heard of, the gentleman was open carrying, but was caught in the snare set by the city, City ordinance permits walking about with a loaded handgun, so long as it is in a holster, with the safety on, however, if you do not have a ccw, in the city, you may not transport a loaded handgun, so this gent may have been arrested for transporting a loaded handgun. If this is the case, he has a few options, those are try to cut a deal, take it to trial, possibly pleading no contest, or challenge the constitutional authority of the city to regulate carry&/ transport of a firearm, since article 4 or the KS BOR was reworded& re affirmed. however I am afraid this may be the wrong test case to test the authority of cities under the Ks constitution.
    I would like to know more about the facts of the case though, to see if there any aggravating, or mitigating circumstances.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    20

    Cool Open Carry Not legal in vehicles when not holstered

    If you check with the records department, I would suspect the Open Carry cases made since its been legal involve the gun being visible "inside" a vehicle and not on the person (immediate control) or in a holster with safety on etc, obviously illegal according to the ordinance. I'm VERY pro open carry, however one of the problems I foresee is a lot of arrest with open carry holders not understanding the law thus you will get a lot of arrest like this. Although I'm typically against regulation, the CCL violations are almost minimal because you have to take a class in regards to the laws etc, often taught by police officers themselves. This is not the case with Open Carry and people often don't take the time to educate themselves on the law first and end up accidentally violating it. I wonder if just a simple one day class like "hunters safety" would be in order before you can open carry? I'm not saying they would deny anyone their right to open carry but at least give them the information they need. I've been in safety classes before where people were asking when they are allowed to pull their gun out, so obviously this is a need for the general public as they typically haven't studied case law. Also, by educating people like we do with CCL holders, this would help mitigate these accidental arrests and in turn, give less fuel for the liberals to try to say "see, look at all these arrest! We should ban Open Carry!". Just some food for thought.
    Last edited by saefrog; 09-18-2012 at 11:21 AM.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Damiansar-15's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mercer Island, WA
    Posts
    197

    Discretion

    Quote Originally Posted by saefrog View Post
    If you check with the records department, I would suspect the Open Carry cases made since its been legal involve the gun being visible "inside" a vehicle and not on the person (immediate control) or in a holster with safety on etc, obviously illegal according to the ordinance. I'm VERY pro open carry, however one of the problems I foresee is a lot of arrest with open carry holders not understanding the law thus you will get a lot of arrest like this. Although I'm typically against regulation, the CCL violations are almost minimal because you have to take a class in regards to the laws etc, often taught by police officers themselves. This is not the case with Open Carry and people often don't take the time to educate themselves on the law first and end up accidentally violating it. I wonder if just a simple one day class like "hunters safety" would be in order before you can open carry? I'm not saying they would deny anyone their right to open carry but at least give them the information they need. I've been in safety classes before where people were asking when they are allowed to pull their gun out, so obviously this is a need for the general public as they typically haven't studied case law. Also, by educating people like we do with CCL holders, this would help mitigate these accidental arrests and in turn, give less fuel for the liberals to try to say "see, look at all these arrest! We should ban Open Carry!". Just some food for thought.
    OR, LEOs can use proper discretion and not arrest free citizens for breaking unconstitutional ordinances. It is already a felony for bad-guys to carry a gun whether it is concealed or open carried. Why make and uphold ordinances directed towards free citizens that are truly made to be preventative of a crime and not to punish crime. We all know gun-free legislation does not work!!! To me it should be about upholding the Constitution and keeping the peace, not heavily regulating/enforcing ordinances that have yet to be found UnConstitutional..."Shall not infringe" does mean something to some people in the legal profession...

    I agree with you that people need to take responsibility for their actions, but something is just wrong when an LEO arrests a free citizen for something they themselves are doing at the exact same time... Funny how people do not recognize tyranny when implementing ordinances... I know you are one of the good guys fighting for individual freedom, so do not take my sentiments as a personal attack towards good officers...

