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Thread: Ignorant NM State Patrol

  1. #1
    Regular Member FoxxTrixx's Avatar
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    Angry Ignorant NM State Patrol

    I telephoned the SP station in Socorro to inquire about a CC permit. I don't quite meet the requirements yet (DUI 4 years ago, I need to be clear for 5 years). So I said, "Well, that's okay, I can open carry until then." The dispatcher told me that I needed a permit for ANY carrying of a weapon, open or otherwise. I said, "No, New Mexico is an open carry state. I can wear a holstered sidearm anywhere in public and on most other property. I know where I can't." She adamantly insisted I needed a permit. I told her to ask someone higher up the food chain to confirm what I had said. After a few minutes on hold, she came back with this (and these are her words, verbatim--I remembered):

    "I asked my sergeant and he said, 'Oh no no no, he needs a permit' "

    That's just plain BS. Shouldn't State Patrol of all agencies know that law? New Mexico statute deals only with CONCEALED weapons and says nothing about openly-displayed firearms carried in a responsible manner (i.e., not waving it around, being sober). I just open carried into a mercantile to buy some ammo; shop owner did not even make a comment. She glanced down once at the .380 and did a little smile, in fact.

    I will continue to carry in public. I am not trying to taunt the police or anything, or make a statement, or intimidate people--I just want to enjoy my rights and protect myself. I truly hate confrontation, but should I let them push me around? It's about time I stood up for myself.

  2. #2
    Regular Member DocWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxxTrixx View Post
    I telephoned the SP station in Socorro to inquire about a CC permit. I don't quite meet the requirements yet (DUI 4 years ago, I need to be clear for 5 years). So I said, "Well, that's okay, I can open carry until then." The dispatcher told me that I needed a permit for ANY carrying of a weapon, open or otherwise. I said, "No, New Mexico is an open carry state. I can wear a holstered sidearm anywhere in public and on most other property. I know where I can't." She adamantly insisted I needed a permit. I told her to ask someone higher up the food chain to confirm what I had said. After a few minutes on hold, she came back with this (and these are her words, verbatim--I remembered):

    "I asked my sergeant and he said, 'Oh no no no, he needs a permit' "

    That's just plain BS. Shouldn't State Patrol of all agencies know that law? New Mexico statute deals only with CONCEALED weapons and says nothing about openly-displayed firearms carried in a responsible manner (i.e., not waving it around, being sober). I just open carried into a mercantile to buy some ammo; shop owner did not even make a comment. She glanced down once at the .380 and did a little smile, in fact.

    I will continue to carry in public. I am not trying to taunt the police or anything, or make a statement, or intimidate people--I just want to enjoy my rights and protect myself. I truly hate confrontation, but should I let them push me around? It's about time I stood up for myself.
    I would do the following:

    1. Get her name and the name of the Sgt.

    2. Contact the State Police Chief and inform him of what happened and ask for a copy the STATE LAW that backs up the officers.

    3. If they can't produce the STATE LAW then either contact the Gov or the press and tell them the little story of how ignorant the officers are and that training needs to be required.

  3. #3
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    Try to understand that those answering phones at the sub-stations are generally NOT law enforcement officers, not trained or well versed in all state laws and [unfortunately] may have a personal agenda that's not exactly pro-firearms. Basically, most are secretaries or admin types.

    If you want accurate information regarding firearms law in NM, you should ALWAYS call 505-841-8053, the concealed carry unit of the NM State Police. You should ask for Sgt Skasik or Director Bill Hubbard.

    That said, there's no problem with your open carry, regardless of the DUI. Remember the off-limits areas and you're golden.

    Steve Aikens
    Last edited by steveaikens; 10-12-2012 at 09:15 AM.

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    Ignorant NM State Patrol

    Simple..... NEVER ASK LAW ENFORCEMENT FOR LEGAL ADVICE. They are the incorrect source for accurate information. Ask the people that actually passed the BAR exam.


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    I dui disqualifies you from a CC? Are they NUTS? How does this relate to your gun rights?

    Its retarded !

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    Regular Member FoxxTrixx's Avatar
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    Thanks for speaking up all you guys, and I appreciate the info. Glad to be among kindred folk.

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    Regular Member FoxxTrixx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I dui disqualifies you from a CC? Are they NUTS? How does this relate to your gun rights?

    Its retarded !
    I completely agree with you. At least they don't take away my right to carry unconcealed.

