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Thread: help with K-12 school property ? (apologies in advance to peter nap .. lol)

  1. #1
    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    help with K-12 school property ? (apologies in advance to peter nap .. lol)

    My knitting pattern problem .......

    Basic gist of the issue is I have to take Logan to an appointment at a middle school tomorrow. I realize I can't carry in the school, but I'm trying to understand the language in the exceptions.

    The exemptions set out in 18.2-308 shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section. The provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) persons who possess such weapon or weapons as a part of the school's curriculum or activities; (ii) a person possessing a knife customarily used for food preparation or service and using it for such purpose; (iii) persons who possess such weapon or weapons as a part of any program sponsored or facilitated by either the school or any organization authorized by the school to conduct its programs either on or off the school premises; (iv) any law-enforcement officer; (v) any person who possesses a knife or blade which he uses customarily in his trade; (vi) a person who possesses an unloaded firearm that is in a closed container, or a knife having a metal blade, in or upon a motor vehicle, or an unloaded shotgun or rifle in a firearms rack in or upon a motor vehicle; or (vii) a person who has a valid concealed handgun permit and possesses a concealed handgun while in a motor vehicle in a parking lot, traffic circle, or other means of vehicular ingress or egress to the school. For the purposes of this paragraph, "weapon" includes a knife having a metal blade of three inches or longer and "closed container" includes a locked vehicle trunk.
    yes I have the CHP, but does that mean I'm able to leave it loaded 'concealed' in a locked glovebox while we are in the school, or am I correct in my thinking that if I leave it in the vehicle I must first ensure it is unloaded.

    We are going somewhere else, very close to the school, after our appointment and I'd rather not have to come home between errands so if I've got to unload then I've got to unload, I'm just trying to understand the wording.

  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    From VCDL Alert

    MOTOR VEHICLES AND VESSELS

    For those who do not have a CHP, starting July 1 they can have a loaded handgun with them concealed in their motor vehicle or vessel as long as the handgun is secured in a container (such as a zipped bag, closed gun case, closed briefcase, etc.) or in a compartment (glovebox, console, etc.).

    NOTE: Remember that if you don't have a CHP, you generally can't carry a handgun in such a closed container OUTSIDE of your motor vehicle or vessel.

    K-12 SCHOOLS

    The new vehicle carry law, above, has an additional benefit for BOTH CHP holders and non-CHP holders. Under the law effective July 1, a loaded handgun can be kept in a secured container or a secured compartment in a motor vehicle while on K-12 school property.

    The new vehicle carry law (18.2-308 B 10) is in the list of general exemptions from the concealed weapon law. Police officers and Commonwealth Attorneys, for example, are listed in 18.2-308 B. The key is that in the third paragraph of the K-12 school weapons law (18.2-308.1) it says that anyone exempted from the concealed weapon law is also exempted from the ban on guns on K-12 school property.

    Thus, as long as your loaded handgun is in a secured compartment or a secured container BEFORE you pull onto school property and REMAINS SECURED in that compartment or container UNTIL AFTER you pull off the property, you are legal.

    In case those of you with CHPs are wondering why you can't carry outside of your vehicle on K-12 school property, that's because the CHP wording (18.2-308 D) is NOT in the list of exemptions to the concealed weapon law (18.2-308 B and 18.2-308 C). Instead, you can think of your CHP as a "get out of jail free" card. You are not actually exempted from the concealed carry law, but you have an affirmative defense against any prosecution.

    I think we should be working to exempt CHP holders from the concealed weapon law.
    Carry On.

    Ed

    VirginiaOpenCarry.Org (Coins, Shirts and Patches)
    - - - -
    For VA Open Carry Cards send a S.A.2S.E. to: Ed's OC cards, Box 16143, Wash DC 20041-6143 (they are free but some folks enclose a couple bucks too)

  3. #3
    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed View Post
    .. snip ..
    Thus, as long as your loaded handgun is in a secured compartment or a secured container BEFORE you pull onto school property and REMAINS SECURED in that compartment or container UNTIL AFTER you pull off the property, you are legal.
    even if you park the vehicle and leave it while you go inside the building?

    sorry if I appear stupid about this, I'm just trying to process the legaleze and keep myself both legal and safe(ish)

  4. #4
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouser View Post
    even if you park the vehicle and leave it while you go inside the building?(ish)
    That's the way I read it.
    Carry On.