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Wichita,KS
    Posts
    2
    Well due to my rather hectic schedule, it has taken me some time to get on here and reply to the thread I started. Initially, I posted a rather detailed account of the incident without thinking about the prosecution potentially trying to take my post and twist it in a way that could be used against me. After the reply from Grapeshot, I decided to revise my initial post until I had all the legal issues finalized. I think it it quite clear however that I will prevail in this case; the facts are simple and I was in complete accordance with the law. My attorney did express that from this point forward, I may want to consider carrying my firearm concealed to avoid getting harassed by the police. The issue is that I have refrained from getting a conceal carry license just based upon principle. I am not a attorney, but I was under the impression that the 2nd Amendment states that we have the right to bear arms. I have always wondered how the government has the power to require a license for a constitutional right?

    As far as firearm training is concerned, I have grown up around firearms, and utilize them heavily. I have also engaged in competition shooting, such as IDPA. Members of my family own quite a lot of farmland throughout Kansas, and I go out there regularly to practice my draw, practice rapid magazine changes, and moving while engaging on multiple targets that I set up. Furthermore, I have also paid for advanced pistol training, and am familiar with a wide array of high end firearms. I try to get in a minimum of 200 to 250 rounds of practice per week. I will be rather vague regarding the details of the incident, but it was at night while I was walking around my neighborhood trying to decompress from a rather stressful day. I live in a fairly affluent neighborhood that has relatively low crime. Nevertheless, having the ability to defend myself if necessary made the walk, intended to relieve my stress, more relaxing until I was approached by LEO's. I guess that my post at this point is just a public service announcement to anyone considering open carry in Wichita. I was still in a dressed in professional attire, and they had no reasonable suspicion or probably cause to make contact with me in the first place. Furthermore, the firearm that I was carrying falls into around the 1K range, and that is the used value. I do not see many criminals carrying firearms of this sort, esspecially openly carried in plain view.

    This may be slightly off topic, but to lighten the mood I would like to share a brief exchange I had with my local Rolex dealer when I was picking up my two-tone 18K yellow gold Submariner from being serviced and looking at a Yachtmaster I have had my eye on. He asked me if I had the watch insured due to the high value of the watch. I laughed and told him, "Yes, I do have an insurance policy set up, it is typically in the form of a 45 auto or a 9mm."
    Last edited by Freedom316; 09-21-2012 at 04:38 PM. Reason: typos

  11. #11
    Regular Member Damiansar-15's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mercer Island, WA
    Posts
    197

    Status

    If able, please keep us posted on the results of the trial. It sounds like from the limited information that has been posted, you might have a civil case against the ciy on this. Are you going to pursue this avenue? It seems like civil action is the only thing that will impact the current training that still seems to be either ineffective or not following KS State law. Wichita might have changed their ordinance to comply with with KS law, but it appears to the outside observer that they have not changed their enforcement policy/training....a few expensive lawsuits should change this unethical behavior...

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    MO
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom316 View Post
    Well due to my rather hectic schedule, it has taken me some time to get on here and reply to the thread I started. Initially, I posted a rather detailed account of the incident without thinking about the prosecution potentially trying to take my post and twist it in a way that could be used against me. After the reply from Grapeshot, I decided to revise my initial post until I had all the legal issues finalized. I think it it quite clear however that I will prevail in this case; the facts are simple and I was in complete accordance with the law. My attorney did express that from this point forward, I may want to consider carrying my firearm concealed to avoid getting harassed by the police. The issue is that I have refrained from getting a conceal carry license just based upon principle. I am not a attorney, but I was under the impression that the 2nd Amendment states that we have the right to bear arms. I have always wondered how the government has the power to require a license for a constitutional right?

