SpringerXDacp
New member
There's no lawful exception, actually a provision, for non-military. MSP simply recommends:
For the military folks:
-
We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
-
If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
-
Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.
Headed to Detroit from northern Kentucky with no carry permit
- Thread starter eagleye
- Start date
There's no lawful exception, actually a provision, for non-military. MSP simply recommends:
For the military folks:
Big Gay Al
Michigan Moderator
And that's what I was told by MSP when I called, 11 years ago.
Of course, the nice officer I talked to went a little further. He told me I shouldn't try to go target shooting anywhere, or move the pistols out of my new home in Michigan until I have registered them. He explained if something bad happened, I could end up with more legal trouble than I'd probably want. I decided his advice was probably well intended, and more than likely true. Fortunately, it didn't take long for me to establish residency.
Last edited:
SpringerXDacp
New member
And that's what I was told by MSP when I called, 11 years ago.
Of course, the nice officer I talked to went a little further. He told me I shouldn't try to go target shooting anywhere, or move the pistols out of my new home in Michigan until I have registered them. He explained if something bad happened, I could end up with more legal trouble than I'd probably want. I decided his advice was probably well intended, and more than likely true. Fortunately, it didn't take long for me to establish residency.
It has been known to happen (LE advice) from time to time, but unfortunately, not often enough.
*Seeking shelter in basement preparing for inbound SCUD*
Small_Arms_Collector
Regular Member
And that's what I was told by MSP when I called, 11 years ago.
Of course, the nice officer I talked to went a little further. He told me I shouldn't try to go target shooting anywhere, or move the pistols out of my new home in Michigan until I have registered them. He explained if something bad happened, I could end up with more legal trouble than I'd probably want. I decided his advice was probably well intended, and more than likely true. Fortunately, it didn't take long for me to establish residency.
Fortunately not having a pistol registered is now only a civil infraction. Best bet if you want to cover all your bases is just to print out some RI-60's, and mail them in before you come in to the state (if your moving here).
Now as for visiting Detroit, like others have said, possession of a pistol without a CPL from your HOME STATE is illegal.
Some words of caution if you have never visited Detroit before since no one has mentioned it yet:
Coming to Detroit unarmed is extremely dangerous, Detroit statistically has a higher murder rate than the entire countries of Iraq, and Afghanistan combined, Detroit is one of the most dangerous, and crime ridden cities on Earth, come unarmed at your own risk.
If you do come to Detroit, stay inside the people mover tracks, this is the "Green Zone", it's heavily patrolled by police, and is relatively safe, the farther you get from the Green Zone the deeper in to Indian country you get, and the greater the danger, also stay inside at night, particularly if you are outside the Green Zone.
The suburbs are mostly safe, particularly the ones to the West, and North, though the outer ones are safer than the inner ones. You should avoid Lincoln Park, Highland Park, Redford, Wayne, and Westland, and any of the other smaller inner suburbs with the exception of those to the North.
Navigating the streets of Detroit is next to impossible, even with a map, and compass. Most street signs have been stolen, and many of the remaining ones are incorrect (sometimes deliberately). The city is riddled with one way streets, and they seem to appear at random. Service drives are non existent. There is not a single strait street in the city, the city completely lacks a traditional grid layout, and streets are seemingly laid out randomly, they end abruptly, cut off at weird angles, and randomly turn in to other streets, and one ways, there is no rhyme, or reason to it, and remember there are no signs for the most part, and the remaining ones are often wrong, or misleading. Additionally many of the streets, particularly the smaller ones are obstructed with debri, rubble, and burned cars, and many manhole covers are missing.
The residents of Detroit do not know how to drive, and can not be counted on to obey the rules of the road, traffic laws, signs, or signals or even common sense, and the pedestrians are just as stupid, and will often dart directly out in to traffic without even once looking for oncoming cars.
Do NOT get off the freeway to detour around unless you have no choice, as I mentioned, there is no such thing as a service drive, or grid in Detroit, getting back on to the freeway may be next to impossible, and will likely require you to drive many miles over random streets to get back to the freeway who's on ramp was just a half mile from where you got off. The last time I had to get off 94 for gas it took nearly a half hour to get back on to the freeway despite the on ramp being only a few hundred feet away as none of the streets go in a strait line, again there is no logic to the street layout in Detroit. On that same trip to the gas station, I ended up on a random dead end debris strewn street, and was nearly ambushed as someone rolled a tire across the road to block my path, I was able to swerve around it, but I spent the entire time with one hand on the wheel, and the other on my Glock.
I treat the entire area south of 8 Mile, and East of Telegraph as a no mans land, I do not go there unless necessary, and never unarmed. The city of Detroit is like the Lord Of The Flies, there is no civilization there, entire sections of the city look like something out of Mad max, or a scene from Red Dawn chain link fence across windows, razor wire on roofs, holes BLOWN in walls with the rubble, and debris strewn across the street, burned cars on the side of the road, collapsed roofs, it looks like an artillery strike. It's like driving through Beirut, or Grozny. The only thing missing is sandbags, and I'm sure there somewhere.
Last edited:
okiebryan
Regular Member
This message brought to you by the Detroit Chamber of Commerce :lol:
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/10...says-war-like-detroit-is-unsafe-for-visitors/
There's a flyer, but it cannot be shrunk down to managable size.
There's also a poll: are you afraid to visit Detroit? Most of the residents who have responded say "Yes".
As they used to ask during WWII gas rationing - is this trip neccessary?
stay safe.
There's a flyer, but it cannot be shrunk down to managable size.
There's also a poll: are you afraid to visit Detroit? Most of the residents who have responded say "Yes".
As they used to ask during WWII gas rationing - is this trip neccessary?
stay safe.
SpringerXDacp
New member
He would be in direct violation of 28.422, as he:
A) Has no license/permit to carry, possess, transport, etc.
B) He is not a legal resident of this state.
C) RI-060's (28.422a), apply to persons licensed under the act (CPL) in Michigan.
Scooter123
Regular Member
I'm not a lawyer however I think that we may be reading a bit too much into that single provision. I think that a competent lawyer would be able to easily argue that if a state does not issue a specific license for an activity that the State is IMPLICITLY granting a "license" for that activity. To be more specific, Kentucky has granted the OP a license to own and transport a handgun or rifle as a consequence of his living in Kentucky, thus his state issued ID or Drivers License is also his "firearms license". However, because he doesn't have a Kentucky Concealed Carry permit and Kentucky does issues these permits, this means that he cannot carry concealed in Michigan. I would also expect that a non resident using Open Carry would face an even higher risk for arrest and if Open Carry is NOT legal in Kentucky, he would have no defense in Court based in an Implicit License Argument. As for out of state Hunters using long guns, no problems with that at all and this has a history going back for many many years. If an out of state hunter can get a deer or elk tag he is perfectly welcome to come to Michigan with his long gun and his Money.
The remaining issue is transport and if he's going through Ohio there is a "Gotcha" within Ohio's laws. Ohio is a state that considers a LOADED MAGAZINE AS A CONCEALED WEAPON. Even if you don't have a firearm in your car. Most of the time these charges get plead down in a plea deal, however if you are facing a very anti gun DA you could be looking at a Felony and hard time in Prison. If you don't have a concealed carry permit you have to make sure that every single magazine with you is completely and totally unloaded. If you are a bit paranoid and OCD you may want to dis-assemble your magazines into loose parts and lock all of your ammunition up in a handgun safe separate from the lock box for your guns.
I'll also note that 1000 foot rule concerning firearms does NOT take into account the condition of the firearm. Technically just having a receiver for an AR-15 or similar firearm and nothing else is a VIOLATION of Federal Law. UNLESS YOU HAVE A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT, which grants an exemption to this Law. Take the hint here, get yourself a Concealed Carry Permit.
BTW, technically this exemption to the 1000 foot rule ONLY applies in your state of residence, however most states will "grant" this exemption as part of a Reciprocity agreement. Note, if you are a real ***** when stopped out of your home state that "gentleman's agreement" to extend that exemption under Reciprocity carries no weight under the Federal Law and you could face charges. Point is, if you are carrying out of state you want to be on your very best behavior and not cop an attitude if you are stopped for speeding or the like.
The remaining issue is transport and if he's going through Ohio there is a "Gotcha" within Ohio's laws. Ohio is a state that considers a LOADED MAGAZINE AS A CONCEALED WEAPON. Even if you don't have a firearm in your car. Most of the time these charges get plead down in a plea deal, however if you are facing a very anti gun DA you could be looking at a Felony and hard time in Prison. If you don't have a concealed carry permit you have to make sure that every single magazine with you is completely and totally unloaded. If you are a bit paranoid and OCD you may want to dis-assemble your magazines into loose parts and lock all of your ammunition up in a handgun safe separate from the lock box for your guns.