    On a related note: why does a cop ask to search your vehicle when he stops you for a burned-out license plate light? How do the two relate???
    Last edited by FoxxTrixx; 10-13-2012 at 08:50 AM.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxxTrixx
    On a related note: why does a cop ask to search your vehicle when he stops you for a burned-out license plate light? How do the two relate???
    They don't relate, other than that there's an officer & a citizen in the same place at the same time.
    Why do they do it?
    Because that's what they're trained to do.
    They're trying to find some reason to arrest you or at least write you a ticket.
    And if they have to ask, they don't have reasonable articulable suspicion (RAS) or probable cause (PC).
    To borrow a phrase, just say no.
    Ignore the "if you have nothing to hide" comments which are almost inevitable.
    If you wouldn't let any other complete stranger go through your private property, why would you agree to have an officer (who does not have any good intention) do so?

    Watch the videos at www.flexyourrights.org or on YouTube posted by the same group.
    Also on YT, watch the 45-ish minute video titled "don't talk to police". It's a law professor & a former officer explaining why you should never talk to police (unless, of course, you've asked them for help).
    Well worth the time.

    ETA: I second (third?) what others have said - don't ask police for legal advice, unless it's a specialized unit which deals specifically with the issue, like the licensing division. As you browse the site, you'll find many examples from across the country of ... (I'll be kind) uninformed ... officers who don't know the laws r/t lawfully armed citizens (LAC).
    Last edited by MKEgal; 10-13-2012 at 09:19 AM.
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  9. #9
    Regular Member XDm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I dui disqualifies you from a CC? Are they NUTS? How does this relate to your gun rights?

    Its retarded !
    Maybe it has something to do with the demonstrated unreliability and lack of sound judgement to operate a motor vehicle safely (a deadly weapon) in the presence of alcohol? BTW, we aren't the only state that limits licensed carry for people that can't be trusted with motor vehicles and alcohol.
    Last edited by XDm; 10-17-2012 at 10:49 AM.

  10. #10
    Regular Member FoxxTrixx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XDm View Post
    Maybe it has something to do with the demonstrated unreliability and lack of sound judgement to operate a motor vehicle safely
    How many accidents and tickets have you had, pal? In 30+ years of driving including DOT certified miles I've had one speeding, one DUI just barely at the legal limit. My insurance rates are probably less than yours.

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    Regular Member ncwabbit's Avatar
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    pictures are worth a thousand words...data from 09 (latest available) correlation between driving while impaired and fatalities in the land time forgot...

    http://www.unm.edu/~dgrint/reports/dwirep/dwir09.pdf
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    A person who has for untold centuries maintained the imposing position of spiritual head of four-fifths of the human race...
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  12. #12
    Regular Member XDm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxxTrixx View Post
    I've had one speeding, one DUI just barely at the legal limit.
    I think the moment that you realize this is more of a failure than an accomplishment you'll begin to better comprehend the concerns with alcohol and gun carry.

    As for insurance rates, I can tell you that when I joined the police dept and my rates dropped below that of the rest of the public rates for males in my age group I stopped caring what everybody else paid. I know quite well what alcohol does to people 'just barely at the legal limit'. I've seen the violence, destruction, and stupidity carried out by people 'barely at the legal limit' and I'm glad states like NM attempt to hold people accountable in that respect.

    I feel bad about the misinformation you were given from Socorro but I congratulate you on the 4yr point in your 5yr journey to your CCW and I'm glad you pursued the truth about your OC rights. I personally would've held the dept accountable for providing the documentation to support their claims regarding permit requirements.

  13. #13
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XDm View Post
    I think the moment that you realize this is more of a failure than an accomplishment you'll begin to better comprehend the concerns with alcohol and gun carry.

    As for insurance rates, I can tell you that when I joined the police dept and my rates dropped below that of the rest of the public rates for males in my age group I stopped caring what everybody else paid. I know quite well what alcohol does to people 'just barely at the legal limit'. I've seen the violence, destruction, and stupidity carried out by people 'barely at the legal limit' and I'm glad states like NM attempt to hold people accountable in that respect.

    I feel bad about the misinformation you were given from Socorro but I congratulate you on the 4yr point in your 5yr journey to your CCW and I'm glad you pursued the truth about your OC rights. I personally would've held the dept accountable for providing the documentation to support their claims regarding permit requirements.
    If you are currently a LEO. Why do you ask a citizen, who has been given false information, to correct a training issue in a LEA? Why don't you correct the training issue now that you know that a training issue is present in a LEA. Is it not better to affect change from within than from without?
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member XDm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Is it not better to affect change from within than from without?
    No, it is better to effect change from the outside. Read up on the gun ban legislation regarding NM State Parks here in the NM forums. State Park administration could easily change their gun policy on their own but because it is being driven in part by public interaction (from the outside) they'll long remember why the change was necessary. It's ok for people to bring issues like this to forums for public awareness but people need to realize they are empowered by the very laws that govern this state and great country and learn to speak up for themselves. If and when they've exhausted every means to correct issues or rights that are due them as citizens, and I agree with their side, then I get involved.

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