    Ed

    VirginiaOpenCarry.Org (Coins, Shirts and Patches)
    - - - -
    For VA Open Carry Cards send a S.A.2S.E. to: Ed's OC cards, Box 16143, Wash DC 20041-6143 (they are free but some folks enclose a couple bucks too)

  5. #5
    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    thanks

  6. #6
    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scouser View Post
    even if you park the vehicle and leave it while you go inside the building?
    Yes, since the exemption allows you to store the gun in a secure container, and then once you exit the vehicle, you are no longer "carrying it on or about your person".
    James Reynolds

    NRA Certified Firearms Instructor - Pistol, Shotgun, Home Firearms Safety, Refuse To Be A Victim
    Concealed Firearms Instructor for Virginia, Florida & Utah permits.
    NRA Certified Chief Range Safety Officer
    Sabre Red Pepper Spray Instructor
    Glock Certified Armorer
    Instructor Bio - http://proactiveshooters.com/about-us/

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed View Post
    From VCDL Alert

    MOTOR VEHICLES AND VESSELS

    For those who do not have a CHP, starting July 1 they can have a loaded handgun with them concealed in their motor vehicle or vessel as long as the handgun is secured in a container (such as a zipped bag, closed gun case, closed briefcase, etc.) or in a compartment (glovebox, console, etc.).

    NOTE: Remember that if you don't have a CHP, you generally can't carry a handgun in such a closed container OUTSIDE of your motor vehicle or vessel.

    K-12 SCHOOLS

    The new vehicle carry law, above, has an additional benefit for BOTH CHP holders and non-CHP holders. Under the law effective July 1, a loaded handgun can be kept in a secured container or a secured compartment in a motor vehicle while on K-12 school property.

    The new vehicle carry law (18.2-308 B 10) is in the list of general exemptions from the concealed weapon law. Police officers and Commonwealth Attorneys, for example, are listed in 18.2-308 B. The key is that in the third paragraph of the K-12 school weapons law (18.2-308.1) it says that anyone exempted from the concealed weapon law is also exempted from the ban on guns on K-12 school property.

    Thus, as long as your loaded handgun is in a secured compartment or a secured container BEFORE you pull onto school property and REMAINS SECURED in that compartment or container UNTIL AFTER you pull off the property, you are legal.

    In case those of you with CHPs are wondering why you can't carry outside of your vehicle on K-12 school property, that's because the CHP wording (18.2-308 D) is NOT in the list of exemptions to the concealed weapon law (18.2-308 B and 18.2-308 C). Instead, you can think of your CHP as a "get out of jail free" card. You are not actually exempted from the concealed carry law, but you have an affirmative defense against any prosecution.

    I think we should be working to exempt CHP holders from the concealed weapon law.
    That is the type of posting that newbies (like me) and everyone (unless I'm out of line) will find very informative and my thanks goes out to Ed for his detailed answer.

  8. #8
    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acfreddie View Post
    That is the type of posting that newbies (like me) and everyone (unless I'm out of line) will find very informative
    Many have benefitted from taking this class - http://proactiveshooters.com/general...d-carry-in-va/
    James Reynolds

    NRA Certified Firearms Instructor - Pistol, Shotgun, Home Firearms Safety, Refuse To Be A Victim
    Concealed Firearms Instructor for Virginia, Florida & Utah permits.
    NRA Certified Chief Range Safety Officer
    Sabre Red Pepper Spray Instructor
    Glock Certified Armorer
    Instructor Bio - http://proactiveshooters.com/about-us/

  9. #9
    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acfreddie View Post
    That is the type of posting that newbies (like me) and everyone (unless I'm out of line) will find very informative and my thanks goes out to Ed for his detailed answer.
    Wholeheartedly agree, and add my thanks to Ed, but can't resist the opportunity to point out one more time that this was from a VCDL Alert, a FREE e-mail newsletter that every Virginia gun owner should be getting and reading!

    http://www.vcdl.org/va-alert.html

    TFred
    Last edited by TFred; 10-11-2012 at 11:45 PM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ProShooter View Post
    Many have benefitted from taking this class - http://proactiveshooters.com/general...d-carry-in-va/
    I have been reading about these classes for the wife and myself, I just need to stop buying guns and ammunition at the pace that I am, so we can actually afford to attend the more advanced classes.

  11. #11
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acfreddie View Post
    I have been reading about these classes for the wife and myself, I just need to stop buying guns and ammunition at the pace that I am, so we can actually afford to attend the more advanced classes.
    Jim offers good classes and unlike 98% of other instructors, even the one's that profess their support of OC (Which IMO they don't)...he does OC as much as I do, maybe more.

    It's always good to learn from a true believer in all forms of carry, rather than someone wearing his persona De Jour.

  12. #12
    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Jim offers good classes.....

    Some even say.......




    James Reynolds

    NRA Certified Firearms Instructor - Pistol, Shotgun, Home Firearms Safety, Refuse To Be A Victim
    Concealed Firearms Instructor for Virginia, Florida & Utah permits.
    NRA Certified Chief Range Safety Officer
    Sabre Red Pepper Spray Instructor
    Glock Certified Armorer
    Instructor Bio - http://proactiveshooters.com/about-us/

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