I'll also note that 1000 foot rule concerning firearms does NOT take into account the condition of the firearm. Technically just having a receiver for an AR-15 or similar firearm and nothing else is a VIOLATION of Federal Law. UNLESS YOU HAVE A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT, which grants an exemption to this Law. Take the hint here, get yourself a Concealed Carry Permit.
BTW, technically this exemption to the 1000 foot rule ONLY applies in your state of residence, however most states will "grant" this exemption as part of a Reciprocity agreement. Note, if you are a real ***** when stopped out of your home state that "gentleman's agreement" to extend that exemption under Reciprocity carries no weight under the Federal Law and you could face charges. Point is, if you are carrying out of state you want to be on your very best behavior and not cop an attitude if you are stopped for speeding or the like.
KYGlockster
Activist Member
Open carry is legal in KY -- whether in your vehicle or on your person -- without having a license. We only need a license to CONCEAL a deadly weapon under certain circumstances. Having said this, whether OC is legal or not in KY is completely irrelevant. It is illegal for him to carry his loaded firearm in his vehicle in Michigan, and it is illegal to carry it on his person without a license as well. What KY law allows would be of no use as a defense in a Michigan court for a charge of carrying a firearm without the needed license/permit to do so.
I thought Michigan was supposed to be gun friendly! I just researched a little, and MI has some completely ignorant and useless firearm restrictions.
Last edited:
xmanhockey7
Regular Member
- Joined
- Jun 15, 2010
- Messages
- 1,195
The law does not require a resident permit to possess here just carry concealed.
ETA: Sorry I thought this was already posted.
Last edited:
Michigander
Regular Member
In response to this subject, yes, you are correct in your assessment, home state is only required for CC, and all forms of vehicle carry. OC while on foot is fine with a non resident, out of state license.
FreeInAZ
Regular Member
Man you guys have some SCREWED UP laws in MI :shocker:
Michigander
Regular Member
This is true, however we can carry into schools, and other places you guys can't. Plus preemption here doesn't allow public institutions to require us to check guns at the door.
FreeInAZ
Regular Member
This is true, however we can carry into schools, and other places you guys can't. Plus preemption here doesn't allow public institutions to require us to check guns at the door.
Yep you got me there, however if memory serves correct, some who have legally carried into schools have been charged in MI (falsely). Also after the elections in MI. I would not be surprised if you see your elected officials trying to keep guns out of "their buildings". They can see that the pro-rights/gun community in MI is in shambles, with no unity, so it's only a matter of time before they exploit this fatal weakness.
Now on a Nanner Nanner Nanner note: I can carry any damn knife/sword/machete without worrying about getting jammed up like you guys in MI as KNIVES ARE ALSO PREEMPTED HERE IN AZ
(Thanks Jared & Fred).
Last edited:
Michigander
Regular Member
This is true. I miss carrying a dagger, a switch blade, an ASP and a 45, all without worrying about some jerk cop hassling me.
FreeInAZ
Regular Member
For those who may not know what a ASP is: (Telescoping Baton) https://www.asp-usa.com/store/batons.html
This brings up another bizarre "problem" with MI. law. While it is not illegal to carry a pistol or other type of more accurate firearm, if you carry a baton/nightstick (less lethal) you can go to jail?
Talk about lack of logic.At least they got the important part right.
Last edited:
Michigander
Regular Member
Some time ago I almost had to kill a deranged man, because my only available option was my pistols, whereas my baton would have done the job swiftly and with little trouble. (I'm not going to get more specific than that)
The experience put it very clearly in perspective why it's so twisted and wrong to only preempt firearms. I suppose no one thinks it's much of an issue, because being political activists with a LEIN "rap sheet" 20 miles long, we're the only ones liable to be pinched for local laws against less lethals.
The experience put it very clearly in perspective why it's so twisted and wrong to only preempt firearms. I suppose no one thinks it's much of an issue, because being political activists with a LEIN "rap sheet" 20 miles long, we're the only ones liable to be pinched for local laws against less lethals.
FreeInAZ
Regular Member
You bring up a very valid point. There are times when a pistol is the wrong tool for the emergency at hand. But MI lawmakers force you into a Lethal situation. Hell - up until recently you guys could only carry a watered down version of pepper spray? Really: carry a pistol but not a spray strong enough to ward off a toy poodle
Again another example of the irrational laws on the books in MI.
Again another example of the irrational laws on the books in MI.