    As far as firearm training is concerned, I have grown up around firearms, and utilize them heavily. I have also engaged in competition shooting, such as IDPA. Members of my family own quite a lot of farmland throughout Kansas, and I go out there regularly to practice my draw, practice rapid magazine changes, and moving while engaging on multiple targets that I set up. Furthermore, I have also paid for advanced pistol training, and am familiar with a wide array of high end firearms. I try to get in a minimum of 200 to 250 rounds of practice per week. I will be rather vague regarding the details of the incident, but it was at night while I was walking around my neighborhood trying to decompress from a rather stressful day. I live in a fairly affluent neighborhood that has relatively low crime. Nevertheless, having the ability to defend myself if necessary made the walk, intended to relieve my stress, more relaxing until I was approached by LEO's. I guess that my post at this point is just a public service announcement to anyone considering open carry in Wichita. I was still in a dressed in professional attire, and they had no reasonable suspicion or probably cause to make contact with me in the first place. Furthermore, the firearm that I was carrying falls into around the 1K range, and that is the used value. I do not see many criminals carrying firearms of this sort, esspecially openly carried in plain view.

    This may be slightly off topic, but to lighten the mood I would like to share a brief exchange I had with my local Rolex dealer when I was picking up my two-tone 18K yellow gold Submariner from being serviced and looking at a Yachtmaster I have had my eye on. He asked me if I had the watch insured due to the high value of the watch. I laughed and told him, "Yes, I do have an insurance policy set up, it is typically in the form of a 45 auto or a 9mm."
    Im calling BS on this. IF IM WRONG I WILL APOLOGIZE.

    Sir, what date was your "arrest"? Where were you "arrested" at? Who was the arresting officer? The name and badge # should be on the ticket you received...or were you taken to the county jail?

    You have the same style and other qualities of a poster who frequently makes bogus claims about LEOs/LEAs.Dont Wanna Cook like that, do you?

    We have a hard enough time getting by without fabrications from people. Again, if I am wrong I shall apologize.

    PLease let us know when and where you were arrested and the officers name or #, as that does not affect your "case" in any way shape or form, just ask your attorney.

    OTH

  13. #13
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North Chesterfield, Va.
    Posts
    34,616
    Quote Originally Posted by Onthehip View Post
    Im calling BS on this. IF IM WRONG I WILL APOLOGIZE.

    Sir, what date was your "arrest"? Where were you "arrested" at? Who was the arresting officer? The name and badge # should be on the ticket you received...or were you taken to the county jail?

    You have the same style and other qualities of a poster who frequently makes bogus claims about LEOs/LEAs.Dont Wanna Cook like that, do you?

    We have a hard enough time getting by without fabrications from people. Again, if I am wrong I shall apologize.

    PLease let us know when and where you were arrested and the officers name or #, as that does not affect your "case" in any way shape or form, just ask your attorney.

    OTH
    This goes back to 09-09-2012 w/o any confirmation of any sort - little reason to think that such will be forthcoming now.

    Do we have a drive-by story? Quite possible.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Wichita, KS
    Posts
    26
    I brought up this incident to all the guys I know and none of them have heard of it or learned anything new since it happened.

    I have only ever seen one other person OC in Wichita and he is in my circle, so maybe some of the other few around here are better updated. I have walked right by WPD on several occasions without a word from them so I am very curious about this story.

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    MO
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by KTCerberus View Post
    I brought up this incident to all the guys I know and none of them have heard of it or learned anything new since it happened.

    I have only ever seen one other person OC in Wichita and he is in my circle, so maybe some of the other few around here are better updated. I have walked right by WPD on several occasions without a word from them so I am very curious about this story.
    Thats what I was thinking. The few Wichita LEOs I know didnt know anything about it either. A certain member on here was outed a year or so ago for doing the same type of thing regarding another LE agency, (I searched to cite but the thread has been deleted apparently), yet he continues to post and get respect from other members. I eluded to his screen name in my original post. His writing style, use of words, etc just gives him away.

    I dont get the attraction to fabricating negative interactions with LEO and then posting it on a public forum. The LEOs I know dont care if legal citizens OC, so to start lying, making enemies and causing problems where none really exist is just another thorn in the side of our cause and has no place here or anywhere for that matter.
    Have a good weekend, all!

    OTH
    Last edited by Onthehip; 01-06-2013 at 08:02 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •