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Thread: age to do face to face sell and carry

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    age to do face to face sell and carry

    im 20 years old. a while back when looking to buy a handgun i read that i can get one through a ftf sale through someone who is not a ffl dealer since i have to be 21 to buy from a ffl dealer. and that i also could open carry on my hip since va law was 18 to open carry. and that i could carry anywhere as long as that place allowed handguns. everything that i found pointed me into believing this was all true until today when i went to a shooting range and the worker told me that was not true and that i have to be 21 no matter what and could only carry from home to range and back....

    can someone please give me factual information on this or know of some where in the hampton roads area that i can go and get it in writing.

  2. #2
    Activist Member Wolf_shadow's Avatar
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    age to do face to face sell and carry

    IANAL but the legal age in VA to OC is 18, and you can FtF purchase a handgun. Now as I recall you need to be 21 to purchase the ammo, so would need someone willing to supply such as a family member.

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  3. #3
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    What Wolf Shadow said.

    If shooting range employees were authorized and capable of giving legal advice....they wouldn't be shooting range employees.

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    thats how i felt to

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    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Federal law prohibits Federal firearms licensees from selling or delivering “any firearm or ammunition to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than eighteen years of age, and, if the firearm is other than a shotgun or rifle, or ammunition for a shotgun or rifle, to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than twenty-one years of age.” [18 U.S.C. § 922(b)(1)]


    Virginia law does not address age requirements for the purchase of ammunition. Federal law requires an individual to be at least 21 years of age to purchase handgun ammunition, and at least 18 years old to purchase rifle or shotgun ammunition.


    Private persons aren't restricted under federal or state law from selling handgun ammo to those >18 but <21.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    If shooting range employees were authorized and capable of giving legal advice....they wouldn't be shooting range employees.
    Carry On.

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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    Tell me again, what is the age to go serve in uniform and be killed in the Middle East wars "for" this country . . . . . . . . . ?
    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

    Hey, Libtards, it's the "Bill of Rights," not the "Bill of Needs" . . . . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by c_2010 View Post

    can someone please give me factual information on this or know of some where in the hampton roads area that i can go and get it in writing.
    Give this section of the VA code a read: http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+18.2-308.7

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    i get "carded" buying beer and smokes more then i do when buying a couple hundred rounds of handgun ammo.......
    Last edited by cptstoney; 09-21-2012 at 03:10 PM.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cptstoney View Post
    i get "carded" buying beer and smokes more then i do when buying a couple hundred rounds of handgun ammo.......
    I'd probably give them a tip if they carded me

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    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    I'd probably give them a tip if they carded me

    I just thank them for the ego boost.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cptstoney View Post
    i get "carded" buying beer and smokes more then i do when buying a couple hundred rounds of handgun ammo.......
    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    I'd probably give them a tip if they carded me
    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I just thank them for the ego boost.
    I picked up a couple of hundred rounds of .45 at Brook Rd Wally World after breakfast on Tuesday, saw the sign at the Sporting Goods checkout saying something to the effect of proof of age ID required for ammunition sales and was all ready to hand it over when the woman on the checkout told me it wasn't necessary in my case. Perhaps I should complain to corporate that I was made to feel old, despite the fact that I actually am. The ego boost would have been nice, especially as the number that I put in the box marked "age" is about to change by a factor of 1 this coming week.

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    Speaking of which, somewhat off-topic, but following the thread, I was driving from Winchester to Strasburg the other day and noticed the Gander Mountain sign just South of Winchester. So I got off I-81 and went in there, since I'd gotten an ad from them in the mail. I particularly wanted to take advantage of a good deal on some target ammo (1000 rounds of .223 American Eagle for $400), but they were all out. They said the truck would arrive the next day, but I told them I was just out there for the day from Warrenton and it wouldn't be worth it to me, given the cost of gas, to come back. The department manager, Alton, was very decent about it, and substituted a different (and better) deal for the one I'd missed. He said he'd hoped I'd feel better about shopping at Gander Mountain after that. I told him I felt better, already.

    Ok, back on topic: prior advice about possession of firearms and ammunition over the age of 18 was correct - it's just dealers who can't sell 'em to folks whose age is < 21. And there's no "straw purchase" rule as to ammunition, as long as the recipient is at least 18 and otherwise eligible to be in possession (not insane, an illegal immigrant, not a felon, etc.).
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

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    Hey good for you! I am Stationed in here in Virginia also. I am also from Texas so i was able to get my CHL in texas at 18 as long as you are military.
    But while i was 20 i opened carried where ever i could. Since VA does not honor my CHL till i turn 21. I grow to love it. Evan though i turned 21 i still open carry. You need to understand the laws on where you can and cant carry! That is the biggest thing! But carry on!!
    Oh to answer your question i got my pistol from armslist while i was 20. Face to face you only have to be 18.
    Last edited by logan_zugg; 09-24-2012 at 08:25 AM.

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    [QUOTE=scouser;1828091.... Perhaps I should complain to corporate that I was made to feel old, despite the fact that I actually am. The ego boost would have been nice, especially as the number that I put in the box marked "age" is about to change by a factor of 1 this coming week.[/QUOTE]

    Hippo birdies to you. Keep it up and in a while you will get to join the Oulde Phartes Club. Possession of suspenders is mandatory, but as of now there is no rule requiring you to wear them.

    stay safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Hippo birdies to you. Keep it up and in a while you will get to join the Oulde Phartes Club. Possession of suspenders is mandatory, but as of now there is no rule requiring you to wear them.

    stay safe.
    They are however a badge of identification that one member may recognize another. Also they provide a resting place for thumbs as prehensile ability diminishes. The upper tension they apply to to the waist band of trousers reduces the visibility of the dreaded downed zipper syndrome.

    A timely "snap" can be utilized to wake one from an unscheduled nap and they serve to provide a gripping point for others to assist your pedestrian directional control. Over all they are a functional fashion statement and a badge of I can't remember what.

    Did I say that additionally they assist in keeping your south bound bat belt within reach?

    OPC members rock.
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 09-25-2012 at 07:46 AM. Reason: added
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

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  17. #17
    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Possession of suspenders is mandatory, but as of now there is no rule requiring you to wear them.
    John Wesley Hardin. ... Hardin's gun had hung up on his suspenders allowing the Ranger time to hit Hardin over the head and subdue him.
    I suggest wearing suspenders where they aren't seen and can't get snagged by other items.
    Worn over an undershirt but under you outer garments... Nothing to get snagged on ...However you do lose those handy thumb rest.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Hippo birdies to you. Keep it up and in a while you will get to join the Oulde Phartes Club. Possession of suspenders is mandatory, but as of now there is no rule requiring you to wear them.

    stay safe.
    thanks skid, it's actually today and after some thought this morning I realized there is now a "6" at the end of my age. I was just saying to Courtney this morning, when Logan & I went out for breakfast, that there used to be a time I woke up on my birthday and knew how old I was. In recent years I've found myself having to subtract my year of birth from the current year to figure out my age. We couldn't decide if that was due to no longer really caring how old I am or my increasing age causing my memory to diminish. There is also the 3rd possibility that I'm just subconsciously blocking it out.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouser View Post
    thanks skid, it's actually today and after some thought this morning I realized there is now a "6" at the end of my age. I was just saying to Courtney this morning, when Logan & I went out for breakfast, that there used to be a time I woke up on my birthday and knew how old I was. In recent years I've found myself having to subtract my year of birth from the current year to figure out my age. We couldn't decide if that was due to no longer really caring how old I am or my increasing age causing my memory to diminish. There is also the 3rd possibility that I'm just subconsciously blocking it out.


    You be having a happy one now, you here. This one and all of the nextuns.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  20. #20
    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    Thanks Grape .. I do have to confess a non-desire to own or wear suspenders, however. Although I've lived here for almost 12 years now and have picked up a large chunk of the language in these here parts, there are times when the first thing I think of when I hear a word is what that word means in the kind of English that is my first language. "Suspenders" means something entirely different in the language I grew up with and among the male population are generally only worn by Judges, Members of Parliament and the very knowledgeable Mr Eddie Izzard.

  21. #21
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouser View Post
    Thanks Grape .. I do have to confess a non-desire to own or wear suspenders, however. Although I've lived here for almost 12 years now and have picked up a large chunk of the language in these here parts, there are times when the first thing I think of when I hear a word is what that word means in the kind of English that is my first language. "Suspenders" means something entirely different in the language I grew up with and among the male population are generally only worn by Judges, Members of Parliament and the very knowledgeable Mr Eddie Izzard.
    That would be what we commonly call men's garters.

    My grandpappy wore "braces" - an out of style word meaning suspenders.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  22. #22
    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    WRONG. The EXACT same "straw purchase" statute applies to ammunition equally as it does to firearms:

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/922



    A "straw purchase" violates the above statute when the purchaser answers "yes" to the question on the form 4473, "Are you the actual purchaser of this firearm" thus making a false written statement. Normally, that question is not asked during a purchase of ammunition.

    Dad goes into dealer to purchase ammunition intended to be used in a handgun on behalf of his 19 year old son. Dealer asks, "Handgun or rifle?" Dad answers, "Handgun." Dealer asks, "Over 21?". Dad says, "Yep, here's my ID, 43 years old." No false oral or written statement has been made and no statute violated because the delear never asked, "Are you the actual purchaser of this ammunition?" and the dad never claimed that he was.
    Stupid outdated law......yet again!!!!!!!!


    Never had anyone ask a question like that in person.. Now I have seen statements online but don't remember where...
    Never had a dealer ask what firearm I intended to use once I appeared to be over 21yr old.

    The lines are also blurred since many rifle and handguns are chambered for the same calibers.....
    Hence a person 18><21 probably would not face questions for 5.56/.223 ammo purchases but would face question for .357mag/9mm/40/45/44 etc.. yet handgun and rifles are readily available for all of the above. And let us not forget the lowly .22LR.....


    As a parent it would most likely be a gift or a sale after the fact....
    As a friend it would be a sale after the fact...
    I buy ammo and a friend buys it from me after I determine I have more than I need etc....
    The crime in the straw sale is the false statement made under penalty of perjury etc.....
    Last edited by Marco; 09-25-2012 at 04:37 PM.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Virginia Joe View Post
    Tell me again, what is the age to go serve in uniform and be killed in the Middle East wars "for" this country . . . . . . . . . ?
    17 yrs old with parental permission ... 18 otherwise ...

    And I agree !

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