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Thread: School district is a local unit of gov't ?

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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    Public Act 4 of 2011 would: "Establish criteria to assess the financial condition of local government units, including school districts, authorize the governor to appoint an emergency manager (EM) upon state finding of a financial emergency, and allow the EM to act in place of local government officials.


    it would seem to me that if this passes there should be no doubts. thoughts

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    Quote Originally Posted by HOWUDOINGOOD View Post
    Public Act 4 of 2011 would: "Establish criteria to assess the financial condition of local government units, including school districts, authorize the governor to appoint an emergency manager (EM) upon state finding of a financial emergency, and allow the EM to act in place of local government officials.


    it would seem to me that if this passes there should be no doubts. thoughts
    123.1101 Definitions.
    Sec. 1.

    As used in this act:

    (a) “Local unit of government” means a city, village, township, or county.

    Do you see "school district" is there? No? Ok, case closed.

    Take special note of the words "as used in THIS act". No other law matters.
    Last edited by scot623; 10-16-2012 at 11:04 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    123.1101 Definitions.
    Sec. 1.

    As used in this act:

    (a) “Local unit of government” means a city, village, township, or county.

    Do you see "school district" is there? No? Ok, case closed.

    Take special note of the words "as used in THIS act". No other law matters.

    Not quite.

    IS a school district a local unit of government? Yes, yes it is.

    Is it preempted by MCL 123.1102 - well no, because a Local Unit of Government doesn't include school districts, therefore they aren't explicitly preempted.

    Now we're trying to get a binding decision that states the legislature really intended to preempt ALL local units of government, not just the four listed, but until that happens...

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    FWIW, Public Act 4 has already been enacted (thus it is a public act). It is currently in referendum as 12-1. Vote yes on 12-1.

    That being said, what zig said is correct on this matter.
    Last edited by TheQ; 10-17-2012 at 02:43 AM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    scott623... my original post says nothing about preemption, there is a lot of debate on the gun boards regarding a school being considered a local unit of government or not. My feeling is this would end that debate, that was my only point. As to a school being included in preemption I think we all know what the law says and I believe we all agree that schools should be included but that is another issue. Also there is no need to shout at me.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    I don't think scot623 shouted, but rather added emphasis. If not preemption, than for what purpose did you start this discussion?

    This way we can lead the discussion in that direction....
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    I don't think scot623 shouted, but rather added emphasis. If not preemption, than for what purpose did you start this discussion?

    This way we can lead the discussion in that direction....
    While I agree with you that he did not shout, I think he definitely came across as a j/a to the OP. I have seen that as typical from him as of late, and will be adding him to my ignore list, as I see little being added to the discussion from such attitudes.

    I also agree that the OP should add a little more detail to help guide the discussion as well. I will now go back to lurking.

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    Q, in light of all the issues and off topic threads and posts around here I was making an attempt to have a debate or discussion on an issue that I felt there was no clear answer on. Whenever someone asks about open carry at a school this issue comes up, and this is the first time I have actually seen any text confirming that a school is a local unit of government. The last word of my original post was "thoughts" and meant only that. I thought we could have a discussion and agree or disagree with the text I posted.

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    Regular Member HKcarrier's Avatar
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    Scot623 has been snippy at times with certain people, however, in this case I don't really see where he was here. Clear, concise, to the point... nothing wrong with that.
    When you put the gun in the holster, put the ego in the gun safe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HOWUDOINGOOD View Post
    Q, in light of all the issues and off topic threads and posts around here I was making an attempt to have a debate or discussion on an issue that I felt there was no clear answer on. Whenever someone asks about open carry at a school this issue comes up, and this is the first time I have actually seen any text confirming that a school is a local unit of government. The last word of my original post was "thoughts" and meant only that. I thought we could have a discussion and agree or disagree with the text I posted.
    In the context of carrying a firearm in a school, the only law that matters IS the preemption law. Sorry if you felt I was shouting at you, I was not. It's just that this gets brought up over over and over. MCL 123.1101 specifically defines what local unit of government means in regards to firearm carry and preemption. No other law matters.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    Quote Originally Posted by HOWUDOINGOOD View Post
    Q, in light of all the issues and off topic threads and posts around here I was making an attempt to have a debate or discussion on an issue that I felt there was no clear answer on. Whenever someone asks about open carry at a school this issue comes up, and this is the first time I have actually seen any text confirming that a school is a local unit of government. The last word of my original post was "thoughts" and meant only that. I thought we could have a discussion and agree or disagree with the text I posted.
    The CADL case we are fighting has the distinction that CADL was founded and got its Charter from a joint effort of the City of Lansing and Ingham County, two LUoG. A school district gets their charter directly from the state and has no ties to the city/township they happen to reside in.

    I hope this provides food for thought?
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletFactory View Post
    I thought he was being a jerk as well.
    You never did like him, did you Neil?
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  13. #13
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    this thread is not about open carry
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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    School district is a local unit of gov't ?

    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    this thread is not about open carry
    It appears to be about preemption, which is a component of OC.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  15. #15
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    i agree
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletFactory View Post
    I thought he was being a jerk as well.
    You're being a bit sensitive, Neil.
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    You never did like him, did you Neil?
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Bear View Post
    You're being a bit sensitive, Neil.
    I was thinking the same thing but I was hoping it wasnt true.

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    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDChilD View Post
    I was thinking the same thing but I was hoping it wasnt true.
    We all were
    If guns cause crime, all mine are defective- Ted Nugent

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